Turn 179 : 640AD

[DeepO]

BTW, something strange perhaps: We know Lego is about to finish Smith's, possibly next turn (otherwise it's in 2 turns, in which case they would have changed next turn and not this). Then why is GoW asking for econ? That's another totally useless tech, at least once Smith's is built...

DeepO

[asleepathewheel]

Oh I agree, I was just throwing it out there.


One point-

After marines, we pull everything to the cities except for mountain guards. The enemy then can either land and absorb a round of fire or attack a city with marines. If they just land on flat land, cavs would be better than guerillas for attacking them, due to the retreat/return to city to heal/re-garrison. Any landing might be a ruse, to pull from cities, so getting cavs back could help.

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by DeepO
BTW, something strange perhaps: We know Lego is about to finish Smith's, possibly next turn (otherwise it's in 2 turns, in which case they would have changed next turn and not this). Then why is GoW asking for econ? That's another totally useless tech, at least once Smith's is built...

DeepO

bizarro, eh? maybe they want to run some cities on wealth

[vulture]

We ought to get going with a study of combat effectiveness. For a given number of shields, what balance of cavalry (retreat, lower killing power), guerillas (cheaper, slightly better killing power) and artillery (if we get rubber) works best against invading stacks of infantry (and other attackers?) What are the costs for various units? IIRC arty and cavalry are both 70. What about guerillas? Infantry are 80, aren't they?

[DeepO]

maybe we should move this discussion to the spartan thread... I'll start

DeepO

[Cort Haus]

We shouldn't forget the retreat ability of Cavalry, though. That gives them an edge over Guerillas in counter attack - and RR or not, we might be counter attacking over Stormian territory outside our cultural borders.

Having said that, I don't think we should be spending on Mil Trad now, with no attack on Lego or Stormia pending.

The logical extension of a no-horse approach would be to melt down some surplus knights, as we did with the boats. I feel it's too early to discard them, though.

[DeepO]

Originally posted by Cort Haus
The logical extension of a no-horse approach would be to melt down some surplus knights, as we did with the boats. I feel it's too early to discard them, though.

It would certainly be too early for that. However, I wouldn't mind taking some of that excess forces off our loan list. In which case not the knights, but the WCs should go. They will cost most to upgrade, and are thus the most obsolete units we have... even a warrior might proof more useful as a guerilla.

Don't disband all of them at once, though. We might need a few for easy filling of sea wall holes. But if we can gain another 10 gpt, why wait? If it is absolutely certain we will not join any Lego invasion adventure, they can go.

DeepO

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by vulture
ND got back to me on Friday to say that our offer on Physics was too high. I would have posted here before, but Thursday night my house was broken into and my laptop was stolen, so this is the first time I've been able to check in since then.

Do we go back to 600 gold, or go with some other plan?

Sh*t - sorry to hear about the break-in. I hope things are OK.


There are (at least) 2 methods of tech pricing. One is the gold equivalent of the current beaker price - or the opportunity cost. This profits the vendor, and is similar to tech pricing in Single Player. Another is the shared cost between 2 allies, where both parties split the profits.

ND's price is right for the second method. As we are entering a tech alliance with them, the full business rate may not be appropriate, and their offer might be fair.

OTOH, our tech deals with GoW have seen them paying full market price on the undepreciated beaker difference.

Would it be possible to convey to ND that as tech allies, rather than open market traders, we are reconsidering their offer - that'd be good diplomatically. If it's also possible to explain the difference in pricing approach (maybe just use the English, if translation is awkward) that could ease fears they might have that we were driving too hard a bargain.

There's more to this, though, as Deepo's suggested deal structure - including ToG and Coal warrants discussion...

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by vulture
artillery (if we get rubber)

Beautiful Artillery doesn't need rubber!

[asleepathewheel]

man vulture, i glossed over your post and totally missed that you had a break in. that sucks. I've never had my house broken into, but i have had my car broken into several times (ripping out my in-dash cd player once and nearly a 2nd time, cops showed up) scary stuff. did you have insurance on the laptop? This reminds me that i've been forgetting to get renter's insurance for my townhouse.

hope you're doing ok bud.

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by DeepO
BTW, something strange perhaps: We know Lego is about to finish Smith's, possibly next turn (otherwise it's in 2 turns, in which case they would have changed next turn and not this). Then why is GoW asking for econ? That's another totally useless tech, at least once Smith's is built...

DeepO

GoW hadn't seen the Smiths switch when they mentioned that. They were a bit hazy on mandatory and pre-requisite techs in the chat, though. Perhaps they're not planning quite as keenly as they did to get Leo's.

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by DeepO
What about these two proposal to ND and GoW:

GoW:
ToG next turn in exchange for
- the medicine - steam swap in less than 11 turns from now (and I don't mind telling them we're going for ToE and we need them to block Lego, we're at a very tight schedule)
- coal for 20 turns in case we don't have it in our territory, and they have 2 sources or more. In which case we'll transfer steam up front (before Medicine). Deal can start at our request, and needs to be started within 21 turns after receiving steam or is the promise is declared void.

ND:
Physics and ToG next turn, for:
- 600 gold
- 2 lux for 20 turns
- Coal for 20 turns in case we have none, and they have 2 sources or more.

I think they might go for that, it's not a bad deal for them.

Further: we might want to tell GoW and ND that our analysis shows it is likely Lego is capable of a sea wall of their own...

DeepO

Interesting...

I think these look very attractive deals for GoW and ND. They pay cost-free assets for our produced assets. Slightly too attractive, perhaps - might we be selling ourselves a little short - or are we just betting on not having coal? If we have coal, then GoW get a tech for free, and ND get a tech for 2 lux.

Thing is, I don't know what the value of coal is. Priceless, maybe, in a game like this. Lux trades have all been one-for-one, so I don't know the cash value of them either.

Wheras I get the feeling that GoW are currently seeing the game as we do, geo-strategically, I wonder sometimes whether ND have other ideas. Maybe they fancy their chances of taking Bob, then Stormia, then just enough of Lego to get a domination before Lego build their SS. They might be planning on nuking a developed SS bid. OTOH, they would surely expect Lego to do something before then.

[Theseus]

vulture - Sucks about the break-in.

A bit of humor for everyone:

The one and only break-in I've ever had was in my last apt. About 2am, I heard some glass breaking upstairs in my then duplex. I figured a cat had knocked something over, so I started lumbering upstairs to see what it was, yelling at the cats. As my head breached the level of the top floor, I looked over to see this Asian dude trying to collect up a blanket on which he had spread out some family silver, small electronics, etc. I bellowed and started charging... he slipped by me and bolted out the front door (with nothing). I started chasing him, and...

Remembered that I had been sleeping in the buff.

[asleepathewheel]

[Theseus]

Yeah, well, humor or... dread.