Why I may never play a CIV gm again after nearly 20 yrs

[hoppy43000]

Hi all tho my name may be new i'm not, I have to say "conquests" is at least for a single person desiring to play alone, a WASTE

Am i right or wrong the game is still CIVILIZATION, well after generating umpteen million worlds at avg regent level with all things random Ive seen a multitude of inequities that turn the game more into a war game than a game in which you create a lasting CIV

examples..I always play huge worlds hoping beyond hope i can begin to explore and create a civ without immediate war, this never seems to be the case tho in EVERY random generated world the AI sets you up to fail , example starting as americans, but within 3 turns of starting running into another civ like zulu's scout FOR chrissake i intentionally design a world to BE left alone yet the ai either packs all 7 civs next to you or places you on an island.. with no hope

another gripe is ship building what is the purpose of being a seafaring nation who can build a curragh, when a curragh cant carry anything ! you still have to reseaearch map making to move to a nearby island and just to get it takes an avg 30-70 turns without getting lucky whereas in Civ2 building a small ship or map making was a 1st level tech... they have exploresrs but by the time you reach the tech they are worthless! Another 1 sided AI thing is Scouts in any game you start god forbid your playing against the arabs or russians all the ai does is give them techs 10-20 turns in you meet 1 and they have every ancient tech ! then theres barbarians on almost all levels you cant do much of anything without them just popping up out of no where in droves, and Why have a major barbarian assualt setup to hit in every game when you hit construction ?

I'd like to see a level playing field wher you can build and play without mass barbarians or instant crowding by other races..

HMM new diplomacy where ?? they never to this day respect your borders..yet even when you respect thiers , even if playing against india your faced with mass armies...not everyone just wants to play civ aas a war game!

Yes we can design our own rules or set up barbarian agressoiveness , but Te AI places the civs why cant it do them equidistant and o change the race with scout so they have an equal chance of getting barbarians as a teech or city, just the fact they have them should be advantage alone

My point here is that in conquests they've eliminated the single player fun of the game yes the multi and various scenarios are fun, but i for 1 would like to play a gm on an avg lvel where i can go from start to finish without rebuilding a world or replaying a turn... things lihaving a civ declare war then just walk in with a conscript warrior and have him win vs an elite pikeman really irks me. And why is it that now when we do get a "warrior" from goody huts its salways the same warrior in other versions you occasionally got a horseman or archer it was random. or heeres another why let the AI generate a new city fromm goody huts that start with a high population ie 4-5 in a city.. by time you hit next turn half have already starved

i just see no fun left in the gm the Ai in single player is just given too many advantages.. and saDLY ITS TURNED ME OFF FROM BEING A DIEHARD CIV FAN TO NOT CARING IF I EVER PLAY wheres the fun in creating a self generated world? the AI should do that with a level playing field, at least in lower to mid levels. every gm ive had to "cheat" by starting over or viewing terrain 1st

these things need to chg

[Kuciwalker]

Why not just play with fewer civs? Then you'll get plenty of time to expand.

Also, set aggression to lowest.

[Capt Dizle]

hoppy,

I feel your pain.

jt

[Capt Dizle]

Really I smell a troll trap and I ain't biting.

[Jaguar]

Play with fewer civs than the map size's maximum number, and set AI aggressiveness to least aggressive.

[hoppy43000]

sky thats tho poin t tho in other version the distribution was spread out more evenly even with 8 civs theres no real reason on a huge map that you should run into 2-3 other civs in 1st 10 turns.. yet this seems to happen regularly..

sure less civs easier but my gripe falls more in no matter homany civs why is it that the ai always gravitates toward you.. ie sets many civs near you,,, has ai gravitate is citybuilding toward you etcc

what i was trying to say is the random generator should at least set you with a chance to survive Ive seen world created where you play romans on a huge content yet no where on that continent is iron available.

and based on the current tech tree design and lack of sea travel it could be in the ADs before you even have the abilty to travel to another island... what im saying is seafaring WAS around 4000 yrs ago why in this gm does it now take so long to effectively get it you concieveably must research 3-4 tech before having basic sea travel. in Civ2 this wasnt the case

playing less civs is the easy way out, id like to see better refinements in the AI and techs

[Tassadar500]

Originally posted by hoppy43000
sky thats tho poin t tho in other version the distribution was spread out more evenly even with 8 civs theres no real reason on a huge map that you should run into 2-3 other civs in 1st 10 turns.. yet this seems to happen regularly..

sure less civs easier but my gripe falls more in no matter homany civs why is it that the ai always gravitates toward you.. ie sets many civs near you,,, has ai gravitate is citybuilding toward you etcc

what i was trying to say is the random generator should at least set you with a chance to survive Ive seen world created where you play romans on a huge content yet no where on that continent is iron available.

and based on the current tech tree design and lack of sea travel it could be in the ADs before you even have the abilty to travel to another island... what im saying is seafaring WAS around 4000 yrs ago why in this gm does it now take so long to effectively get it you concieveably must research 3-4 tech before having basic sea travel. in Civ2 this wasnt the case

playing less civs is the easy way out, id like to see better refinements in the AI and techs

I don't think I am understanding you. What is your actual problem? Is it you have a hard time expanding or what?

[WarpStorm]

Firaxis intentionally puts players close together so that they start interacting early.

[CerberusIV]

Read a few history books. Why do you think Jericho had walls circa 7000BC?

It's called human nature. If you don't want to fight don't play civ.

[Antrine]

//wheres the fun in creating a self generated world?//QUOTE_hoppy43000

Hoppy there is immense fun in creating world after world...
And the AI definately needs to get a lot better, so it is as challenging as chess. Think strategy, an intricate epic war game.

If you require a more easy going adventure, learn to use the 'editor' for to accomplish the same. It's there, it works. Make some up and trade with another for to have 'a blind' if you like it that way.

I only play the way I want on my own modded games. If you are going to cry for anything, scream for ever more editor options until all there is an 'giant intuitive cosmic game editor' that spits out whatever one wants. Join the choir, I am already in the front row singing off-key.

Sincerely,
Antrine

[mrmitchell]

Re: Why I may never play a CIV gm again after nearly 20 yrs

Originally posted by hoppy43000
Hi all tho my name may be new i'm not, I have to say "conquests" is at least for a single person desiring to play alone, a WASTE

First of all let me congratulate you for being a DL

Am i right or wrong the game is still CIVILIZATION, well after generating umpteen million worlds at avg regent level with all things random Ive seen a multitude of inequities that turn the game more into a war game than a game in which you create a lasting CIV

Indeedy it is still CIV. And do you know what civs have been doing for the past 10000 years? Yes, that's right, they've spent their whole time beating the crap out of each other.

another gripe is ship building what is the purpose of being a seafaring nation who can build a curragh, when a curragh cant carry anything ! you still have to reseaearch map making to move to a nearby island and just to get it takes an avg 30-70 turns without getting lucky whereas in Civ2 building a small ship or map making was a 1st level tech... they have exploresrs but by the time you reach the tech they are worthless! Another 1 sided AI thing is Scouts in any game you start god forbid your playing against the arabs or russians all the ai does is give them techs 10-20 turns in you meet 1 and they have every ancient tech ! then theres barbarians on almost all levels you cant do much of anything without them just popping up out of no where in droves, and Why have a major barbarian assualt setup to hit in every game when you hit construction ?

Firstly, the point of carraghs might be just "exploration units" so you can get contact with more civs, and discover more land so you'll already have in mind what to settle later
Secondly, IIRC those massive barb attacks happen when another Civ SPOILERenters the Midieval ageSPOILER. You hitting Construction would just be a coincidence.

I'd like to see a level playing field wher you can build and play without mass barbarians or instant crowding by other races..

Go play SimCity. (BTW you can turn Barbs off, AND you can set the game to less Civs)

HMM new diplomacy where ?? they never to this day respect your borders..yet even when you respect thiers , even if playing against india your faced with mass armies...not everyone just wants to play civ aas a war game!

It's worth repeating that history is war and you should expect it. If you want to survive, build up a healthy defence. It's possible to do that and STILL kick ass and take names in the cultural arena.

Yes we can design our own rules or set up barbarian agressoiveness , but Te AI places the civs why cant it do them equidistant and o change the race with scout so they have an equal chance of getting barbarians as a teech or city, just the fact they have them should be advantage alone

Wha? Could you rephrase that?

My point here is that in conquests they've eliminated the single player fun of the game yes the multi and various scenarios are fun, but i for 1 would like to play a gm on an avg lvel where i can go from start to finish without rebuilding a world or replaying a turn... things lihaving a civ declare war then just walk in with a conscript warrior and have him win vs an elite pikeman really irks me. And why is it that now when we do get a "warrior" from goody huts its salways the same warrior in other versions you occasionally got a horseman or archer it was random. or heeres another why let the AI generate a new city fromm goody huts that start with a high population ie 4-5 in a city.. by time you hit next turn half have already starved

My, that's a mouthful
Actually, they kinda strengthened the Sci/Cultural side of Civ with C3C--now, GLs are divided between SGLs and MGLs, and only SGLs can rush Wonders. (And you can get a GL through more ways than just a war! )

i just see no fun left in the gm the Ai in single player is just given too many advantages.. and saDLY ITS TURNED ME OFF FROM BEING A DIEHARD CIV FAN TO NOT CARING IF I EVER PLAY wheres the fun in creating a self generated world? the AI should do that with a level playing field, at least in lower to mid levels. every gm ive had to "cheat" by starting over or viewing terrain 1st

You're just not playing well enough. It is VERY possible to play with Builder style and still win--check out the Strategy Forum (esp. the topped "MUST READ" thread) for hints and tips. It will improve your game by a full order of magnitude, at least.

It is a new game (or a new expansion pack onto one at least), it's going to have new things to get used to. Keep on trying, and remember to check out the strat forum

mrmitchell

[pauli]

mod the rules. jack up map size and civ spacing. that will give you plenty of time to expand.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by CerberusIV
Read a few history books. Why do you think Jericho had walls circa 7000BC?

It's called human nature. If you don't want to fight don't play civ.

I thought the earliest cities were around 3000 or 4000 BC in Mesopotamia

[hoppy43000]

guys you misunderstand I KNOW the game ive won all the way to sid mode

my issue is with the game design when you create random worlds try it in CIV 1 or 2 its a bit different

it isnt because i want an easier game thats easy i just want there to be a level wherein all civs are equal at start and thruout game rather than the computer controlled 1's having advantages, like arabs always getting techs,... contrary to popular belief that level doesnt exist.. you set any game up the way you want it, BUT nmy point is EVERY computer generated random world set you up so that the computer civs have distinct advantages, unless you pkay at the most basic level.

what i tire of is starting game after game

for example pauli i shouldnt have to jack up the rules, ive already chosen the largest possible maPB THEREFORE SPACING GENERALLY SHOULD BE MORE THAN A CIV 2 TURNS AWAY OR YOUR ENTIRE CIV ON AN ISLAND THE SIZE OFYOUR THUMB.. if i were playing sid level then yes but im not

[Antrine]

Funny I think generally the AI's are wimps. And on a map 360 by 306 with eight civs including yourself equally spaced out, I defy you even find another civ in less than 20 turns.

As far as, 'jacking up the rules', no it is a PRIVILAGE TO FINALLY HAVE AN EDITOR WORTH SOMETHING. Modders are not jacking up the rules, we are blissfully creating something you should be waiting in line to play.

Anyway, I say complain in the better direction, lobby for more choices on the start-up screens with a 'save routine' so once you find the mix right for you, you can keep randomly generating what you want. And I assure you, only so many others will even bother to agree with your choices and go on with their own, which is really the valid point.

Sincerely,