Game Discussion, Turn 2101 - 2120

[Maniac]

If I'm correct there are currently two suggestions:

Zeiter:
1) Found Sparta Command first turn
2) pop the pod with the unity rover thereafter the same turn
3) move the second CP elsewhere to build a base in MY 2104.

Googlie:
1) Move one CP south, and the second somewhere NW or NE.
2) Found both bases the second turn and then pop the pod (with command center in production queue.

So what will we use? Or should I throw a dice before playing?

(But I still think that a facs completed goody would be awesome if we were so lucky (+4 morale troops immediately!!),

Unfortunately +2 Morale SE "only" means +1 morale in overall and an extra +12,5% when defending (that's what the (+) means). So with a command center we'd get veteran troops.

If we don't get a "facilities completed" result we can always change to a scout before we end the turn

If our first worker works a rolling&rainy tile, our base would be able to grow to size 2 before completing a colony pod. So therefore I was wondering: what would you think about foregoing scout patrol production for now and immediately building a CP in one or both of our bases?

On the other hand, there's a fungus tile next to our landing site. Also a potential problem could be that the turn after we found the base and start CP production, we pop a pod with a monolith or mineral resource. When working that, the CP would be finished before the base grows.

[Zeiter]

I'm actually beginning to lean more towards Goolgie's suggestion of planting both bases on the second turn. I guess moving the first CP to the NW and the 2nd to the south would be the way to go. Meanwhile we could move the rover to the west and then to the north, then on the 2nd turn pop the pod on its first move.

[Kody]

starting techs: centauri ecology, Doctrine: flexibility, progenitor pysch, biogenetics, industrial base, social pysch, applied physics

[Maniac]

Ah good. That seems to be in accordance with the research planner for Sparta. Spartans who are interested, download it here.

If you want the original file of Minute Mirage, get it here:

http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php?file=3088_smac(x)_technology_choices_v1[1].07.zip

If you want to know the logic behind it, read this thread.

Originally posted by Zeiter
I'm actually beginning to lean more towards Goolgie's suggestion of planting both bases on the second turn.

That's decided then (I guess?)

[Googlie]

well, isn't this interesting !!

I built myself a little start simulator (couldn't quite get the elevation and rolling/rainy exactly the same, but it's good enough for illustrative purposes - attached)

Option 1: Plop Sparta Command immediately, and change production to a Command Center. Move the second CP south to found base # 2 in 2103. Pop the pod first turn with the rover.

Here are the ten results of my test:

nut special - 3 times

then, once each:

nut with a river !!
River source
Cartographic map (11 x 11 tiles)
Battle Ogre II
Unity Rover
Completion of the Command Center
Monolith

Basic research rate (with sliders maxing at 30/10/60) was tech every 8 turns, reducing to 5 after the 2nd base was founded (so in effect the tech came in 2108)

With the monolith, the tech became 5 turns (ie in 2106), reducing to 3 after the second base in 2103 (but still 2106)

Strangely the rate didn't change with the river, even when I put the SC worker on it for the extra energy

Option # 2: Use the first turn to move the CP's 1-tile apart, then found 2 bases in 2102. Change the production in the one closest to the seedpod to a Command Center, then pop the pod with the rover

here are the ten:

nut special 3 times
monolith twice

and then, once each:

Unity rover
clone of my unity rover,
Command Center completion
50 ec's
Cartograph display of 11 x 11 tiles

Basic research rate (sliders to 30/10/60) was a tech every 5 turns - first tech in 2107

With the monolith, the rate dropped to 4 techs (to 2106, as the pod gets popped in 2102

**************************************************

Conclusions:


Not very scientific, of course, but in either case, it seems that we'll get our first tech no earlier than 2106.

I'm leaning towrads planting the flag in 2101 with Sparta Command, changing production to a Command Center, then popping the pod. A monolith or a completion is great, ec's are good, and nuts just so-so.

But we are no worse off than we'd be if we moved the 1 tile separation that first turn then planted both bases, and might be a little better better off (Sparta Command starts growing its pop 1 turn earlier - moreso if we do pop a nut special)

G.

[Googlie]

To summarize:

If I were playing the turn, I'd:

Found Sparta Command where it is right now, and change the production to a Command Center

Set the sliders to 30/10/60, for a "tech in 8 turns"

Move the 2nd colony pod due south

Pop the pod with the rover. If a facility complete, great. If a monolith, move the worker to it (becomes tech in 5, with sliders at 20/10/80), or if a nut, or river + nut, move the worker as well, and in any of these 3 situations, change the production to a colony pod (extra pop in 8, with a 3 nut tile, but pod in 21, with no minerals from that worker - but that can be accelerated closer to completion of the pop to put the worker back on the 2 nut/1 mineral tile. Either way, we'd have our next colony pod in around ten to twelve turns

If anything else gets popped, change back to a scout or rover, and leave the worker tending the 2 nut/1 mineral tile

Next turn, continue moving the 2nd colony pod south or southwest, and found 2nd base in 2103

Any comments? Agree or disagree?

G.

[Googlie]

(and don't go by the 4 techs that my little scenario offers - there's the "designer's flaw" in that I set the original techs as discoveries rather than as faction techs (ie I put them as "tech breakthru", which was easier at the time)

So my scenario shows only 4: cent ecol; infonets; ind base and soc psych as being available.

Kody has confirmed (earlier above) that we will have a choice of 7:

centauri ecology, Doctrine: flexibility, progenitor pysch, biogenetics, industrial base, social pysch, and applied physics

Didn't we disacuss in the off-'poly forum that we'd go for flex first, as that was our big advantage? (mobility >>> flex)

Then towards Planetary Networks so that we'll get early defensive, offensive and foil probes? (so we'd need infonets >>>> plan nets for that)

G.

[Googlie]

Some further testing;

premise #1: what if we popped the pod with the rover, before doing anything else?

ten results:

monolith - 4 times
nut special - 4 times
AA
spore launcher (which the rover killed for 10 ec's)

pretty good result I'd say

premise #2: pop it with a colony pod right of the bat

ten results:

nut - 5 times
river source - twice
hydronoponics, giving 6 forest tiles !!

and in all 3 cases, the base can be founded on it next turn, 'cos it will have the 1 tile of separation by then

but - 2 baddies

spore launcher (again, the rover can still kill it for the 10 ec's), and, finally,
fungal bloom (worst of all, cos it spread right under the pod so we'd lose a turn moving it back

Conclusion?

We can forego the possibility of getting a Command center instabuilt if we pop the pod immediately with the Rover, and stand about an 80% probability of getting a monolith or a nut special

[Snowflake]

Wow Googlie is really enraged.

[Edit] Looks like I was DanSed if it is the correct use of the word.

[Googlie]

double posts infilled with meaningful insights

(is anyone else fed up with how often CNN thank their reporters for "your insights" - Good Grief - reporters report, they don't give insights)

(and HongHu, you'll need to edit your post now with something witty (or insightful???) as future generations of readers will now read your post and say "Huh?")

G.

[Skanky Burns]

Centauri Ecology	Explore		1
Doctrine: Flexibility	Explore		2
Progenitor Pysch	Explore		1
Biogenetics		Discover	1
Industrial Base		Build		1
Social Pysch		Build		1
Applied Physics		Conquer		1

So what are we planning on researching?

EDIT: So we are just starting with Doctrine: Mobility, right?

[Googlie]

(I used one of my emptied quadruplicate posts (above) to comment on our research path)

summary: doc flex, then infonets, then plan nets

G.

[Skanky Burns]

Agggh! I've been DanSed!!!

[Kody]

*snicker*

Honghu's comment with come back to haunt you when this ACDG finishes.

"Googlie's enraged, oh I wonder what happened. It must have been pretty bad, maybe one of the mods banned one of his tactics or something. No I think it might have been something to do with diplomancy. No that can't be right, notice the date on the posts it's only turn 1 and the turn hadn't arrived at the time. So they would be breaking the no-contact law if that was the case. Do you reckon that could possibly be the reason why he was enraged, I mean he might have talked to a person on of the other teams and one of the mods came down on him for sharing secret information. Hrmm I don't know it seems unlike Googlie, maybe it was something else. Check if there's any old peace members from the ACDGII posting in this or the public forum shortly before that post. I don't know do you think it could be archived already....."

[Googlie]

ROFLOL