The Bloody Monk HOF Celebration Succession Game!!!

[-Jrabbit]

I'm curious: Have any AIs built a WoW yet? They usually like Pyramids and Great Wall first, but many a time I've lost Cope's when I thought myself safe...

I agree that trading for Astronomy, building Mike's and establishing SSC trade routes are the next key goals. Then, some new cities to finish off our island paradise while building the bank account with trade. Then force everything to size 3 and let the celebrations begin!

[Sharkbait]

Originally posted by Bloody Monk
Nice turnset, Sharkbait. Good work romancing the Japanese for Poly, getting HG, and adding cities. I wonder if building Col was timely, considering how small the SSC is now. If no AI was building it, those camels could have gone for trading or an earlier build of Mono. What you did wasn't wrong, not saying that; just thinking about what if...minimal impact -v- city wide happiness control.

I think it is not timely to mine the wheats in SSC just now. The usual practice is to irrigate them and change the silks to wheat so the SSC can grow to max size. Then, later, change them all to Silk, build a Gran and pop in a food van as needed. My biggest surprise is that the SSC doesn't have any trade routes yet. Getting 3 routes max rikki-tik in the SSC is the way to go.

With both building Colossus and the mining of the wheats, I was thinking of growth via WLTK when we went to Republic rather than growth through food. Suppose it depends on when the switch is made however as to which approach is preferable.

I also built Colossus as I didn't check in detail how long it would take to get Monotheism. I thought it would take longer since I had tax at 70%, and I managed to deliver a third van quicker than I thought I might so got to Mono faster. Furthermore, I was pretty focused on getting more settlers out early.

The mining settlers will be pretty charged up now, so a switch to irrigation should be pretty immediate if the next player wants to change tack on that, although I would prefer to have one more silk for the van deliveries. There is one SSC van on the loose at the moment (either on a ship or just about to get on), and the van delivery that can happen next turn will no doubt let another SSC van be rushed (or else the cash can be used to rush more vans for Mikes). At least Colossus will give us the arrows of a Republic for the celebrating SSC when these deliveries are made.

A good point re getting Astro from the Indians immediately. This is my first game at MGE so I'm not familiar with the no-so-nice AI diplomacy.

Re AIs building wonders - the Americans stopped and restarted GL, and the Vikings have just begun it too. No other signs that I saw.



p.s. - re WYTM2MonkyTown - "Gotta make a move to a town thats right for me"..... I thought of this while reading the log and it stuck in my head. And it kinda fits the discussion about the location between Monk and ST.

[Bloody Monk]

Originally posted by Sharkbait

With both building Colossus and the mining of the wheats, I was thinking of growth via WLTK when we went to Republic rather than growth through food. Suppose it depends on when the switch is made however as to which approach is preferable.

Everyone thinks short term and misses the long term point.

The subject was maxing city growth...which relies on food surplus. With the additional food surplus from 4 wheats, irrigated, the city can WLove a lot longer than with 4 Silks. This is not about growing now under Monarchy, at all. It presumed the switch to Republic, or Democracy.

@ -Jrabbit

I wouldn't want us to confuse people, so can I amend your post to add something, please?? I think we need to get Construction (for Aquaducts), build Shakespeare, and prepare the SSC for growth, before we switch to Republic. Otherwise, the growth spurt will sputter. Fortunately, Sharkbait has us researching Medicine now.

Monk

[-Jrabbit]

I'm certainly in no position to judge timing for Republic.

FWIW, I typically do two bursts of WLTMonkD -- one targeted to size 8 (or 12, depending) then back to Monarchy and natural growth while racing to Democracy. I'm sure it's idiosyncratic, but it a method I used. (If you plan to move back to Monarchy, it's not "sputtering." )

[Bloody Monk]

On Sputtering

I agree, that's not sputtering. Assuming it takes a fair amount of time to get Engineering --> Sanitation, a move back to Monarchy is highly likely to be necessary. This means disbanding warriors during the 1st Republic is contra-indicated as they will be needed in the return to Monarchy.

And the leader needs to think closely how much to let the secondary cities grow. High luxury slider is okay during the spurt but will be a drain later. The SSC might need 20% to celebrate under Monarchy. That's one content, 3 warriors + Mike's is 6 more = size 7, for secondary cities w/o Temple. An eighth would probably be red which is balanced by HG.

No, what you described is not sputtering. Sputtering is holding with the SSC at size 8 for 6 turns because you don't have an AQ yet, or at size 9 because Shake's, and necessary irrigated tiles haven't been finished so you can't grow to 12 yet.

There is such a high support cost, units & Setts, in Republic that the "sputtering" I'm referring to is to avoided. That's why carrying extra Setts during Monarchy, so you can max the prep work early for each city, is better than trying to get those things done systemwide under Republic. Before Republic, when their work is done, the Setts can make more cities, or add to existing one's.

Monk

[-Jrabbit]

Sorry, can't take the reins. Somebody step up!

[Bloody Monk]

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!

Would someone care to be next?? The game is open to anyone but Sharkbait, our last player. I am not able to play; hopefully, I will be better soon.

Monk

[rjmatsleepers]

Happy thanksgiving!

I have a few things on my plate at the moment, so I can't step in right now either. However things look a little clearer next week when I'll try to pick up the batton.

RJM

[-Jrabbit]

We're currently getting our first snow of the season in Chicago. A perfect day to coccoon with the family and give thanks for all that is good in life.

Happy Thanksgiving to all!

[rjmatsleepers]

I managed to move us forward 10 fairly unexciting turns. I only discovered 2 techs (although I think we are very close to engineering) and only managed to deliver 6 vans for about 140 on average. I concentrated on the techs and wonders we need to switch to republic and grow valencia by celebration.

LOG

400BC Currently we need nearly 300 beakers per advance with perhaps 30 accumulated towards medicine; our key civ seems to be the Vikings. We have 9 active caravans; a potential demanded delivery of silk to either Hladir or Madras; hides and silk about to begin the sea voyage; hides between Syrabo and Barcelona and 5 food caravans for SSC building outside Valencia. There is a pesky barb archer near our chariot.

375BC Indians start Copes. Kill barb archer. Silk(d)->Madras(192)
350BC Rush Valencia van
325BC Delay delivery expecting to complete Medicine
300BC Medicine->Astronomy swap with Vikings for Astronomy. Hides(d)->Bangalore(88);Silk(u)->Bagalore(148). Rush Copes in Valencia
275BC Start researching Masonary; swap with Indians for Masonary
250BC Start researching construction. Rush hides in Valencia
225BC Wine(d)->Bangalore(110)
200BC Construction->horseback riding. swap with Vikings for horseback riding.
175BC Start researching warrior code. Swap with Indians for warrior code. Hides(d)->Bangalore(152);Gems(u)->Bangalore(164)
150BC Start researching wheel; swap with Indians for wheel. Rush hides in Valencia

RJM

[atomant]

-jrabbit, i believe shakespares may help with ship happiness, if all ships are rehomed to that city....

[rjmatsleepers]

Originally posted by atomant
-jrabbit, i believe shakespares may help with ship happiness, if all ships are rehomed to that city....

I would normally use Shake's for WLTK growth in the SSC. But Valencia is inland, therefore we cannot rehome ships there (unless there is a trick I don't know about). Can we celebrate Valencia without the Globe?

RJM

[Verrucosus]

This succession game is mimicking my own playing habits. I never get through a game in a single session, and 1 AD is about the time when I tend to take the first break.

Anyway, if I may, I would to play a set of turns tomorrow. Since there has not been a lot of discussion, I would appreciate some comments in advance. Is there a way to predict from rjm's log which of the tech groups will be available when I have to make the next choice? The Wheel is a group-2-advance, so the last list was either a 1-2 or a 2-0 list, but which one exactly seems difficult to calculate because of all the trading with the Indians.

[-Jrabbit]

We've been lying fallow for several days, so now would be a great time to grab the reins, Verrucosus. I think the main thrust at this point is to trade like crazy and prep for Republic, with an ultimate goal of Democracy.

Sadly, I can't offer any insight on the tech path beyond saying we want things that support the above goals...

[Verrucosus]

We are not far away from a number of helpful wonder advances (Gravity and Theology), but I'd prefer to wait for the Indians to finish researching University and the Vikings to finish Feudalism to get the prerequisites through trading. In the meantime, Medicine looks like a good short-term goal.

I think we can support additioonal cities once we build the Michelangelo's Chapel, but we also need to finish the road network and get more irrigations to have enough food to feed settlers and support growth under the Republic.

I know not everyone is as fond of city improvements as I am and I will keep the caravans coming and restrain myself from building temples everywhere, but could we make an exception and build a library in the science city?

Unless someone else has a chance to call the game first, I will be happy to play tomorrow. I'm off to bed now. Maybe I'll dream about caravans.