War Academy: Strategies for Case Pink

[Harovan]

Here's the first discussion for our War Academy. The subject is our approach in Case Pink, the upcoming war with France. There are the following questions:

1) What are our objectives?
2) Should we send our soldiers scouting before they attack?
3) In what order shall we attack the French cities?
4) At what point shall we declare war?
5) What should our cities build after the strike force leaves?

Discuss!

Edited to add the link.

[Harovan]

My proposed approach is:

1) We should capture the French capital. It's usually the only city to capture, because the others have no culture to expand and the AI will poprush units, so they most likely will be size 1 and autorazed. We should take the capital, raze 1 more city and try to make peace for 2-3 techs and 1 more city. This will leave the French with about 2 cities. Vassalized, that's enough, case closed.

2) Yes, the archers should scout, but carefully. We do not want to delay the attack, because 2-3 archers have gone too far. The 2 spearmen shall stay home till the army is complete, as 2nd garrison, to ensure a size-3 production.

3) We should attack Paris first. If forces remain, leave 1 spearman and 1 archer in Paris, and turn the rest to the new city the French are about to build now (we've seen the settler). Raze this city. Make peace immediately.

4) We declare war, before we cross their borders. No need to take diplomatic penalties at this point. The French borders will expand again at 1500BC. This makes, that we'll have at least 2 turns to go inside their borders. We shall not attack from different directions, but keep one stack, and make sure our spears can protect the archers in counterattacks during this time. While it may be tempting to take sidesteps to capture workers, don't. They will flee in the city and we'll take them with the city, in due time.

5) Be careful, as the cities will revolt, because we take away 1 police unit (the spearman). Make 1 entertainer or other specialist, depending on size. Prebuild 10 shields and then poprush a temple. This should lower the production to size 2. Build a settler then. Be aware to switch it to archer, if enemy warriors are spotted.

[civman2000]

DOes just declaring war not hurt your reputation? I know that going into the diplomacy screen, removing the peace treaty, and saying never mind doesnt, but does a normal declaration of war not either?

[Kuciwalker]

No, I'm pretty sure it doesn't do anything. Ask uber. He would know .

[Guardian]

To the best of my knowledge, declaring war does not hurt your reputation as long as you do not violate any treaties.

In other words, if you have any kind of lasting agreement with your intended victim, such as a Military Alliance, Mutual Protection Pact, Right of Passage, or just a simple trade agreement, then you will hurt your reputation by declaring war unless you wait for the agreement to expire first. Otherwise no.

However, this does not necessarily mean that nobody's going to get mad...

(If civs A and B both have a strong friendship and trade with civ C and you attack civ C, then this could also harm your relations to A and B...)

[civman2000]

1) What are our objectives?
2) Should we send our soldiers scouting before they attack?
3) In what order shall we attack the French cities?
4) At what point shall we declare war?
5) What should our cities build after the strike force leaves?

1. Paris, and if there's a city near the mountains with iron or any city with horses those too.
2. A couple. Barbarians could be trouble for our warriors in the jungle or out of it at this level (they're stronger at higher levels right?), so it would be nice to have 1 or 2 warriors out there.
3. Not sure. If we take the capital, raze another (like you proposed) will they then give us a city right next to us in the treaty? I'm not sure, but I bet that by then there will be a city in the jungle pretty near us. If we do't think we can get it in the treaty, attack it first, otherwise Ralph's plan modified to put resource cities also as top priorities is the way to go.
4. As soon as we get our troops one square outside their borders and about to attack.
5. ROtate temples between the 4 cities (iirc). First do the ones that'll be in most happiness trouble, then the next two, with the others building military during htis.

[civman2000]

I'm pretty sure that attacking without declaring war also hurts it.

[Guardian]

Originally posted by civman2000
I'm pretty sure that attacking without declaring war also hurts it.

Ah, yes. Could very well be.

The allies were outraged when the Germans did that...

[Vlad Antlerkov]

Re: War Academy: Strategies for Case Pink

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
1) What are our objectives?
2) Should we send our soldiers scouting before they attack?
3) In what order shall we attack the French cities?
4) At what point shall we declare war?
5) What should our cities build after the strike force leaves?

1) Deliver a knockout blow to the Frenchies by taking Paris as soon as we can.

2) Send the early archers out scouting, but not too far. We don't want to delay our invasion too much.

3) Paris, then any mountain cities. Wouldn't hurt to leave a few cities alive-- leave the French bastardized/vassalized (whichever term you prefer). If all goes well, we'll be in a position to dictate the terms of the peace.

4) Once we have our army ready and on their borders.

5) Temples and other cultural improvements. (Or maybe we could rotate temple production while building soldiers, as Civman proposed.)

[UnOrthOdOx]

Just a question as you guys seem better at the math than I.

The way I see it, there is a good chance that France could have swordsman by the time we attack. Will we still be able to take two cities? And should we pillage roads to help prevent their advance?

[Harovan]

There is a chance to face swordsmen. But it is not very high. The AI emphasizes settler production between 2000BC and 1000BC and doesn't pay much attention to offensive units, especially the "peaceful" French. Also, they shall have iron and have it connected, another thing they don't emphasize their early effort to. So unless the iron is right "below" a city or very close, the chance of facing swords is low.

[UnOrthOdOx]

I see, you understand the AI much more than I...

I did join mostly to learn.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by UnOrthOdOx
I did join mostly to learn.

To learn from each other is one of the goals of our Academy. Thanks for raising interesting questions. Keep it up!

[UnOrthOdOx]

ok, another question. I have not played a huge map before, but I have played emperor (but usually monarch), how likely is it that there is another civ to the NE? This could become troublesome if it is a more...aggressive civ.

[Kuciwalker]

Declare war first and your reputation isn't hurt. It's only surprise attacks that hurt. Note that declaring war might still make other people mad at you, but your reputation will be fine.