AU502 DAR 3: Contact with all other civs

[nbarclay]

Originally posted by Thriller
Still, I recall the unit support costs in AU501 Republic were quite high, and reducing further from 1/2/2 to 0/1/1 while maintaining cost at 2 per unit threw that government out the window as far as I was concerned - at least for the early game.

It's actually 0/1/1 plus 12 flat support, compared with 1/2/2 with no flat support in the previous version of the AU Mod. With the eighteen towns/cities you had as of the end of this period, the difference in free unit support for Republic in the two versions was thus only six units, and it would have been even smaller if there was a time after you would have switched before you got up to eighteen. The biggest difference in the two versions is that you can't expand your free unit support nearly as much by "annexing" cities from your neighbors in the new version of the Mod as you could in the previous version or can under the stock rules. Still, we might want to revisit the question of whether 12 is the right flat amount or whether it should be a little higher (if we keep the new unit support model).

Nathan

[nbarclay]

Demigod Level, AU Mod

I finished researching Feudalism in AD 10 and suspended all research efforts pending capture of the Great Library. My goal was to get twenty Gallic Swordsmen and a nice MedInf/Pike/Trebuchet force to attack Sumeria. (The Gallic Swordsmen would be mostly to deal with counterattacks and to serve as guards and military police, especially along the Iroquois border.) In 310 AD, I felt like I had a sufficient force, so I arranged alliances with the Iroquois and Germans (both of whom were already fighting Sumeria) and struck. Bismarck was even willing to pay me to fight a war I wanted to fight anyhow.

[nbarclay]

With a trebuchet/MedInf stack (supported by a few Gallic Swordsmen) as my main offensive force, and attacking Enkidu Warriors rather than pikemen (thanks very possibly to C3C’s resource scarcity), losses were extremely low. Thus, I didn’t need to tie up a lot of production to replace losses.

The war against the Sumerians continued, and in 370 AD, a great leader emerged from an elite Gallic Swordsman unit. He quickly put together an army out of his Gallic Swordsmen and two nearby bands of Ancient Cavalry. That was also the year we captured the Great Wall, the fifth Sumerian wonder to fall into our hands. (The others were the Great Library, Statue of Zeus, and Mausoleum of Mausollos in Ur and the Great Lighthouse in Kish.)

A Celtic caravel made contact with the Byzantines in 410 AD. A decade later, with one known Sumerian city left, we decided to go ahead and declare war on the Germans and bring in the Iroquois as allies. There just happened to be five Iroquois MedInfs outside Frankfurt, and I hoped I could use up some German troops on them.

In 450 AD, Celtic scientists completed their research into Navigation. That same year, a trade secured Chemistry and Contact with the French. For the moment, the Celts had rough tech parity with the Aztecs and the Incas, with the Aztecs slightly ahead of the Incas. But with the golden age over and the Celts still in Monarchy, it was highly questionable whether tech parity could last.

Trade routes were established with the French in the year 470, at long last giving the Celts access to all eight luxuries. The Aztecs turned out to have Military Tradition, so after the dust cleared, they were the only civ ahead of me in tech and only by one tech. The Iroquois took Frankfurt easily, and in the turns since, Iroquois and German MedInfs and Longbowmen have been busily killing each other. I had just upgraded my fourteen trebuchets to cannons as of the close of this DAR, and it would be interesting to see how my mostly slow-mover attack stack would fare against the Germans.

[Aqualung71]

Originally posted by nbarclay


It's actually 0/1/1 plus 12 flat support, compared with 1/2/2 with no flat support in the previous version of the AU Mod.

Yes Nathan, I am aware that there is a flat support of 12, and that at 18 towns/cities there isn't a huge difference between 0/1/1 and 1/2/2, but with a war coming my number of units was increasing steadily and I was nowhere near (in my opinion) the breakeven point between the extra commerce per tile (let's say 18 towns average size 6, though I haven't gone back to check) and the extra cost of 2 gold per unit above the minimal free support level (12 plus, say 4 or 5 maybe?), compared with the minimal support cost under Monarchy at that stage. In any case, I felt Monarchy was the better government for waging a war at that time, and later Democracy would clearly be better than Republic (again, in my opinion).

Looking at the global picture though, I would contend that in a decent sized empire, the free support of 12 is rather insignificant, and the reduced support level to 0/1/1 imposes a significant extra cost over previous versions. And when considering Democracy is 1gpt compared to Republic's 2gpt, the significant difference between the governments starts to become clear.

Granted, in this case with a Religious civ, there is more opportunity to use Republic for a "niche" period while waiting for Democracy to become available, depending on your war plans and luxury availability.

[nbarclay]

I wasn't trying to argue that Republic was the better choice of government for your situation. I used Monarchy myself, in case you didn't notice. I was just trying to clarify the nature of the difference between the previous version of the Mod and the current one.

[Aqualung71]

DP - sheesh, I'm getting trigger happy these days. Dunno why these DP's keep happening!

[Aqualung71]

Originally posted by nbarclay
I wasn't trying to argue that Republic was the better choice of government for your situation. I used Monarchy myself, in case you didn't notice. I was just trying to clarify the nature of the difference between the previous version of the Mod and the current one.

Yes I did notice. And you used it very well, I might add

Anyway, sorry if I seemed a bit defensive. I'm grumpy this morning because I was up late trying to improve my play and some game mechanics seriously p****d me off - check out my post under DAR4 and tell me where I went wrong.

[IthacaMike]

Regent - AU Mod - 1420, the year I make contact

I had the starting continent all to my self and was busy building infrastucture and getting the western islands colonized when the Byzantines reached me from the east. They had finshed Copernicus in 1375. I figure it was wonder cascade from my finishing the Sistine Chapel. They had Printing Press but what really got Theodora's attention was my extra Saltpeter. She got her Musketmen and Cavalry and I got her world map. I parlayed old techs for additional contacts and established embassies with everyone.

I was supprised how small the other Civs were.

Then the annoyance wars started. The outer islands were lightly defended and in 1795 Theodora kept trying to pick off the odd city. I would have to mount rescue (well recapture) missions to get my cities back. With only Luxuries and the slider to keep war weariness down it was taking a toll on my happiness.

I'd get the Byzantines backed off and then the French would start trouble. It felt like tag team war weariness.

Steam power came allong about 1700.

[Rhothaerill]

Rhoth's AU502 DAR 3a

Demigod level - AU mod


I'm currently working on this DAR still as I have not had much time to play since I posted last. I still have not contacted anyone else, but the AIs on my continent, but a lot of other things have happened. I figured I'd try to keep this relatively current so that I wasn't trying to remember everything later on after I'm farther into the game.


1000bc - Incans complete the Pyramids

950bc - Settle Eboracum near the Sumerian border to cut off their expansion and to settle more desert hopefully for saltpeter.

875bc - The Iroquois had been roaming through my territory off and on for a while. Finally they decided to sneak attack me. Unfortunately for them their sneak attack consisted of one regular warrior attacking Agedincum. Unfortunately for me they lost to a Gallic Swordsman and started my golden age. It wasn't too bad since I had a lot of one-shield tiles that got boosted, but I was still hoping to wait for monarchy before starting the GA. Oh well.

800bc - Most of the Iroquois attack forces were on the Gergovia front, many of them inside Mauch Chunk. That left Allegheny relatively unprotected and it fell to a small force of Gallic Swordsman. I now had dyes once I had a chance to hook it up. This city was also where I started something I mentioned in another thread today about pop-rushing happiness wonders with the native citizens. Since I wasn't in monarchy yet I could do that and with it I got the city down to size 1 and received a temple, barracks, and city walls out of it.

725bc - Aztecs complete the Temple of Artemis and the Hanging Gardens on the same turn. Ouch! A wonder cascade follows wihth the Sumerians completing the Great Lighthouse and the Iroquois completing the Mausoleum of Mausollos.

690bc - Finally capture Mauch Chunk after many Gallic Swordsman would attack and retreat. They had a lot of units in that city and it took a while to kick them out along with defending against the units they sent against Gergovia. While capturing the city I also captured two settler and a worker for a total of five new slaves that immediately headed for connecting the dyes at Allegheny. Most of my forces were wounded by this time so I received peace and gained mathematics, code of laws and 35 gold from them.

650bc - Byzantines complete the Great Wall.

630bc - A few short turns after the peace the Iroquois start invading me again...this time with swordsmen.


to be continued...

[Rhothaerill]

Rhoth's AU502 DAR 3b

Demigod level - AU mod


610bc - I ask the Iroquois to leave and they decide to declare war on me again. My forces were healed by this time so I merrily went at them.

590bc - How nice, my first leader. Hmm, could he be going for an army. Oh yeah, definitely. A 3 Gallic Sword army will be very useful against the Iroquois scourge.

Also around this time I've explored around the two west islands to find no other civs. Time to start suiciding.


to be continued...

[Rhothaerill]

Rhoth's AU502 DAR 3c

Demigod level - AU mod


570bc - Capture Akwesasne and 1 worker on the eastern coast with only a few Gallics.

530bc - Capture Niagara Falls and 3 workers in the center of their area. Once again many of my forces were beat up. Luckily the Gallics had the retreat option or my forces wouldn't be as strong as they are. According to the F3 screen I'm stronger than all three other civs on my continent.

Because of my forces being beaten up and needing rest I once again asked for peace and this time recieved 23gpt, 300 gold, and 3 more slave workers. I couldn't get them to trade any of their techs so I took gold and workers...more useful in the long run anyway.

Also I had started suiciding a few of my galleys around this time. Only one made it past the first turn in the ocean.


to be continued...

[Rhothaerill]

Rhoth's AU502 DAR 3d

Demigod level - AU mod


470bc - The Iroquois once again invade my territory but this time they leave when asked. This continues for several turns.

430bc - The Sumerians complete the Statue of Zeus. Ugh! All my play time with the Iroquois has left me with virtually no units to mess with the Germans and Sumerians. Luckily I've kept them mostly happy with me and neither has bothered to invade me. I decide to trade iron and 350 gold to the Sumerians for currency which I then trade to the Germans for construction which vaults me into the next age. Of course I don't get the free tech though since I'm not scientific. Sigh.

410bc - Finish research on monarchy and start research on feudalism with a scientist. I want to make some money and intend to get some techs through another war soon enough. I start the revolution. 2 turns for a religious civ.

350bc - I decide to start another war with the Iroquois with the intention of kicking them from the continent and gaining some tech in an eventual peace deal. The Iroquois are also the weakest civ militarily which makes a difference since my Gallic Swordsmen will be outliving their usefulness here soon with pikeman to face them.

I decide to demand a tech first just to see what the Iroquois will do. And look...it's "Dirty Hiawatha"


to be continued...

[Rhothaerill]

Rhoth's AU502 DAR 3e

Demigod level - AU mod


310bc - And a short jaunt to this last screen for a while. The Iroquois began sending units up the mountain range to the east of Niagara Falls and even bypassing the city to head to my core. Good tactics for which I applaud the AI. It made me have to attack them on high ground which wasn't what I wanted to do. But on the plus side I received another leader and a second Gallic Swordsman army out of it.

My report is now just about current to where I am in the game. I'll update more later when I have the chance.


to be continued...in a while...

[Madine]

Monarch, AU Mod

1050 AD. This is my 2nd try, and it continues to go much better.

I took a more "patient" approach this game. Although I lost the race to Sun Tzu's academy, I was able to switch over to Sistene instead. My GA didn't happen until mid-middle ages, but it was very productive for me.

I have finished off the Germans. My military is "strong "compared to all other civs. I am concerned about the Sumerian cultural dominance.

My army is marching south to take out the Iroquois. Once they are done, the Sumerians will be next.

[Rhothaerill]

Rhoth's AU502 DAR 3f

Demigod level - AU mod

250bc - During the intervening time between 310bc and 250bc I pushed on toward Salamanca with several Gallic Swordsmen and one of my Gallic Sword armies (very nice those ). After a turn of whittling down their defenses I finished off the last pikeman in the city to capture it along with the Mausoleum of Mausollos. You'd think the Iroquois would have tried to have built a better wonder. As I was no longer in despotism I had to starve the city all the way down from population 9 without the benefit of pop-rushing a temple, etc. But it didn't flip on me.

I also complete the Heroic Epic in Entremont this turn.

230bc - Capture Oil Springs through the use of my other Gallic Sword army.

210bc - I had hoped to take Tyendanaga by now, but there were too many units surrounding it and the Iroquois kept them on the mountain ranges. Good tactics...but not good enough to keep from me from generating my third leader. I slated this one for the Forbidden Palace in Salamanca.