Air Units

[SSBLoveU]

Run Silent, Run Deep: Oh no, not another map! When will they invent computers! Air planes fly over land units???

[Hauldren Collider]

I am exiting from this battle of the jaywalk all stars. MxM, learn geometry and common sense.

[MxM]

I am exiting from this battle of the jaywalk all stars. MxM, learn geometry and common sense.

I know my geometry quite good, thank you. The common sense however is neither common nor sense

And I think it is "common sense" that maps look better and more natural on square grid.

However, since this thread is about air units, I suggest to transfer this discussion about hexes to another thread, called strategic view. It is more appropriate, I think.

[Blaupanzer]

On SODs, what about the Mongols, the Americans in France and Italy, the Germans just prior to invasion on the Eastern Front, the Russian invasion of Berlin, the Multiple armies in the Thirty Years War. All of these would have looked like SODs, especially the Mongols in Khwarizim, or Napoleon in Russia.

The easiest way to limit stacking would have been to return to the rule that said all members of the stack suffer the fate of the principal defender/attacker. Makes a player think long and hard about stacks without fooling with all kinds of special movement rules.

[wodan11]

Why do we need to limit stacking?

And, assuming we do, why do we want the easiest way out? That's rarely the best way.

[MxM]

I guess there are 2 reasons of why they want to have single unit per hex
1) You visually see better what is going on on the map. If you see a unit, that's it, it is not just the top unit of the stack
2) They wanted to make combat less mindless, where location of the units on the map plays some role, like in chess.

As for historical example of SOD, I do not see much difference between, say 10 units to be in the same hex, or taking 10 neighboring hexes. If anything, 10 hexes with units look even more intimidating.

[Dinner]

Greetings!


So...I have heard that hexes will be able to hold one military unit and one air unit.


Does this mean that we will be able to base air units just anywhere? And what about Aircraft Carriers? Will they even exist? Or are we going to get stuck with something like the auto loading units for amphibious attacks?

Anybody know?

I think you can also put one worker or settle stacked with a defensive unit. As for how you station air units, I'm not sure but I'd guess you'd have to put them in a city or on an aircraft carrier though maybe they'll let your workers build an air field or something.

[Dinner]

I guess there are 2 reasons of why they want to have single unit per hex
1) You visually see better what is going on on the map. If you see a unit, that's it, it is not just the top unit of the stack
2) They wanted to make combat less mindless, where location of the units on the map plays some role, like in chess.

All true though I'm going to miss dropping a giant stack of doom on my enemies. There is nothing like attacking across the border with a stack of 50 units knowing there is no way in hell the other guy can stop you.

[Hauptman]

One of the biggest issues I ever had with cIV was that there was no reason to defend a border, and wars did not have a front. It was simply my stack vs thier stack followed by a dash towards the next city. Such things as Pincer attacks and encirclement meant absolutely nothing.

However 1 unit per tile (ala panzer general) may bring up the frontage style war but then removes the ability to actually concentrate forces. Wich will just replace 1 problem with another. How am I going to outsmart my enemy with a sneak attack through the ardennes when the ardenne can only hold 1 single unit.... and it is just as strongly defended as any other location, because 1 unit per tile is 1 unit per tile...

So what happens when you build more units than you have available tiles???

This strikes me as pure fail.

On the hex vs square topic. Gameplay-wise squares are/were better simply because 8 directions looks and feels more natural than 6. On a east/west map as in PG, it worked just fine but civ is a game where you are working in all dirrections. The snakey north/south movement will cause issues with both imersion and game play.

Has anyone working on CV ever played (or even seen) the Total War games? Granted you cant just steal there set up, but you could come up with a similar style.

[wodan11]

However 1 unit per tile (ala panzer general) may bring up the frontage style war but then removes the ability to actually concentrate forces.

Seems like you're making assumptions on the method of implementation, drawing conclusions based on your assumptions, and then complaining about your conclusions.

[Nikolai]

So what happens when you build more units than you have available tiles???

How do you know you'll be able to build or even support such an army?

[Hauptman]

Seems like you're making assumptions on the method of implementation, drawing conclusions based on your assumptions, and then complaining about your conclusions.

Well, yeh. I havent exactly played civ 5 yet... I have played the Panzer General games and this looks to be following that kind of combat system. Wich while beeing fun in those games with limited numbers of units may not carry over to a grand strategy world game. Time of course will tell. Even if they make a completely unplayable pile of the worst game ever... I'm nowhere near done playing CIV, so no big loss.

[Brael]

So what happens when you build more units than you have available tiles???

I think the only way this would be possible is a very resource rich start in a OCC? I was under the impression each resource would only allow you to build x number of units.

[Dinner]

That's what I heard too so the old OCC is likely going to be dead.

[Shogun Gunner]

Many of us have discussed the old Avalon Hill, SPI, et al war games with maps designed with HEXES. I'm glad Civ 5 is giving this a try. Tactics 2 (one of the original board war games) had squares, and I believe every single board war game that followed was built on hexes.