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**Gramphos** · July 17, 2002, 17:21

Very interesting project.

**Fatwreck** · July 17, 2002, 17:42

I can´t wait to play this one Trip... although I think you´ll need some more variation to the units...
Maybe you should use Adv. Infantry and entrenched Inf like in the civ2 cilvilwarscenario?
Just a thought

...

And will you have to use research to get all of the present units or do you have them from the start?

Anyway keep working

**Jon Shafer** · July 17, 2002, 17:48

I'll probably add some more units later. More 'veteran'-ish units. I'll probably add a rifled Artillery unit as well. But I need ideas.

The Advanced Infantry and Entrenched Infantry are good examples. However, I don't think they really fit in this kind of scenario. Early units were Muskets, then later Rifled Muskets. The same with artiller: Smoothbore cannons to rifled ones. I'll try to come up with more ideas for units.

**Fatwreck** · July 17, 2002, 17:57

Originally posted by Trip
More 'veteran'-ish units.

One idea is to call your first riflemen Regular rifleman then (if this EVER becomes a possibility) trigger an event that makes all of these Regulars: Crack Troops
Or just create a unit that is called crack Troops and upgrade them the ordinary way...

And the early musket - later rifle muskets: Use it like that, no need to get technical...
And give the rifled ones a boost to defence rather than offence...

**Jon Shafer** · July 17, 2002, 18:03

I'll certainly have to playtest everything first, but thanks for the suggestions, I will keep them in mind!

**Fatwreck** · July 17, 2002, 18:12

Anytime

... hope it won´t take to long...

**Fatwreck** · July 17, 2002, 18:15

BTW IIRC I don´t think that ironclads were in use from the start, i think it was the confederates who came up with the idea and then the union used them as well...

**Jon Shafer** · July 17, 2002, 18:31

I know, but I'm sure either could have built them at any time. Neither will start with them, and they're fairly expensive, so I doubt many will roam the seas for some time.

I wanted to make some kind of "Veteran" infantry unit for later in the war. It would represent: a shift from smoothbore muskets to rifled ones, as well as the increasing numbers of veteran troops. This would allow for both an increase of the attack and defense of the units (since half of the attacking during this era involved gaining the courage to run forward with a thousand guns aimed at you... veterans were more apt to do this than green troops).

I think I will make it a 9/12 for both sides... not sure what to call it yet. "Veterans" would work, except I don't want to have a popup saying "your Veteran Veterans have become elite".

**FrustratedPoet** · July 17, 2002, 19:23

I'm looking forward to playing this. I don't really know anything about the history of the period, but it seems like the perfect setting for a Civ3 scenario.

**Jon Shafer** · July 17, 2002, 20:15

Originally posted by FrustratedPoet
I'm looking forward to playing this. I don't really know anything about the history of the period, but it seems like the perfect setting for a Civ3 scenario.

I hope to make it so that you'll be impressed with it.

If you have any suggestions, then any and all are welcome.

**Ed O'War** · July 17, 2002, 21:02

I also posted on your thread at CivFanatics, but I just had a few more ideas:

1) Observation Ballon - A flying unit that can only do reconnaissance missions.

2) Something with gatling guns, probably primarily a defensive unit.

Also, I believe at the beginning of the war (and throughout the war) most troops used muzzle loading rifles that fired minie balls (no, I'm not trying to make a joke with that name, that's what they were called). Minie balls were slightly smaller than the diameter of the barrel of the rifle (most of which were about .50 cal I believe), with a hollow cone at the base of the bullet. When fired, the gas hit the hollow base and expanded it so the bullet would fit the rifled grooves. This coupled rifle accuaracy and range with high rates of fire, at least until breach loading rifles came into wider use.

Eventually the North developed the Sharpes rifle, which was a repeating rifle that held about 7 shots. Mostly cavalry carried this rifle, though they would often dismount to fight on foot.

A great source for information about the Civil War is www.thehistorynet.com. They have information about leaders, battles, the development of new weapon systems (such as the confederate sub who's name escapes me now), social changes brought about by the war, etc. I think they have an entire section of articles dedicated to the Civil War.

**Jon Shafer** · July 17, 2002, 21:28

Originally posted by Ed O'War
I also posted on your thread at CivFanatics, but I just had a few more ideas:

1) Observation Ballon - A flying unit that can only do reconnaissance missions.

2) Something with gatling guns, probably primarily a defensive unit.

Also, I believe at the beginning of the war (and throughout the war) most troops used muzzle loading rifles that fired minie balls (no, I'm not trying to make a joke with that name, that's what they were called). Minie balls were slightly smaller than the diameter of the barrel of the rifle (most of which were about .50 cal I believe), with a hollow cone at the base of the bullet. When fired, the gas hit the hollow base and expanded it so the bullet would fit the rifled grooves. This coupled rifle accuaracy and range with high rates of fire, at least until breach loading rifles came into wider use.

Eventually the North developed the Sharpes rifle, which was a repeating rifle that held about 7 shots. Mostly cavalry carried this rifle, though they would often dismount to fight on foot.

A great source for information about the Civil War is www.thehistorynet.com. They have information about leaders, battles, the development of new weapon systems (such as the confederate sub who's name escapes me now), social changes brought about by the war, etc. I think they have an entire section of articles dedicated to the Civil War.

Is there a balloon graphic? I remember seeing one somewhere... but that's probably not for Civ 3.

The problem with adding endless units now becomes the availability of graphics, since I'm not exactly an animator.

The Gatling wouldn't be a bad idea... not sure how exactly to impliment it though. They didn't have that much significance in this conflict, so I don't want to make them too powerful, but if I make them weaker, then people will be compelled to just use regular infantry instead.

I just looked at a site about the Civil War yesterday, and a lot of what you said was included (including the "Minie Ball".. I thought it was something out of a Walt Disney movie

).

**Ed O'War** · July 17, 2002, 21:50

I don't know about a ballon unit, but pesoloco did a dirigible unit over at CivFanatics. It's not perfect, but would do as a stand in until something better comes along.

As for gatling guns, maybe you should just drop them. As you mention, they didn't play that big of a role, and they were probably weren't independently deployed anyways.

**Captain** · July 17, 2002, 22:14

Trip, I think your map needs more forests...

I know units cost pop points, but this seems to favour the western part of the map too much, which wasn't the case in the civil war, was it?

or maybe i just can't see the map well enough...

sounds cool anyways

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SCENARIO: The United States Civil War

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