Ideas for the Start

[Corellion]

Formers as soon as possible, but before that let's get Scout Patrol, and keep it ready for other CPs we build. But I think we should go for Planned ASAP (after Centauri Ecology). The growth bonus does wonders, and the industry bonus is also worthwhile. When we're small, the efficiency doesn't matter much. Plus, it gets us probe teams soon. I think we should focus on PTs if we end up close to the University or any other faction with techs we want. Especially the University. Wonderful targets they are.

[Googlie]

I was asked a question in one of the other forums, so in fairness to all reproduce the answer below:

I actually had to dumb down the AI after my first playtest (I'd given the Angels and the Believers a monolith right beside their three bases - the B's spawned like rabbits while the A's outresearched the UoP and the Borgs for the first ten to fifteen turns (with the 2 monolith energy per base)

So I tinkered with their monoliths - but of course couldn't stop a monolith being pod-popped (well I could have, by checking off the "pods never produce monoliths" box in the Scenario settings, but eventually we'd be left with the pods just producing native life if we deselected everything else !!!)

Also had started them with a crawler on a forest tile per base for the minerals (lurking, so that the dumb AI doesn't use them for exploration - I've seen that quite often), but had to take them away as well.

So they are AI's with developing muscles, but not on steroids .....

G.

[Drogue]

As some of you may have seen, we now have the save file. I have DLed it, and am looking at it. I will report here ina few minutes. Maniac is also online, so maybe he might want to do the same

[Drogue]

Ok, here is the screenshot of our starting location. I propose that we build a base there, as it looks a good spot, and that we explore north with 1 scout and 1 CP and south with 2 of each.

Please discuss, but be quick. I will in about 4 or 5 hours.


Sorry about the colours, paint seems to do that with AC or AX images

[Maniac]

I'd suggest to let our scouts follow the river course.
Q is: what tile will we work? The monolith (2-2-2) or the moisty nutrient bonus river (3-1-1). Linked to that, when we use the nutrient, our base will grow to size 2 before we finish the CP. So what to build: a scout patrol or a CP? And what if we can't choose Centauri Ecology as our first research project? PlaNets, Biogen, Soc Psych?? I won't be here the next 6 hours, so I can't discuss if Drogue plays in that time.

Edit: Since I won't be here, build scout patrol and work the monolith is my vote. And please don't forget to put "stockpile energy" in the queue!

Edit2: Sudden change of plans. I will be here after all.

[Drogue]

Ok, I think we will have Centauri Eco there, as it usually is there for on of the first options. If not, look at the science thread, for what i would choose next.

Why work the monolith? Don't we get 222 whatever's on it? I'd discuss forming once we have poped that pod, to see what's in it. Personally, I favour farming the squares we will put condensers on, to crawl for food, and foresting the ones we will put boreholes on as it's easy, quick terraforming and boreholes will be quite a few turns later.

I would send 1 scout and CP north, hitting the monolith to put it up a morale point, send one directly south, to pop the pod, and one following the river south-west. It's nice to use rivers, but we should pop the pod, and enhance our units IMHO.

Please keep giving ideas.

[Maniac]

After having checked, we can only choose the following for our first tech: Doctrine: Mobility, Planetary Networks, Industrial Base, Social Psych and Nonlinear Maths. What will we pick? I'd go for PlaNets or SocPsy personally.

Edit: So would you pick IndBase. IMHO there isn't an urgent need for Synthmetal yet. More important seems to me PlaNets (for Planned) and Soc Psych (for a rec commons in our Secret Project base).

[Drogue]

I would go for Ind Base of Plan Nets, because they both get us Ind Auto the quickest. I would wait until after Ind Auto before going for Soc Psych personally, because we want to build formers, a scout and maybe a CP first IIRC, so there is no need for the rec commons yet.

Also, Planned is good, but I usually go for Democracy very close to it, so as not to stifle efficiency. However, with our growth, I think either Ind Base, as synthmetal is good since we will have 3 new bases soon, and scouts cannot defend against much, all it takes is Miriam with a laser rover and we lose a base; or for Plan Net. Rec Commons won't be needed for another 15 turns at least IMHO.

[Maniac]

I would go for Ind Base of Plan Nets

We both seem to agree on PlaNets then. Should we poll it for the other Consciousness members?

but I usually go for Democracy very close to it

Really? That's an odd strategy. AFAIK it is common tactic among most players to wait with switching to democracy until your expansion phase is almost finished. That way you get to keep the ten free minerals, which are very valuable in the beginning of the game.

so as not to stifle efficiency.

That shouldn't be much of a problem with our faction bonus.

all it takes is Miriam with a laser rover and we lose a base

I doubt we will encounter another faction in the first couple of decades. We're playing on a relatively large map, and I assume Googlie will have spread the factions, so no two factions start close to each other.

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Maniac
We both seem to agree on PlaNets then. Should we poll it for the other Consciousness members?

Just posted that on the Science Thread I would say not poll, as I want to be playing it in a couple of hours. If anyone comes online before then then they can give us their opinion. However if Prime and Second Functions agree, then thnat should be enough for now, since we don't have time to do a 2 day poll.

Originally posted by Maniac
Really? That's an odd strategy. AFAIK it is common tactic among most players to wait with switching to democracy until your expansion phase is almost finished. That way you get to keep the ten free minerals, which are very valuable in the beginning of the game.

Yes, but I usually don't use Planned until then either (I don't research it early). Planned without Demo can lead to much loss of energy, but that is a price worth paying IMHO for the growth, when playign as the CyCon.

Originally posted by Maniac
That shouldn't be much of a problem with our faction bonus.

Exactly

Originally posted by Maniac
I doubt we will encounter another faction in the first couple of decades. We're playing on a relatively large map, and I assume Googlie will have spread the factions, so no two factions start close to each other.

true, but a rover moves qucikly, Miriam is beefed up, and it isn't a huge map. We could meet inside 20 turns, and we may not have Ind Base by then, if we go Plan Net and Cent Eco.

[Drogue]

Right, I am about to play, as I said I would. Not much will be done.

We will start researching Planetary Networks, we will found one base where it is and start building a scout. 1 scout will pop the pod to the south, 1 will step onto the monolith, and the last will follow the river, as per Maniac's suggestion. 1 pod will follow the river with the scout, another will follow the river north and then move a square to the north. That means we have 1 CP going north, 1 going south, both with a scout as chaperone in case of worms, and one scout exploring and pod popping to the south.

There is nothing major in their, and most of it has been agreed. I have used Maniac's idea with the river, but added in the pod pop, as we have enough scout's to be safe.

[Drogue]

Have played the first turn.

Nothing went ary. Apolyton Prime has been founded, Minerals were found in pod, everything as planned. Have not started to research, as did not come up, and cannot change to it yet, however we have no research points yet. That should mean it comes up next turn, when we choose, and this turns research points are added to it. Apolyton Prime is working the nutrient's, as it does not need mins, sicne it has complete scout patrol already. Will discuss changing to Monolith next turn if necessary.

Screen shots of Capital and Area:



Does anyone know why the colours go like this? Or how to fix it?

[Googlie]

It looks like you are playing with the alternate palette (do the colors look like this in your own game, or just in the save and paste screenshot?)

[Googlie]

Further comment (and I've raised this with others who haven't read Vel's Guide)

I see you left your energy allocation at the default 50:50:0

The inefficiency penalty in the first ten turns or so is miniscule (few bases), and often a change to, say, 30:60:10 can drop the tech research time significantly - as much as from 5 years to 3 - (there is a "law of diminishing returns" where, say, a 20:80:0 split produces a worse result)

(let's say that the penalty is -16% economy and -8% labs; with 2 ec's per turn, 84% is still rounded to 2 and the labpoints gain of 10 or 20% more than offsets the penalty, hence the reduced time to next tech.

Obviously, when the empire is larger, and income is maybe 300 or 400 per turn, with labpoints at the several hundred or thousand level, the penalties are more severe. Of course, future SE choices can reduce - even eliminate - the inefficiency penalties. hence the 0:0:100 split you'll see toewards the endgame)

G.

[Maniac]

I used to have that problem too, but I have forgotten what caused it. Perhaps try to save as jpeg's instead of gif's next time, or try using another graphic program.

Btw, next turn, could you please make a save right before ending the turn? That would make it way easier to discuss actions ahead for the next turn.

Ah yes, from a few posts up:

Why work the monolith? Don't we get 222 whatever's on it? I'd discuss formign once we have poped that pod, to see what's in it. Personally, I fvour farming the aquars we will put condensers on, to crawl for food, and foresting the ones we will put boreholes on as it's easy, quick terraforming and boreholes will be quite a few turns later.

I'm not sure I understand you, but with "working the monolith" I meant putting our first worker on it, not terraforming it somehow. What are aquars btw?