DIPLO: Glory of War contact LOG

[Cort Haus]

from MZ

Hey guys

For of all, I have been in a model UN for the past couple of days and have been caught rather unawares of the situation, it was only until two days ago when I checked my mail and got the save with the message that ND had taken out RP's cities on Legoland. Basically they don't want a "revived" RP and want to give that side to either Vox or you and were scared that the uranium on Legoland could eventually be used against them since it would be under RP or GS's possesion.

To be honest, GoW doesn't want war. Best case scenario is that it will end in a bloody stalemate with our possibilities of winning this game severly compromised. ND has also stated that they do not want war with us. So far in this game they have given us no reason not to trust them (I won't speak for their actions against other teams, but they've been quite honest with us at least).They also know our navy would totally trash their own and bomb the living crap out of their cities if we wanted to even if the rest of our empire should fall to an ND land assault. Thus, ND attacking us would lead to them losing this game due to our retaliation.

I just want to restate that as long as ND does not keep any permanent settlements on "your side" of Legoland, then we will stay out of the fight. And should war break out between you and ND, we will remain neutral. Nevertheless this turn we will move practically our entire army in Legoland back home just in case as well as divert our ships which were preveously hunting Lego to deploy closer to ND territory as a show of force.

I'd like to discuss this further with you guys but like I said I have hardly no time today, I'd like to hear your thoughts on the issue and what your probable response will be.

Cya,

-MZ

[Cort Haus]

to MZ

Hi MZ,

Thanks for your reply. The statement of neutrality implies that you do not have an MPP with ND that would come into effect if GS were to defend themselves against the ND aggression. This is good news.

ND's aggression against GS - first seizing our Uranium then attacking our holdings (under RP stewardship) - has effectively broken a trade treaty in a way that prevents GS from retaliating without being the in-game treaty breakers with associated penalties. It remains to be seen at this point whether ND will hand over the tech they owe us.

Without Uranium it is effectively game-over for GS, which tends to influence things towards the blaze-of-glory side of the options. To this end, we have no choice but to return to Lego and take back our side of it by force, even driving ND from that continent if necessary. Should that eventuality arise, what would GoW's position be on GS attacking ND on GoW's half of Lego? Seeing as ND have exploited the gift they recieved from GoW by treating it as a staging post to seize GS land on Lego, we could only hypothetically return those holdings to GoW under condition that they remain GoW cities and are not forwarded to ND.

On the eve of tactical nukes, Uranium becomes essential to offer a deterrent and keep the peace. Would GoW be in a position to trade Uranium to GS should ND not end its occupation of the GS source? On a related question, would GoW be able to trade any of the luxuries that GS would lose in a war with ND?

If ND were to eliminate RP, they would only need Lego's and Vox's vote to win. Hunting down that settler could still be critical.

If ND build Manhatten they also have a shot at victory. With our side of Legoland in ND's hands, ND is very close to dominination. All they need is to attack your side of Legoland, and possibly a few cities on Bob. With only a few nukes they can keep GoW from retaking the cities for one turn (which is all they need). Whether you nuke them or bomb them would make no difference anymore, as ND would have won.

If GoW could mediate a truce where we get our holdings back, together with compensation we would certainly consider it, but it seems that ND is determined to go to war.

We live in Interesting Times, as they say in, er, China

Regards,

-Cort

[Cort Haus]

from MZ

No, we do not have an MPP though technically the old "Bob is for Bobians" treaty is still in effect but of course that would not be invoked unless for example GS sneak attacked ND by invading them (Lego-style). If you start a war with ND on Legoland or at sea or whatever, that does not constitute a "threat to Bob" and thus we don't have to intervene.

Regarding treaties, to be honest, GoW doesn't really give a crap if GS or ND break treaties between each other. It's so late in the game that those issues are hardly of interest to us. If you attack ND or whatever, we won't hold it against you nor will we stop dealing with you or otherwise, in short, no diplomatic penalty. And I doubt Vox or RP would care either. For all I care, only treaties regarding ourselves actually concern us. ND broke a treaty by invading RP's holdings, GS breaking a treaty to counter that action isn't betrayal, it's payback.

Regarding luxes, we'll give you as many as you need (and Roleplay too). Uranium on the other hand is a more serious issue. Don't get me wrong but considering how close to endgame we are, giving out a resource which can be used to build a weapon that can wipe US out is not what I would consider a smart move. This also surprises me considerably. Why did you not build and keep a city around the Lego uranium when it was clearly on your side? If ND wanted to deny you resources they would have struck ALL RP/GS cities on Lego but they did not attack yours. And if uranium is the secret reason behind ND's attack (quite likely IMO) then it's unlikely they'll compromise with you or us for a peaceful solution.

I'm not so sure therefore how well mediation might work between us. What I did tell ND is that we do not look favorably to them keeping cities on GS's half after next turn since that would make US look bad because we made the treaty and allowing our client to violate it is akin to us violating it first hand. Have you guys talked to them at all?

Well, I will play the save later tonight or early tomorrow, like I said previously, we're moving back our offensive Lego army though we always retain the capability of moving 32 units to Lego in a turn. Likewise with Lego disbanding most of its units, we'll be moving as much as we can of our fleet closer to ND just in case.

In the meantime, whatever happens let's keep our "bilateral channels" open. And I repeat, if GS chooses to go to war with ND we'll just take some popcorn and enjoy the show.

-MZ

[Cort Haus]

to MZ

Hi MZ,

Regarding the luxuries, we thank you, and on the Uranium trade we understand your position.

Basically ND stole our Uranium the turn they got their cites and before we had a chance to settle the spot. They also owe us Rocketry, and have ignored all diplomatic requests to cease their trespass or explain their actions.

ND has a crossing to Lego that requires 1/3rd the Transports that ours requires. So with current Transport numbers they can put over 3 times the number of units on Lego that we can on any given turn. To offset this, we'd have to leave Stormia nearly empty, which is something we can't do. Hence our Uranium supply was always at the mercy of ND.

That's not to say we will abandon Lego to ND. We still consider that source of Uranium as in our territory. If ND wishes to force GS into irrelevancy, as it is doing, they will have to go through all of Stormia to do it. They saw some open cities and took them, saw an undefended Uranium source and took it, without considering that by doing so the only way GS can continue to be relevant in this game is to go through them now.

Regards,

-Cort

[Cort Haus]

from MZ

This is going to sound a bit strange...

ND sent us the save and told us if we could send you Rocketry
accepted. Seems their turn-player forgot to send it and apparently
they are concerned about not breaking treaties after all... who'd have thought

So, on ND's behalf, you know have Rocketry. Btw, what are you guys researching right now? Maybe we can trade something later on.

-MZ

[Cort Haus]

from MZ, with reply

Looking back on old PMs to purge I noticed that Computers was sold to us at 1560g. We had only sent you 1500g so we sent the 60g this turn.
I guess this should rank as longest delayed payment in PTWDG
history...

Btw, is it just me or is Togas taking this whole crisis a wee bit too personal?

-MZ

my reply ...

Thanks, MZ

Yes, Togas is a bit over-animated about this, but I doubt his unhappiness and frustration with the game will last much longer. With GS honour bound to damage and even destroy ourselves punishing ND for their aggression, GoW is in a good position to win - unless GoW helps ND quickly defeat GS, in which case ND can still win

[Cort Haus]

to MZ

Hi MZ,

We hope you are enjoying the show :-)

Are you interested in Miniaturization? In return we seek continued rubber supply, as ND has nicked ours, luxury support, and maybe some gold or part of the balance on a future tech trade. (Now that we have lost our own rubber, the one that you have been supplying us has re-appeared for now.)

Regards,

-Cort

[Cort Haus]

to MZ

Hi MZ,

Quick question - Is Space Flight a restricted technology for GoW (if you are researching it) or would you consider it tradeable?

-Cort

[Cort Haus]

two messages from MZ

That would depend on the team, we'd have to vote on it and knowing how paranoid the UnO crowd is, it's a long shot unless there's some sort of guarantee that no nukes are to be used against us.

On another subject, we noticed that ND took out Aurora Aequatoris last turn. Since it's unlikely GS will have a settlement there in the near future, we would like to build a city in that spot. In exchange, we would send you dyes at no cost. To be honest it's unlikely we'd build the city until 2-4 more turns since we don't have a settler to spare right now, but if you agree, we'd send you the dyes starting next turn anyway. Sound good?

-MZ

followed by

Oh oh, one more thing...

Hot_Enamel opened last turn's save and he actually found a way to kill off Lego without crashing the game. Last turn Vox accidentally sent us a 10gpt deal, I regected the deal then tried killing Lego, game crashed, replayed without touching Lego... all normal.

H_E, however, checked out the save, didn't know the Vox deal was a mistake and accepted it. And when he attacked the transport, the game didn't crash! I have no idea why this happened, he then tried not accepting the deal and predictably the game froze. I'm not sure Vox would knowingly consent to helping us wipe out Lego but I have a feeling you guys would so if you want to try this out, send us a 10gpt deal which we'll accept, we kill Lego and then we'll try and cancel the deal, if this is not possible without going to war then we'll counter with a 10gpt deal of our own.

Other than this I see no other way of getting rid of them. :/

-MZ

[Aeson]

Sent to MZ's email since his PM box is full.

Hi MZ,

We have sent the 10gpt to hopefully get around the Lego crash. Also enclosed is 180g to forward to ND.

The exchange of the AA site for Dyes is acceptable to us.

We would be willing to agree not to use Nukes against GoW if it is reciprocated.

- Aeson

[Cort Haus]

from MZ

This is beginning to look like a bad James Bond movie.

Last turn we received a PM from Vox saying that Vox had landed in their territory. That was on the same turn we asked you guys to do the gpt trick to see if one of our ships could kill them off. Alas we could not kill Lego because they had crossed inside the strait and to top it off Vox placed a destroyer right in the way (see the pic). I didn't really want to pressure Vox since I suspected that they might have done it on purpose to protect them and also as to alert them that we have a sub there (which was planning to cross inside Voxian territory to sink the Lego ship). I have offered Vox help and will probably send some tanks to Legoland this coming turn just in case Lego wants to do something funny. I also asked Vox if they would be willing to have us send troops to their territory so we can kill off Lego once and for all (I assume that WW still is hitting you, ours is not critical but it has hurt a wee bit).

Also I did not get a reply on the Aurora Aequatoris deal. You guys sent us 180g the other turn but I have no clue what that was for so I sent it back.

So, let's hope that Lego is terminated this turn or the next. Amazing what one measly pain-in-the-ass transport can do. I mean, if they had landed in GoWian Lego they might have even captured a city... that would be humilliating, first city we'd lose to another civ against someone who doesn't even HAVE a city hahaha.

Cheers,
-MZ

my reply

Sorry, I had been negligent, and Aeson sent this to your email (PM Box full), though perhaps not to a preferred email. I'll advise of the g-mail address for future.

Hi MZ,

We have sent the 10gpt to hopefully get around the Lego crash. Also enclosed is 180g to forward to ND.

The exchange of the AA site for Dyes is acceptable to us.

We would be willing to agree not to use Nukes against GoW if it is reciprocated.

- Aeson

MZ's preferred email - raguil {AT} gmail {DOT} com

[Cort Haus]

screenshot from MZ:

[Cort Haus]

from MZ

Yeah sorry about the PM box. I have so many PMs that date well before the Lego war and I want to keep them for a post-game archive one day.