Turn 2

[Arrian]

NYE - I had thought of that, actually. You made one?

We have very limited info, though. By the time the 1st forest chop is done, we will have 2 warriors. One will have already been dispatched (north) and the other will have been completed. Meanwhile, we still have 4 turns to irrigate and road the tile. During that time, our exploring warriors will uncover the surrounding terrain and give us a good idea of whether we should move in a generally northward direction with the worker (as alexman has proposed) or toward the south (my original plan). The reasoning, of course, is that if we want to dispatch a settler to the north, we want the worker to be up there working on the floodplains and in a position to build a road to the new city and help it get up and running.

The barracks plan is solid, and I will say that I'm not big on early temples in the capitol (I'm very big on them elsewhere to get the borders expanded for full use of the tiles in the city radius), so maybe his plan is better.

-Arrian

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Arrian
NYE - I had thought of that, actually. You made one?

Yes. I can do all this work with pen and paper, or use the scenario as a 'calculator'. I prefer to use the calculator, and move through more possibilities quickly.

Let me know if you want me to email it to you.

[alva]

Hmm, Arrian,

Why go south???
IMHO we are near the edge of the continent, both south and east.I don't think we are going to find annyone there.

Wouldn't it be better to go north /west???

[notyoueither]

I'd say the first warrior would want to move to that mountain, and then straight north before looping back to the east above the capitol.

Second warrior can move out to the east, then south and bend back to the west below the capitol.

Yin and Yang... quickest way to tell us the environment immediately around the capitol.

[Arrian]

Warrior #1 should definitely go north. I was just thinking of sending the second one either to the mountain in the SW or down the river to the East/Southeast (there is this little voice in the back of my mind asking over and over: "will we have a Colossus city?").

NYE - sure, email it to mishlea@msn.com

-Arrian

[Arrian]

I've been giving this some more thought (hey, it's a monday after a long weekend, and those SUCK) and I do think alexman's barracks proposal is best. We have a high-trade starting spot, so the 1gpt upkeep for the barracks is no big deal, and we will have no need for happiness help for some time.

there is no extra benefit in the fur+river tiles in Despotism.

I just noticed this. You sure? Furs produce what, 1 trade w/o any improvement? Add the river bonus, and that's 2. So the +1 from the road would get eaten by despotism? If so, yeah, don't road the fur tile that our worker is on. But the second tile you propose to chop & irrigate is a normal forest/plains tile, right? So that one should get roaded before moving on to the floodplain. I need to look at the screenshot again.

I still think we should research BW first, btw.

-Arrian

[alexman]

Yes, furs give +1 shield, +1 trade. The second tile to clear is also a furs tile. Even so, we might to consider roading that one for the movement bonus.

PS: Not that it matters any more, but I just realized that it was probably a mistake to move the settler away from our starting position.

We would have had an extra shield from the center tile if we had settled there, not to mention an extra turn of production and instant happiness...

[Arrian]

Would we have had an extra shield from that? I've tried that and I recall still getting only 2f/1s from the city tile.

Anyway, I should have paid more attention to the screenshot. My second turn listing (T11 - T32) is off, because the second tile is indeed a fur tile too, which will produce 2 shields, not 1, so production will be a bit faster.

Who knows, maybe when our borders expand we will have wheat on floodplain to the NW. Those two tiles we can't see are surely floodplain. It doesn't look like we will have any bonus grassland, but the fur compensates.

-Arrian

[alexman]

Originally posted by Arrian
Would we have had an extra shield from that? I've tried that and I recall still getting only 2f/1s from the city tile.

Yes, the center tile for cities under size 7 gives the shields of the base tile, with a minimum of 1. It also gives the trade of the base tile, but the capital gives 3 trade minimum so it wouldn't have made a difference there.

Anyway, I think we have a flexible plan until our Warriors uncover the full city radius. The only thing we need to settle for sure is the first tech to research.

Bronze Working: The safe choice. Can start building veteran spearmen immediately.

Wheel: Might uncover horses in radius, which give extra trade. For sure not already known by still unmet neighbors. Can start producing veteran WC very soon.

[Arrian]

Oh, I see. Doh! What's done is done, though.

I just posted my thoughts on early research in the... early research thread (imagine that). Like I said above, I prefer BW first.

-Arrian

[Arrian]

Revised plan (edit: alexman caught something):

T2: build city, begin chop, allocate citizen to forest fur, build warrior.
T3: 1f, 3s
T4: 2f, 6s
T5: 3f, 9s, switch citizen to grassland tile.
T6: 5f, warrior complete, build another.
T7: chopping done, warrior complete, begin irrigation. 7f, begin warrior. (stick with grassland until irrigation done)
T8: 9f, 1s.
T9: Irrigation done, move worker to 2nd fur tile. Switch citizen to irrigated fur. 11, 2s.
T10: 13f, 5s, begin chop.
T11: 15f, 8s
T12: 17f, warrior done, start barracks.
T13: 19f, 3s
T14: Grow to size 2. 1f, 6s. Use grassland w/second citizen until irrigation complete.
T15: Chopping complete, 3f, 19s. Begin irrigation.
T16: 5f, 22s.
T17: Irrigation done, switch citizen, move worker to fp. 7f, 25s.
T18: 9f, 30s. Begin irrigation.
T19: 11f, 35s.
T20: 13f, barracks done. Order settler. Irrigation done, move 1 citizen to fp. start road.
T21: 16f, 3s, move citizen back to 2nd irrigated fur.
T22: 18f, 8s. road done, move to next fp.
T23: Size 3, 0f, 14s. Allocate new cit to fp. Begin irrigation.
T24: 3f, 19s.
T25: 6f, 24s. irrigation done, begin road.
T26: 9f, 29s. Move another cit to fp.
T27: 13f, settler complete. Size 1. Use floodplain. Order spearman (hey, I can dream, right?). Road done, move worker to fur on forest to east.
T28: 16f, 1s. begin chop
T29: 19f, 2s.
T30: Size 2, both on fp. 2f, 3s.
T31: 6f, 4s.
T32: 10f, 5s.
T33: Chop done. 14f, 16s. Move both cits to irrigation fur tiles. Begin road.
T34: 16f, spear done. Order settler.

That's pretty efficient. If no BW, no biggie, the last chopping bit can be removed in favor of building one more road to the next city site.

-Arrian

[alexman]

Originally posted by Arrian
T8: 9f, 1s, irrigation done, switch citizen, move worker

One little nitpicking detail: Irrigation takes two turns. You can still switch the citizen after one turn (because the irrigation will be complete at the start of the second turn) but you can't move the worker until the second turn.

[Arrian]

Ah, good catch. I know it takes two turns, I just screwed up. Thanks, I'll fix it. Edit: fixed, I think. I may be wasting one turn by having a citizen on the grassland for 1 turn too many, but otherwise it should be right now. I think NYE has got the right idea: test this via the editor.

-Arrian

[Theseus]

WOW!!!

You guys need medical attention, stat!

Seriously, great thinking...

I agree, btw, that the Settler move was unnecessary (even at 2f/1s).

Also, we clearly DO NOT need a Temple.

Warrior moves: North and to the mountain.

Great job guys.

[Dominae]

Originally posted by Arrian
and I will say that I'm not big on early temples in the capitol (I'm very big on them elsewhere to get the borders expanded for full use of the tiles in the city radius)

Assuming we're planning to use very tight city spacing (2 tile separation is it?), expanding borders won't be that useful for our core cities. Just thought I'd point that out...


Dominae