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**Badtz Maru** · December 20, 2001, 23:18

I think some of your Worker Rates are too high. The Corporate State will probably be had by the time you have Replaceable Parts, which also greatly increases the speed of your workers. With a Worker Rate of 6 a non-Industrious civ will have workers as fast as an Industrious civ running a Democracy, which is already so fast (by the time you add Replaceable Parts) that most improvements can be made in 2 turns with a single worker. If you combined that government with an Industrious civ they would be putting roads, irrigation, mines, and fortresses in one turn with a single worker and be able to mow down jungles and forests in no time with small teams of workers. Seems a bit much, despite the drawbacks and the fact that by the time you get it you will have made almost every improvement you want, anyway.

**David Murray** · December 21, 2001, 19:10

"New World Order"?

You mean...some kind of Jewish conspiracy that kooks like to talk about when they aren't wearing their white hoods?

**Keyser Soze 0** · December 23, 2001, 23:59

Re: Realistic Government Mod

Originally posted by Duddha
All of the starting governments are the same. The unit cost on all governments has been doubled(I'm tired of democracies and republics fielding lagre armies).

One of the largest, if not THE largest, armed force, is under a democratic republic...

**Duddha** · December 24, 2001, 14:30

I made some changes and now to respond.

Badtz Maru: I'm glad you noticed the worker rates were to high. I put them back to how I first had them (I changed them to try and get the computer to play those govs). Forgot to mention that I changed dem worker rate to 2 instead of 3. This helps to balance dem with the others.

David Murray: I hope I haven't scared you. My "New World Order" gov is like the globization were all the modern govs are mixed together. I know it sounds silly to have a globilzation gov for one civ at a time.

Keyser Soze 0: My change to the unit cost is based to real life. America is able to support a large army because of its size, nothing more. If you play civIII, with the change, you'll find that if your civ is in its golden age, big, and under democracy it is easy to build a large army.

Hope to post the mod soon.

**David Murray** · December 25, 2001, 13:55

Originally posted by Duddha

David Murray: I hope I haven't scared you. My "New World Order" gov is like the globization were all the modern govs are mixed together. I know it sounds silly to have a globilzation gov for one civ at a time.

I see what you mean now--as in, One World government. Interesting...that could probably work if only Firaxis gave us more flexibility in the editor.

Actually, that one world government thing is a good idea for a conspiracy-based scenario...Firaxis, how about giving us a decent editor?

**sjanich** · February 15, 2002, 19:03

my new govs

Here is the gov structure that I have playing around with:

Despotism
Tyrannical Priesthood
Imperial Buerocracy
Feudal Monarchy
Timocracy
Rebublican Oligarchy
Western Liberal Democracy
Totalitarian Dictatorship
Authoritarianism
Theocracy
Fundemental Theocracy
Social Democracy
Green Democracy

Depotism is the the same as the default. It includes anc ient one man rules and simple top down monarchies.

Tyrannical Priesthood comes with Mystisism. Think of ancient priest run small nations. I tweaking the settings. In playtesting the AI has often not used it (but it is hard to tell early in the game).

Imperial Buerocracy is with Code Of Laws. Think the Confustioist Chinease Empire. Lawyers and public servents carrying out the Empire demand. A later version would be the British Empire that ruled in India and elshwere. Productive, but don't rush them. Not a good warfighting gov. The AI uses it alot.

Feudal Monarchy is renamed from the standard civ3 monarchy. The rule book says it it is feudal monarchy so I renamed it that. The AI doesn't use it too much.

Timocracy is sort of a corrupted Feudalal Monarchy. COmes with Feudalism. I cripped from someone else s posting. The AI uses it rarely.

Republican Oligarchy is renamed from the civ3 Republic. I tried to break out Greco-Roman Republic, Confederate League, Emerging Democracy, Etc, but I found it too hard to differentiate within the game paramaters as they are. The AI uses it, but less frequently after I started addingother types.

Western Liberal Democracy is the renamed civ3 democracy. I aslo called it Modern Democracy for awhile. I chaned its name to differentiate from some other forms. I tweaked it slightly, too. The AI uses it.

Totalitarian Dictatorship is renamed from the civ3 communism. In practice, Communism (Lenninsist, Stalinist,Maoist, etc), Fascism, Nazism, Peronist, Military Dicatororship, really don't differ much. The game parameters don't leave much room tobreak them out. So, I just combined them under one name. The AI makes use of it soemtimes.

I created Authoritianism (comes with Nationalism) as a watered down Totalitarian Dicatorship. But, I found while play testing, neigther myself or the AI really ever used. So, I will most likely remove it and consider those types of governments to come under the Totolitarian Dictatorship category.

Theocracy comes with Theology. Think Papal States, Holy Roman Emprie, current Saudi Arabia, etc. The AI does make use of it.

Fundemental Theocracy becomes available with Industrilization (as a reaction to it, actually). This is similiar to the Civ2 fundementalism. The AI does make use of it.

Social Democracy with Sanatation. Units cost more, work a little less productive. Hard to differentiate it Western Liberal Democracy with game parameters. The AI didin't use it as far as I could tell.

Green Democracy with Ecology. Units cost more, work a little less productive. Hard to differentiate it Western Liberal Democracy with game parameters. The AI didin't use it as far as I could tell.

Corporate Republic (with Computers) Corportation really run the nation with Western Liberal Democratic institutions just be a facade to some extent (that could never happen, could it?) A little better productivity. Handles war weariness better, but the draft don't happen. I nice balanced alternative.

In the last playtested game, as I reached near the end, the 16 civilization has turned into 5. One of Fundemental Theocracy, One of Imperial Beurocracy, two of Western Liberal Democracy, and One Coporate Republic.

I could post my setting if anybody want.

**exsanguination** · February 15, 2002, 22:20

Re: Realistic Government Mod

Originally posted by Duddha

City States: pre-masonry
Support: 1 town, 1 city, 1 metropolis
Hurry production: paid labor
Draft limit: 1
Military police: 0
Corruption: rampant
War weariness: high
Worker rate: 2
Requires mantinance
Assimilation chance: 4
Rate cap: 6

corruption = rampant? If you are talking about the Greek city-states (govt called the polis) corruption was almost nonexistent except for in the aristocracy, where even there it was very minimal. Please Explain YourSelf.

**Optimizer** · February 16, 2002, 17:12

Duddha, I do not understand what the socialist government is supposed to be. To me, "between communism and democracy" sounds like "between fire and ice". Can you please give an example from history?

**Willem** · February 16, 2002, 17:50

Re: Realistic Government Mod

Originally posted by Duddha

All of the starting governments are the same. The unit cost on all governments has been doubled(I'm tired of democracies and republics fielding lagre armies). I find that this simple change brings back the government's influence on an army's size seen in civ 1 and 2.

I was thinking about doing that with my Democracy and Republic, how does it work out in the game? Have you played against a Communist gov yet?

**Joe R. Golowka** · February 17, 2002, 04:40

Originally posted by Optimizer
Duddha, I do not understand what the socialist government is supposed to be. To me, "between communism and democracy" sounds like "between fire and ice". Can you please give an example from history?

I think he's either referring to cradle-to-grave welfare states like in Scandinavia, some form of Market Socialism like in Yogoslavia under Tito or perhaps some Utopia that hasn't been attempted yet (Bellamy or something). The term "socialism" is very vague and need not be incompatable with democracy (it depends on what you mean by the word).

**Duddha** · July 28, 2002, 19:02

Wow, I didn't realize more than two ever responded to this thread. My government mod has changed since I posted this thread. Here is a list of what I currently have in my mod:

Despotism
City States
Deuscracy(couldn't think of a good name, early Theocracy)
Imperial
Republic
Monarchy
Feudalism
Theocracy
Constitutional Monarchy
Confederation
Democracy(almost forgot

)
Stratocracy
Imperialism
Socialism
Communism
Fanaticism
Corporate State
Fascism
Neo-Imperialism

Each one has a unique Wonder and two specifc improvements, like the early Balancer mod.

If more people are interested I'll post some specifics about the govs.

Duddha, I do not understand what the socialist government is supposed to be. To me, "between communism and democracy" sounds like "between fire and ice". Can you please give an example from history?

Think Sweden, I could have called it Welfare State but I think Socialism is a better name and it allows people to think of it the way they want.

**Optimizer** · July 29, 2002, 00:21

Isn't Sweden democratic?

Shall I feel insulted?

**zulu9812** · July 29, 2002, 05:51

Originally posted by Duddha
If more people are interested I'll post some specifics about the govs.

I'd actually like to know more about your whole mod, including the Wonders. Is it posted here on Poly?

**HazieDaVampire** · July 29, 2002, 06:42

hehe, Majestic 12. I love killing them MJ12 guys on Deus Ex!

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