Destiny of Empires [Diplo Game] [Organization Thread]

[Israel (DoE)]

So, I am as a matter of fact attacked by:
- Russia (biggest civ)
- Ottomans
- Arabia
- Mali

in other words: all my neighbors except the Zulu (who will most probably invade me tomorrow)

Is it really needed that a small nation like Israel is being dogpiled by that many enemies?
In an attack that include two betrayals?
I'm fine, I'll just contiue and it al fits perfect in all holocaust scenarios, but is this really diplo gaming?

For those who are keeping count:
- Ekron is razed
- Hebron has been conquered and lost 70% of it's buildings
- Nain is occupied by the Turks
- Jerusalem is razed (holy city)
- Sidon was given to the Mali under threath of war
- Tel Aviv (capital) is under siege by Russia and Ottomans (rifles vs muskets)
- Ai is going to be taken by the Turks in 2 turns (3 rifles vs 1 maceman)

That leaves me with 3 original cities in a couple of turns.
Please just continue, it would be a shame to abort it now. Now just finish it.

I'm just acting surprised that the Russians need Arabian mescenaries to invade Israel.
It's a bit as if the USA needs French troops when they invade Denmark or something.

[Russia (DoE)]

The Ottomans have pointed correct that there is no "fair for everyone" sub for the Arabs and I am glad that the original player will be back, if the Viks are correct in their guess.

And as I dont play to win at all costs, if anyone feels wrong of the Inca subbing the Arabs, despite the Inca is more of a good trade partner rather than the devoted ally Arabia was, I am ok the sub to be changed. I dont want any shade of suspicion about playing unfair to spot my name.

[Russia (DoE)]

About the countless friends and allies Russia have, it may only flatter me and assures me once again that I am the good one, and the Axis are the bad ones.

The Justice and the Truth are mighty weapons. Well, if not weapons as they cant make holes, nor break things, but a mighty banner at least they are

[Russia (DoE)]

I'm just acting surprised that the Russians need Arabian mescenaries to invade Israel.
It's a bit as if the USA needs French troops when they invade Denmark or something.

OK, after putting the things like this, I dont need Arabian troops right now and yet less to invade Israel, I just need to know that a whole nation and apparently my ally is not staying, not teching and not producing anything. Because of this situation, I did read the rules and there was a rule, where if a nation misses 10 turns in a row or 20 out of 25 last turns, it will be replaced with a permanent sub. Arabia did missed about 14-15 consecutive turns and I dont know why the host did not saw this earlier and reacted accordingly.

[Russia (DoE)]

I am sorry to say this, but I missed my turn as no one paused for me and will need reload.

If it is reloaded now, I can play in the next 30 minutes. Sorry again for slowing the game.

[Inca (DoE)]

For the record, Arabia is making defensive troops and infrastructure builds only right now. I'm a bit confused by the excessive courthouse builds, given the low maintenance costs, is that due to the AI (they've been going maybe 10T now) or Arab's original decision?

[Inca (DoE)]

RE: Inca-Russia alliance. I feel an "ally" would, in this case, be attacking Israel. Certainly, I have the means to contribute directly both in arms and logistics. I think my long story/RP post put my feelings fairly clearly: Inca prefers to remain fairly secluded with her actual arms and commitments, and dedicated to open trade and her merchants' profits.

Still, to be clear, there is a defensive pact and a long history of sales with Russia, among some other such agreements, so I am not perfectly unbiased in this. If someone else wishes to take my place as sub, I won't argue. I will just try to work in the Arabs' best interests for now, and it seems quite clear that their preexisting relations with Russia are in their best interests, although at present I'm just focusing on building up their own civ instead of another's.

[Russia (DoE)]

I have sent PM to Robert Plomp about the reload. I just want to save the people playing their turns and then having to replay them again.

[Ottoman Empire (DoE)]

So, I am as a matter of fact attacked by:
- Russia (biggest civ)
- Ottomans
- Arabia
- Mali

You have to take note that 3 of the Civs on this list you purport to be "dogpiling" you, are civs who lost many soldiers as a result of your infamous, spectacular backstab. This is well documented in France's beautiful story posts following the battles at Ekron Oasis. If you can betray and backstab 3 civs at a time, why can they not all attack you at once? What is so outrageous about that? And anyway the Arabs are not, and have never been at war with you. Trying to include Arabia as a nation who is :at War: with you is like me trying to include Neandor as a nation at war with me since you are obviously getting all those Cannons from Neandor.

Also, shall we include France as one of the Nations who is "at war" with me because they are sending Grenadiers to reinforce you and because they threatened war with Mali to protect you? Why arent you mentioning that in your calculation? Stop trying to make it seem like you are getting teamed up on for no reason and you have no one helping you. Eveyone knows that this just isnt true.

And if I were the Arabs, I would do everything in my power to maintain a buffer city like Damascus to keep my self from being bordered by such an infamous backstabber too.

As for Mali, you are at peace with Mali and Zulu AFAICT (and the Arabs for that matter), so its just the 2 civs you backstabbed that are truly at war with you. Is this really some big suprise? Are we supposed to just sit back and let you go around with an assasins dagger always at the ready, backstabbing at will, without any consequences?

[Inca (DoE)]

Arabia really isn't at war with Israel at present as far as the sub is concerned. Just thought I'd clear that up. I'm certainly not going to play loose with someone else's civ like that.

[Germany (DoE)]

Arabia really isn't at war with Israel at present as far as the sub is concerned. Just thought I'd clear that up. I'm certainly not going to play loose with someone else's civ like that.

Can you just allay fears that Arabia, seemingly rudderless for much of its time, is not giving significant gold per turn to Russia?

Russia has 900 gpt and maybe that is good playing but I just wondered if some of it is regularly gifted.

ACE allies do bits of this in short bursts but each player is 100% committed to their own civ.

Forgive me if I have a wrong interpretation here but as I say just need my fears put to rest.

[England (DoE)]

So, I am as a matter of fact attacked by:
- Russia (biggest civ)
- Ottomans
- Arabia
- Mali

in other words: all my neighbors except the Zulu (who will most probably invade me tomorrow)

Is it really needed that a small nation like Israel is being dogpiled by that many enemies?
In an attack that include two betrayals?
I'm fine, I'll just contiue and it al fits perfect in all holocaust scenarios, but is this really diplo gaming?

For those who are keeping count:
- Ekron is razed
- Hebron has been conquered and lost 70% of it's buildings
- Nain is occupied by the Turks
- Jerusalem is razed (holy city)
- Sidon was given to the Mali under threath of war
- Tel Aviv (capital) is under siege by Russia and Ottomans (rifles vs muskets)
- Ai is going to be taken by the Turks in 2 turns (3 rifles vs 1 maceman)

That leaves me with 3 original cities in a couple of turns.
Please just continue, it would be a shame to abort it now. Now just finish it.

I'm just acting surprised that the Russians need Arabian mescenaries to invade Israel.
It's a bit as if the USA needs French troops when they invade Denmark or something.

Speaking of dogpiles and punitive captures of territory... I lost four of my oldest and most important cities, my capitol, 3-4 wonders, and HALF of my economy. Worse yet I never backstabbed anyone.

[Robert]

game down, waiting for Russia to tell me when he can play.
I'm gone for 1,5 hours from now.

[Germany (DoE)]

Speaking of dogpiles and punitive captures of territory... I lost four of my oldest and most important cities, my capitol, 3-4 wonders, and HALF of my economy. Worse yet I never backstabbed anyone.

Not backstabbed but you did operate on the basis of a highly manipulative plan against Neander

Your losses may have been mine...

[Inca (DoE)]

Can you just allay fears that Arabia, seemingly rudderless for much of its time, is not giving significant gold per turn to Russia?

Forgive me if my previous openness over play indicated that I would reveal the secrets of this civ to the entire board. I won't. I was open solely to allay concerns that I would play this partially and fully assist Russia(I am not, and am teching towards a useful infrastructure tech, if that helps). I would not want my sub discussing my trade deals with the board, even if in the negative (eg, "there are no such deals"), so I won't do that to Arabia.

I am building infrastructure and defensive garrison units, and I am not concluding new trade/gold deals unless given permission by the perm player. That is the beginning and end of my openness.

I feel the (my) courthouses comment was over the line a bit, but it seems a bit like an AI play so I wanted clearing up over how long the civ has been under AI control, as it will determine whether I continue the builds or not.