Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

MGE is obsolete!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    I think it's a good idea to revisit this issue every once and awhile, esp. when a new bunch of promising scenario designers pops up.

    For what it's worth, I hated ToT when it was released (some of those old threads may still be in the archives), even going so far as to call for the art director to be fired. The obvious rush to get it out to the stores before Microprose was sold was obvious in the poor art, including lousy animations, and the lack of effort in the fantasy and sci-fi games.

    Mostly I hated it because the manual didn't give clear and detailed instructions for key issues, eg. the new events structure and the multi-map feature - another result of the last minute rush to complete it.

    However, thanks to William Keenan and Cam Hills, a fine set of tips was developed, which I still consult for every scenario. http://coc.apolyton.net/ With a bit of trial and error, and a little help from my friends, I grew to appreciate the possibilities of ToT.
    Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

    www.tecumseh.150m.com

    Comment


    • #17
      [SIZE=1]
      BTW.: Is there now a possibility in random maps, when I change land to sea-terrain with an event, to let some of the new coastal towns that were normally land towns, let produce ships now as normal units without reworking this map manually with a tool?
      If you create an inland city, and then change the terrain adjacent to ocean (by events or manually), the city is still seen by the AI as a landlocked city, and cannot build ships or improvements such as shipyards or coastal fortresses. Of course, you can use Mercator's 'CivCity' utility to make land cities able to build ships and sea improvements or vice versa.
      Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

      www.tecumseh.150m.com

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by techumseh


        If you create an inland city, and then change the terrain adjacent to ocean (by events or manually), the city is still seen by the AI as a landlocked city, and cannot build ships or improvements such as shipyards or coastal fortresses. Of course, you can use Mercator's 'CivCity' utility to make land cities able to build ships and sea improvements or vice versa.
        Thanks for the answer. So there is no new knowledge here, since I left Tot-modding some years ago. No chance for random sea-based space-maps for example with very small planet-systems (land) in it.

        Comment


        • #19
          You can control the number and size of land masses on the secondary maps. Check the link here: http://coc.apolyton.net/guides/secondary_maps.shtml

          There's also a section on this in the Prima strategy guide if you need more info.
          Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

          www.tecumseh.150m.com

          Comment


          • #20
            Thanks again for the answer. I never was able to buy the Prima strategy guide at that time, but I have seen that information in the "Craddle of Civ Site" some years ago and experimented with it, so I didn´t understand all.

            When I remember well after this break from ToT for several years, in multimaps, one map must be the standard map. When I want to have smaller landmasses than the smallest landmass available (lots of small insulas that work as planet systems for example, where the Civ 2 AI has enough possibility to expand over the sea, one of the methods I tried, was with the start of the game to transform lots of given land to sea by events. But there was always the problem, with the continental mass numbers that blocked a lot of planets to build (space-)ships.

            I than decided to do that scenario in another way.

            Comment


            • #21
              I hope to go back to my Vietnam scenario at some point and take advantage of ToT's multiple maps to create a fiendish network of tunnels in the Viet Cong version. When the time comes I will probably be asking for a lot of help

              I would also like to make Aeterna Civitas, WWII Europa, Bonaparte III and the Balkan Wars in SP ToT versions. In fact I think the current WWII Europa upgrade may be the last time I make a SP game with MGE. Obviously PBEM's will still need to be MGE so I won't abandon my baby completely
              SCENARIO LEAGUE FORUM
              SCENARIO LEAGUE WIKI SITE
              SL INFORMATION THREAD
              CIV WEBRING MULTIPLAYER FORUM

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by McMonkey
                Re: Map editors
                I just use the CivII map editor to create the map and then load the map file with ToT. (...) I seem to recall a ToT map editor on Mercator's site though I have not needed to use it yet.
                It's just a copy of the MGE map editor anyway (with gigamap creation support sneaked in). So if you have the map editor from another Civ2 version you don't really need it.

                Originally posted by McMonkey
                Re: Utilities
                As long as CivStack, CivTweak and CivCity are compatible with ToT then I will be a very happy man. I have not tried to use them yet but I find them invaluable for working with MGE.
                They are compatible. But CivCity doesn't support multi-map games.

                Originally posted by techumseh
                (...) Mercator's 'CivCity' (...)
                Gothmog's CivCity!


                I have to see I can see the point of both sides. I do think ToT is superior to MGE in most ways. And any attempt by MGE people to claim otherwise is futile. ToT does have its problems too, though. I think the ToT unit shield is awful for one.

                But I can agree completely about the "feeling". ToT is ugly. Yet despite the existence of graphics mods I never changed the default graphics of any version of Civ2. But that's partly also because I'd only want a complete and consistent, quality graphics mod.

                I always stick to the originals and don't like editing any standard Civ2 files, except for the executable strangely enough... And I recently took the bold move to edit in my smooth grid into FW.

                Which brings me to the fact that I probably like FW best of all. To play, that is. I don't play scenarios much anyway and I like the original graphics better. But I do play ToT too.
                Civilization II: maps, guides, links, scenarios, patches and utilities (+ Civ2Tech and CivEngineer)

                Comment


                • #23
                  No one ever tried to dispute that TOT is superior in many respects. But the point about the 'feel' is a major one for me personally. My point was simply that announcing MGE as obsolete is a very bold statement. Instead of trying to continue trying to impose TOT on everyone, the SL should respect that there are some MGE 'dissidents' here still.
                  Find my civ2 scenarios here

                  Ave Europa, nostra vera Patria!

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Have I heard some whispering about a ToT PBEM? Set it on, I sign in.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      @Mercator

                      Sorry for the error. BTW, can you post your smooth grid units and terrain files?

                      @Evind IV

                      I believe it to be true, however I respect your choice. The discussion is still relevant, esp. with some new members active.

                      @battosai

                      There are a few you could choose from: AE1200BC by Kull, Brown Man's Burden by Gothmog, or Roman Civil Wars by me. All are available on my site. http://www.tecumseh.150m.com/
                      Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

                      www.tecumseh.150m.com

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Thanks, I'm gonna check them.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Dr Kellogg

                          Good questions. Are you guys talking about that awful Fantastic Worlds editors or 3rd party tools like CivCity? The latter are mostly compatible with ToT.

                          The only thing I miss in ToT is a map editor...
                          I am sure Merc made a ToT-compatible map-editor.

                          The map editor I use works with ToT maps, in any case.

                          http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.php?title=Home
                          http://totalfear.blogspot.com/

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Eivind IV
                            No one ever tried to dispute that TOT is superior in many respects. But the point about the 'feel' is a major one for me personally. My point was simply that announcing MGE as obsolete is a very bold statement. Instead of trying to continue trying to impose TOT on everyone, the SL should respect that there are some MGE 'dissidents' here still.
                            We are all CIV2 people - I do not accept this rivalry between versions at all.

                            A schism between users of the same game is so predictably human...

                            http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.php?title=Home
                            http://totalfear.blogspot.com/

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              @Battosai
                              I am also interested to experiment with a ToT PBEM game. The only problem I can foresee is finding enough multiplayer people with a copy of ToT!

                              @Curtsibling
                              I agree about the human nature thing! I think everyone would be best off owning a copy of MGE and ToT and playing/supporting both versions.

                              LONG LIVE CIV II
                              SCENARIO LEAGUE FORUM
                              SCENARIO LEAGUE WIKI SITE
                              SL INFORMATION THREAD
                              CIV WEBRING MULTIPLAYER FORUM

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Indeed!

                                For scenarios, I use ToT - But for playing straight CIV2 games, I use MGE for the sheer vanilla experience!

                                http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.php?title=Home
                                http://totalfear.blogspot.com/

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X