MOD: Civ3 Fascist Patch

[squeeze truck]

Originally posted by morb
what's unrealistic about the communist gov't in the game is that there is a reduced level of corruption. having experienced communism first hand, I can say that corruption should fall under the "more than rampent" catagory. But then, there would be no advantage to this form of gov't in the game, just as in the real world.

I think the communist governments in ALL the civ games have been just bass-ackwards.

Agreed, corruption should be off the scales. But the science rate should be about as good as a republic (the Soviets *did* launch sputnik after all...) just not as good as a democracy.
The use of forced labor to complete projects is so stupid it's insulting. Either make it impossible to rush-buy (I like this idea, given their corruption and increased industrial output), or use money. Communists *do* use money, folks.
And communist governments do get war-weary. Remember Afghanistan?

Lack of war-weariness in the modern age should be reserved for the fascist government. That's where it belongs.

[hurdygurdy]

Fascism and 1.16f

Has anyone quantified the effect of applying 1.16f on top of the Fascist patch? At first glance, it appears that the patch wasn't (partially) installed. I mean, the Fascist entry in the Civlopedia still exists as well as the modified naval unit statistics.

I am not far enough along in the game to note whether or not the Civilopedia was unchanged, but yet the government and naval units have been removed.

Cheers,
/hg

[facistdictator]

Im not very good at modding but, can someone please post the fascist patch with just one little thing changed in it. I love Wolfshanse work i just need to have the fascist patch with paid labour instead of forced labour. Can someone do this for me then post it here, or tell me exactly how to do it.

[dannyevilcat]

Well, I disagree. Don't take this as an attack, but...

The use of forced labor to complete projects is so stupid it's insulting

Uhhh... Read up on Stalin in the 30's. Modernizing Russia or China (I.E. hurrying improvements) cost a lot of blood. If you want to be a happy commie, don't force labour your people, and suddenly you have what you want-- no ability to rush-buy. Congrats! You are now stagnant!

And communist governments do get war-weary. Remember Afghanistan?

AFAIK, the Soviets withdrew for economic reasons and lack of success, and not to appease thousands of University students, etc, crowding the streets to demand peace as happens in democracy. Therefore I don't think it really constitutes war-weariness of the population, though undoubtedly the war was increasingly unpopular.

Different topic:
Also, I read alot of misconceptions of Fascism and how they should be able to support gazillions of free units or whatever, and be the ultimate all-time big bad military government.

Yes history shows us that Fascist nations plunged the world into it's most destructive conflict. However, Germany's armed forces were practically the exact same size as what the French and British fielded during the battle of France. Italy was pitiful. Spain had no desire for more bloodshed after the civil war and Japan (if you call it fascist) had a poor man's army who's greatest merit was the tenacity of it's soldiers but which were fighting weak, divided Chinese defenders.
Russia... China... communist countries... they had/have enormous amounts of manpower (units) which can be simulated through the free support system. But America has the world's most powerful army... in Civ terms they are paying the entire cost of that.
I feel more and more that fascism in Civ3 should'nt provide free support.
I could probably make a case that Fascism should suffer mild war-weariness too (but still able to impose martial law). The Nazis were slow to mobilize their war-time economy for fear of reducing the luxuries available to Germans, and blitzkrieg was designed to be swift and crushing for a reason...
However that would be no fun, I suppose, because if you want to play a fascist gov't in Civ, it's almost certainly to lauch aggressive war upon all those who anger you.

[EarnhardtFan]

This may be a stupid question, but are you going to redo this mod so as to be compatable with Civ III v 1.16f?

[Wolfshanze]

Originally posted by EarnhardtFan
This may be a stupid question, but are you going to redo this mod so as to be compatable with Civ III v 1.16f?

Not at all a stupid question... Wolf was deployed to the Persian Gulf for a few months, but now I'm back... one of my projects is to update the Fascist Patch for v1.16 and do a few minor spruce-ups on the patch!

[werdhertz]

this is a very nice mod wolf, ive been looking for another modern era government in the game for awhile and since i have no idea how to make them ive been looking here... works out very nicely, i like the empires vs empires thing... as for the nazi stuff, you can be interested and read and study as much as youd like about them or any others like stalin and mao and such, as long as you dont idealize them or put them on a pedestal that they dont deserve to be on is fine with me.. im interested in tyrants and stuff like that too. but theres a difference between being interested and wanting knowledge and being a zealot (thats directed to that facistdictator guy)

NICE MOD

[iGod]

I love what you've done with the fascism patch, but i just have one question. Is there any way to undo the chages of the hitler patch apart from re-installing the game, i prefer Brismark as the leader, afterall he was the principal founder of Germany.

Thanks

[Wolfshanze]

New Releases

Originally posted by iGod
I love what you've done with the fascism patch, but i just have one question. Is there any way to undo the chages of the hitler patch apart from re-installing the game, i prefer Brismark as the leader, afterall he was the principal founder of Germany.

Thanks

Okay, to try and make everybody happy (or at least as many as I can), I have released TWO new versions of the Fascist Patch.

Just visit the Fascist Patch website for the two latest versions... one is an improved Hitler version, and the other is a NO Hitler version (just has the normal Fascist Patch with no changes to Bismarck).

Both versions are fully v1.16 compliant.

As for previously installed versions, I recomend a re-install to get exactly what you want, or at least restore the backed up files you replaced (if you didn't back them up, you may as well re-install)... then choose which version you want (with or without Hitler), install the v1.16 official patch, then the appropriate Fascist Patch!

Enjoy!

[facistdictator]

Hey Wolfshanze just wondering if the fascist unit was still on your list of creation for the fascist patch. Rock on!!!

[prince_aki]

I will not download this fascist patch as is, because of its use of the Swaztika. In other posts in this thread, I understand that there is a debate about what symbol is most associated with fascism. The answer is the Swaztika; I agree with this. Yet, I think that there is a more important question to asked. What is most commonly associated with the Swaztika? Hint: It's not fascism or anything religous.

So, Wolf, would you please consider modifiying the Hitler - less version of the patch, to also not include the Swaztika? If not, I understand, and I will not bother asking again.

Fascistdictator, you are obviously, atleast sub-conciously, a Nazi sympathizer. I understand, after reading on of your posts, that you have Nazi material in your room. Well, it's generally accepted that the contents of a person's room generally reflect their interests and personality. Personally, I don't have a problem with this part of your personality, because I don't care to know you or burden myslef with anybody elses problems besides my own. Although, I do think that it's hypocritical that you outright dismiss any affinity to the negatives of Hitlerism/Nazism. I am quite sure that you realize that a nazi flag, or whatever memorabilla you have, represents everything associated with the actions of the Third Reich.

[facistdictator]

Prince aki I really dont give a big crap what you think of me or my personality. Now I have to admit that the first time I saw a picture of a nazi flag I was mesmerized and thought to myself that it was the most powerful thing I had ever seen. I'll also admit the first time I saw a documentery on the Nazi's and seen line upon line of troops standing completely still to listen to one man on a podium, I said to myself now thats what I call POWER!! So I guess you could say I'm more attracted to the spellbound power of Nazi Germany. I really hate the fact that they slaughtered all those jews, thats what made the nazi's have a bad name. I mean to me they had the coolest military uniforms in history, the most awesome symbols, hell you could just say they were a modern day roman empire, see thats what im attracted to, not the fact that they killed innocent people. Now their drive to actually conquer the world well I like that, and dont see anything wrong with it. You know what really binds me to nazi ideaology, the fact that they believed in something so strong that they were willing to lay their lives down for it. America's people do the same thing only for freedom, but because they were the enemy we are taught that they were wrong. Well who is it to say who's right and who's wrong, I say surely not man.

[Wolfshanze]

Thanks

Prince Aki, thanks for having a reasonable post and not getting all bent out of shape over the patch. As for Swastikas and Hitlers, I do understand that somepeople just get all worked up over that sort of thing, and that's why there is a "no-Hitler" version of the patch.

For the record, the "no-Hitler" version of the patch (as well as the one with Hitler) have a "Fasces" option for Fascism. In other words, both versions of the patch can be installed WITHOUT SWASTIKAS.

All you have to do is download whichever version interests you and read the install instructions... NOBODY IS FORCED to install Swastikas, it is an option as to what you want to view in the patch!

[Bos]

Civ Governments

I read the first page in this topic until I realized there were many many more pages... so perhaps someone has already brought this up:

In Civ II, the communist government does not seem to be the one employed by such governements as the Soviets once followed. Instead, it seems to be the more ideal form; and I personally believe it to be the best government in the game (note "personally" I know there are those who will disagree!).

However in Civ III I noticed a change toward the flawed, more realistic, form of government -- the ones that the Soviets fell prey to. One of the other replies in this topic made reference to some of the game's details dealing with corruption, which is what caused me to think of this.

While this communism is more realistic in the sense of modern history, for the Soviets fell prey to the human instincts of greed and jealousy; the ideal communism of Civ II has lasted for centuries in cultures such as pre-colonized Africa and, as relevant in the Civ III realm, the Iroquis had an incredibly advanced -- and primarily communist -- culture.

Might someone out there be able to create a mod for the more ideal form of Communism? Also, from reading this, Fanaticism seems to be a rather hated political system; but I personally like it because few other governments seem to like it. Along with Facism, it gives you a common enemy for other governments to turn against.

I just recently found this website and up until this morning had never even thought about modding Civ III. Unfortunately I do not have the game with me at this moment, but be assured I will be spending all my free time playing with its files! ...In the meantime any advice dealing with modding units, govs, and even entire civilizations would be quite nice. So if anyone out there has some free time to waste on a newbie to these boards, feel free to send me a message with some tips! Thanks for reading this far, everyone.

[Bos]

Nazi's Bad Name

After actually reading some of the more recent posts, I figure I also have something to say to that:

First, Italy has been through nearly sixty governments in the last few decades, so I have taken quite an interest in political formations (if you have not already noticed). So that will explain my last post as well as the majority of posts I will probably make in the future. Don't worry I'll try not to be too annoying...

To return to topic:
I actually have to partly agree with FacistDicator -- I think I understand what he means. I agree in that I disapprove of the slaughter of millions of people. However, when you truly look at the man that was Hitler, you see that he was not pure evil. He actually did much good for Germany. In the thirties, in a world falling to an ailing economy and in a nation still in pain from a war just over a decade past, Hitler managed to bring jobs to the people. He brought money to the populace and he gave them something to believe in: a powerful German homeland. He built the infrastructure that still dominates the nation -- particularly the Autobahn. He also led a beautifully executed military campaign that nearly worked -- had it not been for only a few battles that crushed the German morale: particularly Normandy on the Western Front and Stalingrad on the Eastern Front. He took over nearly all of Europe with a trained and massive military; and overtook Africa with unbelievably efficient tactics. He turned Germany from a third-world country to a first-rate superpower within a few years.

Had he gone about this in a slightly different approach -- sticking to strictly-military campaigns and not drawing ethnic hatred into the mix, we could very well have a Nazi Germany today in place of the stuggling European Union; and again if he did not have his armies mercilessly slaughter innocents, he may have even been remembered as a hero.

None of that romanticism happened, of course, and it was his own bloodlust that both brought him to power and then destroyed him.

Of course, there are some good things that have also come even after his death. Europe learned that radical nationalism is a bad thing and decided to become slightly more hesitant to be patriotic. Europeans had become untrusted and deemed dangerous, particularly when you consider that two world wars were just fought on its soil. Europe had also just been destroyed once, as Germany advaced throughout; and destroyed again as the United States moved in. It was because of Hitler's wrath that we learned we had to unite, so had it not been for World War II, there would have never even been a European Coal and Steel Commission, no European Union, and none of the steps in between. We would still be living in the third-world, with periodic wars to promote our own culture and to punish the heathens. Europe actually owes it to Hitler for what we are today.

Again, I do not praise Hitler for his slaughter; but he did indeed do many good things. That, I believe, is what FacistDictator was talking about. However, I understand that others wish to hold their own beliefs and see them from their own point of view; but when you have lived in a nation that had not only seen the wrath but lived it, you see things from a different perspective.