GoW - Diplomacy Comments #3

[Theseus]

Originally posted by Aeson
The problem here is what constitues "defensive" (Artillery+MI are pretty strong offensive units when massed) and that there is no economical way to determine if it is being upheld.

Regarding 'defensive' troops on Lego...

On the one hand, my mind immediately goes to an evil plan to take advantage (e.g., MIs and Radar Artillery supported by Nukes, Stealth Bombers, etc.).

But then, I don;t think there is an endgame scenario where Lego matters all that much. Bob is where the action will be.

[Cort Haus]

Theoretically, 'weapons inspectors' (Trip) could determine troop numbers in an ND holding, but what those numbers could be is another matter.

[Jon Shafer]

I'm afraid that with my official role it wouldn't be appropriate for me to play any active part in the game - if you want a weapons inspector then you'll have to find him among the ranks of the game.

[Aeson]

Yah, Trip needs to stay uninvolved... besides, he's probably bored now that the Lego warfare is mostly concluded and would start giving misinformation to spice the view back up a bit.

[Cort Haus]

OK, second draft, updated a bit ...

The described split sounds OK to us - though as we'd like a city on the rubber could we trade a few tiles in this area for some others elsewhere?

If GoW wishes to offer ND cities on Lego in GoW's half, that is your choice. It is a big gift, for a nation who has won most from their neutrality instead of their involvement in the Lego war. If ND were to gain land from the pie, we'd argue that RP should too.

For Vox - we are not quite sure yet. We'll get back back on this.

Beyond Lego, GS are looking forward to continuing the good relations established between our teams over the last several months into the future. We hope GoW feels the same.

(btw/fyi - I understand the outstanding balance on Computers to be 1070g.)

[Aeson]

The second paragraph is unnecessary IMO. Just agree that each team is free to give their land to whom they wish. They've already proposed this, and proposing the same thing back to them sounds bad.

I think we should simpy agree with the Vox proposition. We wanted to use the land to help leverage a trade for their free tech if necessary, and now we have the free tech. I don't see any point in making a fuss about it now. Remember that this would be a harbor on "GoW's side" of the water, which could be a very big deal to them, just as it would be a big deal to us if the Hammer and Isthmus were reversed.

[DeepO]

second paragraph: I agree it doesn't sound perfectly right. We only want to say one thing: they can do what they want with their land, as we will in giving ground to RP. We don't mind ND coming over, as it doesn't matter to us. Now, it sounds like we do mind, but try to force the decision on them.

Vox: I do not mind the land gift, I do mind that it sounds like GoW's idea. I would like it better if e.g. we both agree on a number of tiles both teams give to Vox. GoW gives tiles on the hammer, we give tiles on the isthmus. If we jointly give tiles to Vox, and GoW has a better relation with them, they will sell it as their gift, and not our gift.
So please, can we somehow communicate to Vox that we do want to give them land as recognition of their free tech, and hence give them the Isthmus? It will make a serious difference over this proposal.

DeepO

[Cort Haus]

Good feedback guys . I'll re-draft within a couple of hours. There's some cricket highlights of S.Africa vs England I can't miss. (Excuse me for being English - but cricket is the one thing Britain undisputably did for the empire - or at least, parts of it It also bewilders the f*uck out of everyone else ).

[Cort Haus]

third draft ...

Thank you for Spinebreaker.

The described split sounds fine to us - though as we'd like a city on the rubber, could we trade a few tiles in this area for some others elsewhere?

We agree that each team is free to give land from its portion as they see fit. For Vox, we can each offer them an equivalent slice, and the Hammer and Isthmus seem to be appropriate gifts from each of us respectively.

Beyond Lego, GS are looking forward to continuing the good relations established between our teams over the last several months into the future. We hope GoW feels the same.

(btw/fyi - I understand the outstanding balance on Computers to be 1070g.)

Regards etc,

[Cort Haus]

According to MZ (see GoW log) ND fancy a shot at a diplo win. They have Lego's vote, but MZ reckons GoW have Vox's vote.

GS have 2 votes too, but unless we build it our pop & territory may be insufficient for us to figure.

[vmxa1]

That is a big gamble for ND to take. What if we decide to vote for GOW? I really do not see ND trying for a vote, unless they have GoW voting for them.

In fact if ND did have Vox's vote, there could be a stalemate and no need to even build the UN, unless one more civ goes out.

Not to mention that ND cannot be sure Lego will be around to vote. One of us may find those transports before the UN is built.

[DeepO]

CH, a bit unfortunate that you mentioned marines to MZ. I'm sure it won't matter much, but it proves to him that we have been planting additional spies, at least one of them with ND.

Similarly, I'm only half believing his comment on that we 'must have plenty of MI'. No doubt, they have tried to plant a spy with us as well.

As to UN: RP can easily be conquered in 1 turn. Which leaves 5 teams, 3 of which able to UN win. If ND is only considering it as GoW claims, they must have some kind of deal in place with Vox.

OTOH, it could be a ruse to make us built the UN, and 'lose' 1000 shields on it.

GoW thinking they have Vox' vote makes my comments on the split even stronger. The only reason why Vox would vote for GoW, is the extra land they were given. If MZ makes the announcement, but gives it before the rest of the land is divided, he wins diplomatically...

In all, I would really want a screenshot from MZ, with whatever he proposes as division. And I would like it before we play our next turn, this has been going on for long enough. Stop the ambiguity!

BTW: If ND builds the UN, we would be the last to know if they call a vote, which leaves us no room at all for last minute negotiations. Not so good. In case a vote is asked, we would be best to side with GoW, and either let them vote for us, or we vote for them.

DeepO

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by DeepO
As to UN: RP can easily be conquered in 1 turn. Which leaves 5 teams, 3 of which able to UN win. If ND is only considering it as GoW claims, they must have some kind of deal in place with Vox.

This is why I had menioned that RP could take a settler and park in our land.

We should go ahead and take the land as was suggested if we do not get a final out line from MZ. There is no reason for this to go any further, we have agree in principal.

Since you are good with painting maps, why not just send him what you percieve to be the deal. Sending it as a this is the deal you asked for and so we accept and will go ahead with it?

[DeepO]

CH already asked for a map (thx, BTW), and MZ said before he wanted to give it. I must say I'm a bit confused on what exactly is intended... if he says he doesn't have time, I'll get on it.

DeepO

[DeepO]

BTW, we can control the UN problem, by going after Lego. We are already doing that... but we could be helped if GoW would also consider diverting forces for the hunt for the last settlers. This might also be a message to MZ: "we are trying to get the last Lego ships, could you keep our alliance alive by doing the same? At least that's one less UN vote ND is going to have"

Apart from the UN problem, it also keeps a couple of GoW ships out of position, and as far from our coasts as possible... which can't be bad in any case.

DeepO