ASK The CIV TEAM 8/22/01!

[Wittlich]

Ok, so the Military Academy and the Pentagon are both SMALL Wonders. That's nice to know.

When I first read MarkG's post I understood his statement as being : Military Academy-Small Wonder, Pentagon-Wonder (or Great Wonder, for lack of a better term). But after revisiting the CIV3 site and checking again, they are BOTH listed as Small Wonders.

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Colwyn
you only needed 1 or 2 8/12 stacks to walk right though another Civ.

not if the opponent had his cities well defended

[The_Aussie_Lurker]

HI Guys,

My biggest concern with armies are as follows:

1) Only 1 army/4 cities. This is way too few, and will be far too great a limitation on people who wish to take a military victory option. At the least, the limit should only apply to non-militaristic civs, and then only when they are not MOBILIZED for war (or at war)!
I agree with Marks assertion that armies aren't bad things that need to be limited!

2) Only 4 units/army?! Again my complaint about this one is the same as that for (1) in that it shouldn't be so limited (except when you are not mobilized for war!)
Basically mobilized or militaristic powers should always have fewer limitations on army sizes than peaceful civs (My personal opinion is 4-5 units/stack for non-mobilized civs and 8-9 units for Mobilized civs!)
At the end of the day the only things which should limit army sizes should be COST and happiness! If you lack the resources you can't pay the support costs of the units neccessary to form an army and, if your culture is not mobilized, already at war or militaristic, then having large numbers of units (stacked or not) are going to cause lots of unhappiness amongst your population (who feel the money could be better spent elsewhere!)
Another more realistic limitation on army numbers might be to have the support costs of the component units be a little higher, to reflect the added costs of infrastructure neccessary to co-ordinate your forces!

As for the pooling of hit-points, this sounds like a move away from the original "Mobile fortress" concept, which is good. They still haven't mentioned whether each unit in an army will have its own individual attack, or whether ranged units will get any bonuses when attacking melee units!

Anyway, just my 2 cents worth.

The_Aussie_Lurker.

[Wittlich]

So the maximum number of units you can have in a given army is three (3), or four (4) if you have built the Pentagon.

Once an army is built, you can load three units onto the army, and those units will pool their hit points during an attack. If you build the Pentagon (Small Wonder) you can load an additional unit into an army.

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Wittlich
So the maximum number of units you can have in a given army is three (3), or four (4) if you have built the Pentagon.

ooops, i have a news item to correct...


only 3?!?!?

[isaac brock]

this would be much easier if you took three minutes to read about the friggin game. the armies will attack starting off with the best attack unit. if that unit dies, the next unit fights. if necessary they fight to the death. same deal with defending armies.

[MarkG]

to whome was your most kind post directed at?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Ctp2 was the first to exploit their true potential

Someone has never played SMAC .

SMAC was the first game with advanced governors and build queues, since IIRC, it came out before CtP!

And pooling hitpoints seems be vastly different that one unit fighting against the other, issac.

[MarkG]

now that i think about it, pooling hitpoints sound nothing like the combined arms combat model of ctp2...

and since all units in an army will be attacking together(if i get it right), 3 sounds like a reasonable limit...

btw, how are leader represented? as a unit with not attack/defence?

[- Groucho -]

Yeah, Mark. Take some time to read about the game, man. Sheesh. Some people just come out of nowhere and act like they've actually dedicated a major portion of their lives to Civ. Who do you think you are anyway, Mark, like, one of the two guys who own Apolyton or somethin'?

[star mouse]

Originally posted by MarkG
now that i think about it, pooling hitpoints sound nothing like the combined arms combat model of ctp2...

and since all units in an army will be attacking together(if i get it right), 3 sounds like a reasonable limit...

Consider an ancient-era army with a catapult (6/1) and two Phalanx (1/2) stacked together. You would get an 8/5 unit before 3000 BC. Now imagine that army wandering the map terrorising cities at will.

Or how about two battleships stacked with an AEGIS cruiser?

[Zanzin]

MY question is does the great leader count as a unit in the Army, so you can have a total of 3 units per army (or 4 with the pentagon), or can you have the great leader + 3/4 units?

And, does the Military Academy allow you to create only one army? Or will it allow you to create as many armies as you like, depending on how many cities you have? (Up until Nationalism, ofcourse).

On top of that, can normal "non-army" units be stacked together and moved together, and fight against another stack of units - highest attack vs hightest defence and so on and so forth - as previously stated?


I like the music aspect, differnt styles for different cultures...again makes you feel as if your civ is actually different to the next one...sense of empire and all that. Good work

[Dan Magaha FIRAXIS]

Originally posted by MarkG
now that i think about it, pooling hitpoints sound nothing like the combined arms combat model of ctp2...

and since all units in an army will be attacking together(if i get it right), 3 sounds like a reasonable limit...

btw, how are leader represented? as a unit with not attack/defence?

Yes, IIRC they are like transports that can carry units, but have no inherent attack or defense.

Dan

[MarkG]

Originally posted by star mouse
Consider an ancient-era army with a catapult (6/1) and two Phalanx (1/2) stacked together. You would get an 8/5 unit before 3000 BC. Now imagine that army wandering the map terrorising cities at will.

Or how about two battleships stacked with an AEGIS cruiser?

i think i'll miss ctp1/2's battle screen....

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Zanzin
MY question is does the great leader count as a unit in the Army, so you can have a total of 3 units per army (or 4 with the pentagon), or can you have the great leader + 3/4 units?

as dan posted just now, leaders are like "transports" with attack/defence values

And, does the Military Academy allow you to create only one army? Or will it allow you to create as many armies as you like, depending on how many cities you have? (Up until Nationalism, ofcourse).

as many armies as you can(1/4 cities)

On top of that, can normal "non-army" units be stacked together and moved together, and fight against another stack of units - highest attack vs hightest defence and so on and so forth - as previously stated?

that is a good question, especially for the movement part