Expansion Pack Civs (Part 3): Just one more...

[Mankind]

modem connections in Poland can be very slow at times

yes this is unfortunetly true

the good about it is i changed my provider yesterday and don't have dial up


1. o and we're making votes and DaGame is not even realesed
2. ...but its ok they probobly realese it [expansion pack]
not to say quick .....not slow?
they want $ and we want the game

but this been off topic again

[Chris 62]

Not bothering to read the whole thread, too damn much there.

1.Spain (20) Glaring omission, only a misinformed fool would think differently
2.Mongols (20) See above
3.Sumerians (20) Babylon comes milliena after them, they are not the same. This was where civilization was born.
4.Ethiopia (20) True civilization of Black Africa, unlike the historically insignificant Zulus
5.Inca (20) Largest empire in the America before the coming of Spain
6.Goths (20) Representing all the Germanic tribes that crushed the Roman empire (Huns, Visigoths, Vandals, Franks ECT)
7.Holy Roman Empire (20) From Chalemagne to Franz II, one of the largest and most influencial political units in European history
8. Scandanavia (20) Representing Vikings, Danes, Swedes, Finns, Norwegans, ECT. They really founded the great cities of Russia, and deserve their do.

[Mankind]

I know it is not on topic again but...
Chris62 large number of posts but ... maybe read it? the hole "polen thingy" maybe you will be lol-ing trust me -I don't planned to read the hole thread too

[Locutus]

LoD,
Thanks for the translation, I guess that's okay then. Actually, it was that line combined with the fact that an awful lot of these Polish posters voted "Poles 20", nothing more, nothing less. I still think it's odd but there's certainly nothing illegitimate or about it.

Don't worry Gramphos, even if someone would vote twice with 100 posts between it I would still spot it, I check all usernames. DLs and namechanges are the only things I can think of that might allow someone to vote several times...

BTW, when I come back from my little trip next week I'll post the first expansion pack 'Civs of the week' (Spanish and Mongol) as well, with a short history of those civs and some other info that might be useful for Firaxis. They're already done (or at least to such an extend that they can be posted) but I think it might be useful if I'm actually present when these things are discussed and need to be defended or corrected or whatever

[LoD]

Glad to have the matter resolved .

(edit): Oh, and have a pleasing trip Locutus!

[Gramphos]

Okay, I overreacted. I've done that sort of thing also (hit back-button right after I clicked the post reply) Now I've eaten som food and I realize what a monster I was . I know that Locutus keeps good trac on everything. He must have som database of some sort.

[color={qcolor}]Epansion pack 'Civs of the Week'[/color] - COOL!

[Locutus]

Originally posted by Gramphos
He must have som database of some sort.

Actually, a whole set of databases: a text file to keep track of all the votes and updates, a file to store a copy of my first post (in case the thread gets messed up again) and some other important misc info (such as statistics), a html file to get the layout part correct, a script file to automatically do most of the layouting, an excel file to do the calculations... I would be lost without all those

Thanks LoD, I'm sure I will, I understand Berlin is lovely this time of the year (if weather permits)...

[Lumpkin]

Enigma outrage

Here's what Microsoft Encarta has to say on the subject:

Enigma Code, device, developed by the German military intelligence, whereby information could be electromagnetically encrypted. The Enigma machine, as it was known, was commercially available in Europe during the 1920s. German military intelligence developed the machine from 1926; by increasing the possible number of settings on the machine's revolving wheels, a virtually unbreakable code was created. Germany used the Enigma code to coordinate strategy during World War II and the possible 150 million variations led British intelligence, in 1939, to set up the top-secret "Ultra" project, devoted to breaking the code. A team of mathematicians and cryptographers, led by William Winterbotham of MI6, cracked the ciphers and at the height of the war the Allies were intercepting and deciphering 2,000 German signals daily. Even so, Ultra's work remained frantic because the Germans continued to change the settings of their Enigma machine wheels, often every 24 hours. Still, Germany's belief in the code's infallibility enabled the Allies to intercept information which was crucial to the success of the Allied landing in the Normandy campaign.

Source: http://encarta.msn.co.uk/find/Concis...27c69e766f1131

No mention of any Poles there
I can see why films would make stuff up but Encarta is a reputable global enclyopedia and is not going to just make up things like that (particularly since its American).

Okay, I've had a conversation with a knowledgeable friend of mind and I think I've discovered where the confusion lies:

ben, is it true that the Poles broke the enigma code?
the poles managed to decode some messages that were made under the simpler enigma code
they then sent that info to GCHQ who (with turing etc) broke the cipher itself
and the shark code (I think it's called)
[snip]
so do you think its fair to say "the poles broke the enigma code" or not?
it's not fair or correct to say it
they gave the information that started the ball rolling though

Hope that clears it up!

[Gramphos]

Originally posted by Locutus
Actually, a whole set of databases: a text file to keep track of all the votes and updates, a file to store a copy of my first post (in case the thread gets messed up again) and some other important misc info (such as statistics), a html file to get the layout part correct, a script file to automatically do most of the layouting, an excel file to do the calculations... I would be lost without all those

As you have a script file, could you modify it to include percentages for the next update?
That would be really cool.

[Locutus]

Actually, I only use the script file for layouting (and not even all of it). When I started this all I considered writing a small VB program to do *all* the work automatically but I figured the thread would never last more than 2 weeks and it wouldn't be worth the effort. Boy, do I regret that now

You mean percentage of total amount of points given to each civ? I considered that a long time ago but it was a meaningless statistic as all civs we so close together. I just did some calculations though and discovered that the Mongols (#1) now have about 8% of the votes and the Byzantines (#16) about 1.7%, that might indeed make percentages an interesting statistic. If I can find an easy way of calculating and layouting them I'll certainly add them but I'm not promising anything...

[Naphta]

I'm writing this post because I've heard that many people think Poland is small and ignoble nation or even don't know that such a nation exists. Did they forget who won in 1410 in a great battle near Grunwald?! Or that in 1683 Austrians begged for help from Poles when Turks almost captured Wien! In 1920 Poles stopped Red Army marching towards Western Europe! And in 1989 Poles
began anti-communist revolution!
Poland of course isn't the most important nation in the world, but it had a big influence on history that is why it should be included in Civ3!

Poland 20
Spain 20
Austrian Empire 20
Irish 15
Swiss 15
Czech 20
Ukraine 10
Tunisia 10
Arabia 10
Cartagena 20

[ranskaldan]

IMO, Southeast Asia / Australia / Oceania should be represented by at least one of 32 civs.

Well lockstep, i'm voting for the Thais myself, and many people are voting for the Khmers.

As for the Poles, here's a cool map to show you the times when Poland was a major world power:

http://www.euratlas.com/big/big1600.htm

[mactbone]

No one as far as I know has said outright that the Poles were unimportant. I think what a lot of us think, is that it's not one of the 32 most important civs ever. If you want to see a humongous thread on why a civ should be included, look for the Korean thread started by Yin26. If the Poland thread can do what it's done here, imagine what that Korean thread could do...

[TCO]

Originally posted by Locutus
point there. I've changed it now.

Lumpkin,
Relax, it's okay! If you had looked a little closer you might have noticed that my previous update included all votes up to eXimius and you voted after him(/her). The update I posted just now includes your vote too and (somewhat reluctantly) I added the Fatty Lumpkins as well...

HEY!!

You shouldn't let other people put in silly civs when you denied me my original silly civs (kittycats, poodles, Washington Redskins, and Northwestern Wildcats). You need to hold the line on silliness or the whole list will get clogged with the GPs and equivalent.

Oh and I still have 4 points...don't I??

[krzysiek]

Originally posted by Naphta
I'm writing this post because I've heard that many people think Poland is small and ignoble nation or even don't know that such a nation exists.

Naphta, all Apolytonians know Poland very well. Everybody read the thread "why Poland SHOULD be included in one of the official sets". All of the facts you mentioned are there.

PS: Locutus, you are doing great job! I'm waiting for your
"Civ of the week"