v1.16f: Issues? Bugs? This is the thread

[Conqueror]

Re: I wish all I could complain about is gameplay/AI

Originally posted by PN
...but since I installed the patch I have had 8 crashes, all with new games (not old save games). I had no crashes with the out of the box version.

On the last crash, the game gives me DataIO Operation System Error: RPLE errors and will not load my newest save games.

I've attached a listing from Norton CrashGuard which trapped all the crashes and logged them.

I'm running Win98SE UK
AMD K6-III 450MHz
128MB RAM
Matrox G400 16MB
Creative SB Live! Value
MS Intellipoint Mouse
Diamond Supra 56K modem
A-Open DVD-9632 (my install drive for the game)
Crative Blaster 1210e CD-RW

I have also logged this fault at Infogrames.

I think this could be an issue with SB live, because i am experiencing similar crashes and only thing i have common with your computer is SB Live!

And these crashes occur ONLY with the NEW patch. (have reinstalled whole civ3, doesnt help)

[SeanK]

Some things I've noticed:

1. The AI is ALOT more agressive. Perhaps too agressive? I do agree that it was a bit to passive before, though.

2. I get the lost lines in the Foreign Advisor screen.

3. Settlers no longer show where the city radius will be. Very annoying.

4. Units do the attack animation when they pillage. Don't know if it's intentional or a bug, but I don't like it.

I'm running Civ III on a vanilla HP laptop (530? 590? I bought it early this year) that uses Windows ME.

[aburtt]

The Great Lighthouse?????

Pre-patch I would build the Great Lighthouse and was able to travel out to sea. Now I build it and about 60% of the time the ship sinks!!!!! Why build it if your ships sink? Is this a bug or a new feature?

[Morbid]

Aburtt, this is from the patch readme:

* The Great Lighthouse no longer permits Galleys to travel on Ocean tiles.

Thats your answer. Personally I approve of this change, and it is one of the things I will miss the most if I go back to Civ III pre-patch (the other being the fixed air combat). That is if Firaxis would be so kind, PRETTY PLEASE , as to answer the question I asked on page 1 of this thread.

[PN]

Re: Re: I wish all I could complain about is gameplay/AI

Originally posted by Desert Dog


Just a little word on the "old" AMD processors. They are not 100% compatible as they were touted. The K-6 III has less problems true, but still not very stable. I owned one myself had many problems. (I build computers for a living in case you are wondering where I am coming from Good luck!)

Desert Dog

Thanks for the tip. I've had my PC for over 18 months now, always running Win 98SE. I can honestly say that this is the only software that has been so unstable in that time (and I am a games junkie, a developer and use my home PC for intensive spreadsheet work when my works-supplied laptop PC can't hack it).

For example, my Norton CrashGuard has logged 25 crashes since 18-October. 8 of those were Civ III yesterday, and 17 caused by an incompatibility between DirectX v8, my drivers, and an unofficially patched version of Rollercoaster Tycoon, so nothing attributable to the processor.

For what it's worth, I have done a complete Civ III/patch de-install and reinstall and it does seem more stable now. It tried very hard to crash at one stage when the diplomacy screen did not update properly and went very, very slowly after that, but recovered enough for me to save, reboot and restart.

Unfortunately after the reinstall, the previous corrupt save game files are still corrupt and the game reports a DatIO error.

[aburtt]

Then what is the point of the Great Lighthouse? The civlopedia still says that it allows you to travel on ocean squares. I am able to travel sometimes.

[Soren Johnson]

Originally posted by Morbid
The problem with techtrading AI, is not that it trades techs and contacts in a superfast way, nor that the AI start with more techs and get techs/contacts faster than the human player. You can call that cheating, but it is "fair" in the sense that at least they either start with the tech, trade the tech/contact fair and square with someone else, or acquire the tech/contact by exploring the map. Ognid and Player1, you do not mention the real problem, although you might mean it right.

The problem is that civ A can mysteriously "give" civ B a contact/tech, that the human player just gave civ A (through trading), before the human player hits "END TURN".

I realize that this might be a counter to the tech-whoring "strategy", but if it IS that, it is just too obvious a cheat by the AI. As I said I can live with the extra units, reduced costs and the prooduction bonuses. But what is the point of trading with civ A, if by that trade the score is like this:

You pay 1-2 techs and gold + get 1 tech
Civ A gets the 1-2 techs and gold from you, and pays one tech to you.
Civ B, C, D get the same tech that you get for free, the same second you finish the above deal.

I would never make that trade! It is that easy! Since now, I never know whether this is the possible scenario of ANY tech trade, why trade mid to cutting edge tech with anyone AT ALL?

If this really is an attempt to counter tech-whoring, then making the AI less tech/contact hungry (willing to pay less, especially gold per turn deals), and/or much more aggressive with the trading of techs/contacts (BUT IN THEIR OWN TURN!!) would be much better solution.

Still, PLEASE, I would like a response from Firaxis. It doesn´t have to be much. Just say that it was a design decision (meaning I go back to pre-patch), or that the game in its patched state, should not be doing this.

This looks like a bug to me... If you really can't enjoy the game with it, then I would recommend reverting to the original version. Needless to say, this will be fixed.

[XarXo]

GAME ERRORS

- The Audio options waste a lot of time and usually frozes my computer (WinME - 128 RAM - 30G HD - InMotherBoard Audio Device).
- When quitting, no progression bar to know if the computer freezes.
- In the foreign table, when a civ is destroyed nobody replaces the empty space (in games of more than 8 players).
- To know the info of a civ we must contact with it always (to see the bargain table), this (I believe) annoy him.

EDITOR ERRORS/BASIC SUGGERENCES:

Really needed:

- no-random starting points, or possibility to combine them with random and no-random.
- flat map supported.
- free size supported (ie: 40 x 300), editor doesn't allow non-quadratic shapes, and its maximum isn't based in the total squares, so the maximum in rows/cols is always 256.
- the editor always is "disabled" in a new scenario, for have the options turn on I have to open an older scenario and modify it (or probably I don't found how to activate it).
- icecap only in one pole supported.
- no nasty graphical errors near icecap.
- correct icecap execution.
- correct icecap in front of a land coast (ie.: Antarctica coast).
- minimap to navigate.
- CTRL+Z zoom in the editor.

Another great ones:

- dynamic knowledge table.
- doughtnout map supported.
- possibility to edit within the minimap.
- Minimap is resizable.
- climatic area supported (in a minimpa select all this is cold, so automatic snow mountains, icecaps, tundra...).
- multimapping supported.

[Morbid]

The Great Lighthouse still serves a purpose. You have always been able to go into ocean and sea squares with the galley. It is just pretty likely that you will lose any boat that ends its turn in a sea or ocean square.

The new Great Lighthouse still gives you access to the sea squares without risk, so you can still reach Islands and Civs that your rivals cannot. Heck you can even park your fleet in sea squares, and be certain that your rivals will have to risk losing their fleet if they want to attack you. Just make sure that they have to end the turn in a sea square if they want to attack you.

The principle benefit, IMHO, that came toning the Lighthouse Great is that you will not be able to discover the New World, if such a world exists in your game, in 100 AD, and enjoy exclusive trading of rescources, luxuries, maps, contacts and techs for a 1000 years or so. Allegedly, the Great Lighthouse served in guiding ships across the Mediterranean Sea from 280 BC, and not the Atlantic Ocean. Historically, if that can be called an valid argument in an abstracted gaming enviroment, the New World was discovered by the spaniards in 1492 AD using Caravels, and not by the egyptians in 280 BC via the Lighthouse.

[codemast01]

Originally posted by Whohangs
Well, I don't know what to do. I've downloaded the new patch a third time. I've uninstalled both the patch and then the main game. Reinstalled both and still have the same problem. If I run in Compatibility mode Win98/ME (the mode I ran in originally that worked without the patch) I get the locked up process. If I run in any other mode or without the Compatibility mode the screen goes into power saving mode. Is there a fix for this? A workaround? Is this being looked into? This is kinda bugging me. The game runs fine in compatibility mode Win98/ME without the patch. I'm running in Windows XP.

Add Refresh=60 to your civiliation3.ini file. If the problem still occurs try lowering the number. This solution is listed in the list of fixes for the patch under the additions section. (list of fixes can be found on on the official civ3 web page) Btw I run XP home edition and the same problem occurs when I try to run in Comp mode. Turn this off after doing the above.

As for the patch:
The good :
The addition of prefs to not see AI moves really speeds gameplay.
Workers staying on auto even when there is nothing to do also speeds up gameplay.
The issues :
I've noticed a worker irrigating any tile it moved to even when the tile is outside my border. Irrigating occurs instantaneously without the usual delay. Haven't found any others yet.

[pchang]

Foreign Advisor Screen

For me, the Foreign Advisor Screen no longer shows treaty/war/diplo agreements links between the pictures.

[Jaybe]

UnCultured AI cities

Could the AI routines be 'fixed' so they build some culture in their outer cities, regardless of whether culture is a priority with them? Just 1 culture would be fine -- just something so their borders expand. After all, 'more territory' would be a goal of everyone.

[Morbid]

Soren Johnson, thank you ever so much!!

I don´t know if this makes any sense, but those two lines of text in your reply made a WORLD of difference.

The frustration came from not KNOWING if it was a bug, not with the game itself. I really cannot connect with the style of using every possible exploit you can find, and then have the nerve to complain about the game being too easy and sloppy made. Of course, everyone is free to play the game that way, if they want to. After all they payed good $$$ for being able to do just that. I just think that it is a bad scene to to the community and the developers about the results of that specific style afterwards.

My rule of thumb is that if you would not play the move against a good friend, you shouldn´t play it against the AI. Thus, Palace bouncing, IFE, REX, ICS, training camps, combat settlers and their likes are not something that I enjoy or employ. With a mindset like that, the AI does a very nice job and presents me with plenty of challenges at Monarch, even though I have played the bejesus out of CIV I, CIV II, Colonization, SMAC and SMAX.

I will uninstall 1.16f and continue to have fun. I can easily wait for another patch. It will come when it is done.

And once again thanx for helping me to go from to .

[Ognid]

Morbid,


Yes, that is what I meant, but didn't express it clearly. I am going to reinstall the game without the patch. As it stands now every CIV in my game has the exact same tech advances as soon as they have contact. So if I trade a tech to one, they all will have it before my turn is over...

I think the AI doesn't differentiate between CIVs. I think the techs are just pooled along with communications. So if one AI gets a tech it is dropped into the AI pool and they all have it.

[Saint Marcus]

The AI doesn't understand the 512 city limit and will try to build a new city time after time after time after time after time, for over a 100 times per turn per settler, thus making the game unplayable.