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Very late thoughts on Civ 6

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  • Very late thoughts on Civ 6

    So I have put in 6ish hours the last couple of days playing Indonesia on Prince. First, I like the game, and more interested in playing it than I was ever playing Civ 5 and more interested than I have been in playing Civ 4 in some time. I am eager to get back once the family gets to sleep.

    One of the first things I noticed is that Barbarians don't seem to wander around and do nothing. Each Barbarian group seems to have a purpose where they will scout and pull back and move forward with multiple troops. This makes them more dangerous than they would be otherwise, you want at least 3 troops in general because if you use the strategy of just one troop which makes smart attacks you will end up overwhelmed. At some point cities can shoot, maybe when you get ancient walls? But I am not certain about when this occurs (it might also occur at a size).

    One of the things I am most excited about this new Civ is in past Civs if you built up early you would be in a good place in the middle/late game. This time it seems that you have to be really doing the right things to keep the techs coming and even planning your cities right (which are tile improvements) so that you can get useful actions later in the game. It is a big difference placing a Holy Site somewhere where there is a +3 or a +1 faith bonus and your Ancient (Classical?) Scientist gives you science = faith. If you put in the effort to attract that Great Person then don't you want a +3 science rather than a +1 science? If you end up setting things up poorly you will struggle in the Mid/Late game (it seems) even if you are strong in the Early game.

    This is great.

    Probably it is still true that if you are militarily dominant enough among the nations (not just Barbarians) that that carries forward irregardless. But that is OK.

    The fact that tech gets faster depending on what you do means that you need to hit certain key paths forward or you will struggle. You need to have mining and farming and fishing, this means you need to plan out your cities for more than just "what is a good city". You also need to fight a bit, although this can mostly be done against Barbarians in the early game. Finally, you need to construct certain buildings, which means diversification there also.

    Interesting bits about Indonesia are that they have a very nice upgrade that can be made in any ocean square. This means that you like ocean beyond just the fish and the spot for the Harbor and possibly a World Wonder. I haven't fully exploited this yet. They also get Faith from ocean squares boarding their Holy Site.

    I haven't seen how great a Religion is, I have only played two games really into Classical. It seems likely that nations play differently enough that it is worth picking. I didn't do that so much in past Civilizations although the differences have been important since Civ3.

    JM
    Jon Miller-
    I AM.CANADIAN
    GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

  • #2
    Of course, that should be Civ6. That is why no one looked at this thread? I would be happy if some moderator renamed the thread.
    Jon Miller-
    I AM.CANADIAN
    GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

    Comment


    • #3
      Anyway, I am still playing Indonesia. I am not so happy with my game yet so I have restarted a number of times. It isn't that I need perfect play, but I realize I am doing stupid things and then want to not do stupid things. Like auto explore, not a good idea with these Barbarians.

      So some early game strategy (some of this is going to be general).

      First, you need to be on the look out for three early city sites. Preferably you want: rice/wheat (farming), gems/diamonds/copper/etc (mining), stone (quarry), fish/crabs/whale/etc x2 (fishing), shore and river. Shore is good period (river less so). Probably you also should be on the look out for iron for your 3rd city site but I haven't been very successful at that yet and hit it often with my 4th city.

      At about turn 20 you should have:
      military: warrior (initial), slinger, 3rd military unit
      utility: settler, builder (purchased)

      Note that if your 3rd military unit is not a warrior (or possibly a slinger, I haven't tried 2 slingers) then you need to bring your initial warrior back. With these barbarians I have no problem going warrior, warrior, slinger. I am usually looking for a second continent anyways and so would prefer the warrior kept going. My experience is that slinger+scout is too weak against barbarians and so you need slinger+warrior (or possibly at slinger+slinger) at home. If it is just a simple encampment or encampment+scout, then warrior+scout (after code of laws) can take out an encampment... but you need the slinger anyways.

      Next things you need are:
      military: spearmen, galley (shore), 2nd galley (shore)
      utility: 2nd settler, 2nd builder, trader
      district: holy site (better at shore/mountain), harbor (shore), campus (better at mountain)
      buildings: ancient walls
      Nice things include (not in any order):
      4th military unit, wonder, 2nd harbor, 2nd trader, 3rd trader, 3rd builder, lighthouse, monument, shrine, water mill(?) (river), 3rd settler, upgrade slinger(s) to archer

      If your capital is on the shore, at about turn 40 you should have (in addition to the above):
      capital: harbor, 2nd settler, trader (purchased)
      2nd city: 2nd builder

      If your capital is not on the shore, at about turn 40 you should have/be (in addition to the above):
      capital: holy site, 2nd settler
      2nd city: harbor (in progress), 2nd builder (purchased)
      Note that in this line that your 2nd city will probably have the first two builds be a Harbor and a Galley and will take your 2nd and 3rd buys (Builder and 2nd Galley).

      Harbors are really great, and with 2 early Harbors and a Lighthouse you are likely to get the first Great Admiral. This keeps you from needing to build a Quadrireme (which would otherwise be in the nice things include section above).

      I would send your Galley's opposite directions initially, but remember that you need to have both in play, so be very careful with the first one. When you can build Caravel bring them home right away because they get eaten for lunch by Quadriremes.

      JM
      Last edited by Jon Miller; January 3, 2019, 02:46.
      Jon Miller-
      I AM.CANADIAN
      GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

      Comment


      • #4
        Note to get holy site you need to find a natural wonder, for campus you need to meet opposing civs and for harbor you just need to be on the shore (2 fishing resources). This is another reason to do the harbor first line.

        JM
        Jon Miller-
        I AM.CANADIAN
        GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

        Comment


        • #5
          are you playing with the expansion? I think that barbarian behavior was changed a little in it, making it less likely that camps will spawn in such a way that you'll be inundated with red units early on.
          I wasn't born with enough middle fingers.
          [Brandon Roderick? You mean Brock's Toadie?][Hanged from Yggdrasil]

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          • #6
            I am not playing with the expansion. That's for next year?

            JM
            Jon Miller-
            I AM.CANADIAN
            GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

            Comment


            • #7
              Rise and Fall is already out. Gathering Storm lands in a few weeks.
              I wasn't born with enough middle fingers.
              [Brandon Roderick? You mean Brock's Toadie?][Hanged from Yggdrasil]

              Comment


              • #8
                I have time and financial constraints. Since I just got Civ6 for Christmas I can probably enjoy vanilla until my birthday... or at least summer (or next year).

                JM
                (or, honestly, one of the other many games I purchased when I was single (or even childless) when I had both more time and more money.)
                Jon Miller-
                I AM.CANADIAN
                GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                Comment


                • #9
                  every once in a while steam runs a good sale. I'll try to remember you next time.
                  I wasn't born with enough middle fingers.
                  [Brandon Roderick? You mean Brock's Toadie?][Hanged from Yggdrasil]

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thanks. I think normally the sales are summer, cyber Monday (my birthday time period) and Christmas. That is why I say summer, birthday or next year.

                    If Civ6 is good (it appears to be) I will get an expansion then.

                    Time is the much bigger constraint than the finances... I just would rather stop by local coffee shop an extra 4 times this next month rather than have an expansion to a game that I might only play 10 hours this year (although currently I am enjoying it, so it would be much more).

                    JM
                    Jon Miller-
                    I AM.CANADIAN
                    GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      This is a game I am going to play all the way through. I am currently at 700 AD still with 4 cities, I think that I maybe got too focused on development (I tend to do that). The French and the Polish are the weakest groups scientifically (at 700 AD). The French are going with an expansionist strategy and the Poles are going with a Religion strategy. I waited to go to war with the French until around 660 AD.

                      There are not a lot of minerals on my continent and so I went up a tech path that didn't get me Apprenticeship until near 660 AD.

                      Despite being third in Science I have tied with the most technology (25 at 700 AD) and I am 4th in Religion. I kept up in Science by not really doing a tech that I didn't have boosted until Apprenticeship (there was probably 1 or 2 others). Maybe I should have chased it harder and maybe I should have chased Science more (I only have 1 Library and 2 Campuses). I was a little slower on Trading this game than I have been on others, but it is still a key part of my strategy.

                      All my early wars were with Barbarians.

                      JM
                      Attached Files
                      Jon Miller-
                      I AM.CANADIAN
                      GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I didn't have an Aqueduct nor was declared War on, so both those were done without boosting. I had forgotten about the former. I completed the second sea resource later that turn (or the next).

                        JM
                        Jon Miller-
                        I AM.CANADIAN
                        GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The war against the Barbarians near Jambi is the first of what I would call a war. There was an even larger war down at the south of the continent and there was a naval war (which will probably have a land war after the French war).

                          JM
                          Jon Miller-
                          I AM.CANADIAN
                          GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I've also been playing since Civ I, though I was more mature than you at that time, and to me Civ VI is clearly the best of all the Civ games. Every one in fact has been better than the previous, and every one has had a legion of players who said the previous game was so much better. I think it's unwillingness to change and see the new game on it's own, which is easy since people invest many hours in the old game.



                            Lucky Patcher 9Apps VidMate
                            Last edited by nateboussad; March 20, 2019, 18:38.

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                            • #15
                              I am still playing the game I posted above, although very slowly (only 1-3 turns a play session, a couple times a week). This is why I haven't pursued multiplayer more.

                              I recently was declared war on by the 2nd/3rd players (I Think). I have been very strong, but I haven't done any wars but an early very dominant war that I declared. I am concerned that I will squander my military lead due to not understanding the size and interaction. This is the first time I have played past Middle Ages after all.

                              Here is my newest city. In the lands of my enemy.

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                              My older city, also near my enemies.

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                              I think my enemies are even in tech but behind in troops. They may no longer be behind in troops. My tech might even be one or two ahead (despite not making the most science).

                              Click image for larger version

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                              That is a point of expansion. I was going to attack (colonial war) France again but now I won't.
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                              This is the home country.

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                              And the point where I am considering an attack or defense.

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                              JM
                              Attached Files
                              Jon Miller-
                              I AM.CANADIAN
                              GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                              Comment

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