Civ3: Who's resolve is first to falter?

[Rasputin]

well despite most of this being Off Topic and belonging in Civ 3 Forum, I for one am glad Ming hasnt moved it as it gives a Civ 2 MPers view on the game, even though MarkG stated early on that the Civ 2 Community couldnt talk of Civ 3 here but must do so over at civ 3... (Damn him)... OVer at Civ 3 forum it would simply be drowned out by all the Newbies to civ !!

One thing that puzzles me is seeing reports of the OCC successes already, is it that easy to do, or are the reports exagerated.

Also I read soemwher ein the civ 3 forum of a strategy called the "Wombat" strategy, something to do with trading empty citys to enemeies then attacknig them immediatly with your troops you left on outsklirts of citys... Have you much knowledge of this ??

Thanks Guys !@!!!

[CapTVK]

One thing that puzzles me is seeing reports of the OCC successes already, is it that easy to do, or are the reports exagerated.

The fact that OCC has become easier seems to be due to the improved diplomacy model employed. When you keep trading and gifting techs to other civs they will stay friendly for the entire game. and as you're no military threat you can go concentrate on playing the diplogame. This isn't really a bad thing as OCC still seems to be a challenge. The higher levels haven't been mastered.....yet!

Also I read soemwher ein the civ 3 forum of a strategy called the "Wombat" strategy, something to do with trading empty citys to enemeies then attacknig them immediatly with your troops you left on outsklirts of citys... Have you much knowledge of this ??

This seems to be true, and the trick is quite simple: give an undefended city to the AI and take it right back. I've seen this trick in other games as wel so it isn't really new. If we could gift cities to the AI in civ1 or 2 we would already have done this years ago.

IMO the option of giving cities to the AI should be removed. This option is easily abused.

[Carolus Rex]

Still don't have the game...

...but I'm intrigued by your discussions about it.

The "trade with city and take it back next turn"-strategy is what Xin Yu referred to in his post.

Totally agree with you Rasputin, please keep this thread here!

I'm also intrigued by the culture concept, hope you're wrong about it being unbalancing, War. Peace loving, enlighted rulers like myself need a counterforce to the Mongolian hordes...

Carolus

[Steve Clark]

war: "its not worth killing the ai early"?!?!? That's blasphemous, my old friend.

Inasmuch as I am trying to get myself banned over there, just by participating in this thread makes staying around worthwhile.

[Xin Yu]

Well, just came back and played several hours. You can't chop down trees to help wonders, although the strategy guide said so. The only way to beat AIs to wonders is to build your capital on river, build a lot of workers to work the terrain, then add the workers to the capital -- you can make it size 12. Adjust luxury rate so that it won't go disorder (if you happend to have a luxury special you'll be able to solve this problem easily). You'll be able to build the pyramids in less than 20 turns.

Barbarians is a problem. After you see the first barb, send a defending unit towards that direction and fortify him on a mountain or hills. I have an impression that barbs only appear on terrains you've already explored but fogged from your current view. Put warriors on highlands will probably alleviate barb problem.

[Carolus Rex]

What are you guys' take on corruption?

Seems to be a killer in the game, according to none less than Oedo:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33364

Simply an unbalancing feature or is it a flaw/bug that you can't curb it?

Carolus

[Smash]

of course I'm not 100% sure but I kinda think that the type of civ you are may have an effect on corruption.AND map size.Game#1 I picked England,just because I saw someone posted that playing England would be impossible ..they are an expansionist something and corruption was not terrible.Currently I have 45>50 cities and corruption is minimal."We love" helps alot with corruption.So do courthouses and a forbidden palace.

The whole trade system is different..yet the same.We now have 3 main types of resources.Luxury,strategic and the ones we are familiar with.The ones that we can see the benefit of when we put our workers on them.
Luxury resources are what gives our "trade routes" so to speak.They provide luxuries to every city connected by road,harbor or airport.So you can reduce YOUR alottment to luxry taxes.
Resources are what allow you to build certain stuff.Simply discovering a technology does not allow you to build new units.For example,you can get Gunpowder,but without a supply of saltpeter iirc,you can't build musketmen.If you have saltpeter in your empire..great..if not you must trade for it.I just setup a route of saltpeter with a civ.Now I have 20 turns to upgrade all my pikeman to musketman.

food and sheild support have all been lumped into gold support.This is different yet the same.The more gold you have,the larger the army you can have.This would obviously favor the representaive governments..except we now have "war weariness" instead of unhappiness by units in the feild.The effect of this on demo and republic is huge..if your war is "your fault".Even on lower levels you get unrest.Any conquered cities are in a state of resistance and unhappieness.If you click on an unhappy citizen,they will tell you why they are unhappy.You must sign peace treaties to quell unhappies in conquered cities.They complain "stop this war against our motherland".

Xin is correct.Chopping and planting doesn't work on wonders or the palace.Maybe..I was chopping and planting to rush along a university with the idea of changing to the Magellans wonder.At a certain point,I could no longer switch to the wonder.It was NOT another city building it btw.I also could not switch off to a palace.Perhaps after a certain point,you cant change?

The free money bug DOES NOT WORK in my game.I get a popup "not enough gold are you nuts?" type thing.Maybe I do it wrong..possible..don't want or need it anyways.

So far,overall..it is quite good.The food system is not so good.Growth is too fast with the tiny foodboxes.But since there is no we love growth...I have found myself with nothing to really build alot.This doesn't usually happen in civ2 until very late.....
The animated units are neat.The evil laugh when they win is great.They yawn..all kinds of stuff.I definetly had to turn on the colored circle around their feet to easily identify which were who's

It takes some getting used to the fact that many units move onto the square they are attacking if they win.Left many units hanging like this.Combat is not just a matter of moving units against a city.Actual planning is taking place for me.Early knights are great as they can attack and move away.They also back off when attacked if they are going to lose.

The citizen icons are not so good in that it is difficult to tell who is happy and who is not in the domestic advisor screen.Its easy to tell in the city screen,but in the DA screen they are jammed too close to tell.That is pretty easy to change.

Another minor double edged peeve is the ai expands..better.The problem is:even on huge maps(which are not that huge btw)..the land is filled quite quickly making exploration a waste of time to a degree.Exploring is/has always been a big part of the fun....course I played with at least 8 civs.Less civs would proabaly leave some land unsettled for abit....oh ya you will fight for land to settle at some point...

It reminds me of civ2 in that I trashed the demo after 10 minutes.Then I came back and had another look.The more you play and learn,the better it gets.The game is very familiar yet very different.It is civing.Alot of my turn time is spent in the foregn advisor screen.Wheeling and dealing.This is much better than in civ2.

There is much to learn.

I have had NO tech problems AT ALL.

In its current form,the game would HAVE to be simul for MP.


ps.this city governor problem is non exsistant if you set everything to NO.Cities build and report in the same way as civ2.Only difference is if you set a city to build a unit such as a pikeman,when it is finished the city will not neccessarily keep building pikes.But when the pike activates it quite is easy to make your build order adjustments.
....and you can't keep building wonders after it has been built.You can use the palace as a holder.
If you manage your cities like you did in civ2,you will not have any problems.

[Steve Clark]

Nicely put, Smash. That echos alot of my views as well. I told Sten about this thread, so hopefully he'll drop by.

[Smash]

I am England(orange)



the ai expands....and this is on the 3rd lowest level.I got a feeling it is mimicking the player.After some heavy map trading I can see ai cities completely surrounded by dark.Kinda like they popped up.
Its like mp in that if you don't settle it by a certain time then you will have to take it.Land is gobbled up pretty quick.

btw-the Darwin's equivalent(Theory of Evolution) doesn't let you pick your freebies.I can see some planning here.

[Alexander's Horse]

Saw it in the shops today. Didn't buy it

[War4ever]

admittedly...... the ai is quite good at expansion.... in one of my games..... i couldn't take the last city of a nation...the iroquois IIRC and they grew to about 10 cities eventuallly....only to lose them all to me later....as it was the capital i took out....

i can't remember how to establish embassies if i don't do it right when i discover writing has made wheeling and dealing a bit more difficult...

i am playing on emperor level now..... and having a tough go with it...but trying to remember its a long game.......with patience comes the spoils

for the first time today i had three leaders show up..... and i don't know about you guyz..but now that i play the persians... my army is almost unstopable!!!!

admittedly i am not mirco managing much and i send my workers off in weird directions as i hit wrong keys and mistake them for something else.........

if the ai fears you..diplomacy is sweet and easy.... take whatever you want..... they won't do anything about it..... and they are quick for cease fires....

the FP is a lifesaver..... and for me pyramids is key..... quick expansion keeps me close to my larger rivals....

oh and a mod for territory borders... make mine have electric fence its the only way to keep the natives out

[Smash]

you make embassys by right clicking on your cap.You will see it in the menu.

[War4ever]

Thanks Smash.... its the little things that stump me....oh and does anyone else experience problems with ancient armies......


Mine are lousy..its easier to take cities with single units at least a few together that is

[rah]

Xin, I tried your strat of starting as the French, (renamed the Ferrets, of course) and made a beeline for literacy and built the GL within 14 turns of getting it. I only spit out one settler from my cap and never saw any from huts so it slowed my down expanding. (I guess I'll just have to take those extra cities)

Upon getting the GL I got like 5 techs and they've been flowing free since. What a difference. Quite the money tree from trading with the AI's. If I covet a wonder I just don't trade one of the prereqs.

To me, all the increased need for diplomacy is a drastic improvement to the game. In CivII, you could play the whole game and just ignore all contact with the AI's and romp and stomp without problems (unless you were into winning by just demanding tribute). In this version, it is not a good idea to ignore the AI's. It would be a tough win. I just wish that the trade advisor wasn't always so acurate. It does take a little of the fun out of it.

Rich

[Ming]

Originally posted by rah
I just wish that the trade advisor wasn't always so acurate. It does take a little of the fun out of it.

I have to agree... while it does make negotiations so simple, it does remove the mystery. With the trade advisor, I know I've always offered the "right" thing or amount... I only wish you could have the same information when buying a car