Beyond the Sword Fact Sheet

[Solver]

I would not mind having anonymous/generic names for the civs & their leaders. By the same token, I would not mind having generic symbols (infantry, horse, etc) for the units if they had strength or manpower numbers tagging along with them on the map.

Hardcore players are always in the minority. I wouldn't mind having generic numbers walk around the map instead of units, but that would turn most players off.

[Locutus]

Originally posted by Jaybe

What are any of the other civs, but generic attributes associated with historical nations & leaders to give the game some illusion of reality?

I would not mind having anonymous/generic names for the civs & their leaders. By the same token, I would not mind having generic symbols (infantry, horse, etc) for the units if they had strength or manpower numbers tagging along with them on the map.

But nations, leaders & unit types give something to put into the pedia, and may spark interest in furthering such knowledge. That's a GOOD thing!

All the more reason not to make sh*t up and use civs that existed in real history and had at least some kind of significance. Not local tribes that don't meet even the most liberal definition of the term 'civilization', just to be PC.

[JimMac]

A good summary of the publicly available information; especially since you know a lot more than you posted. I'll have to read it a few times to see if you unintentionally let anything out...

So Solver, what do you think would be a good way to improve espionage?

[Solver]

Nice try

[Jaybe]

But Locutus, EVERY 'civ' IRL started out as an anonymous tribe and 'just evolved' into a civ that we are familiar with! EVERY civ (except perhaps the player's) should start out as a barbarian and then some cities bind together into a civ.

Barbs becoming civs is not unique to real life and my imagination, either. It's in Hephmod, though not to the degree I suggested.

[Brutus66]

I think Locutus has a point.
The definition of a civilization: an advanced state of human society, in which a high level of culture, science, industry, and government has been reached.
Does an American Indian tribe/s qualify as a civ?
For that matter, do the Celts?

[Kuciwalker]

The definition of a civilization in civilization: something a lot of people recognize and would enjoy playing as/against.

[Virdrago]

Normally I'm not that hostile to anything written in these posts, but:

I definitely am against lumping three-quarters of a continent together and considering them a generic "Native American" civ. Iroquois, Cherokee, Sioux, Cree - each had their own culture, languages, land, etc. Imagine the impression Firaxis would be sending if all the European civs were lumped into three: Latins, Germanics, and Slavs. As well as just Africans, Middle Easterns...

Generic Native Americans

[proviisori]

nice summary

[Nikolai]

Nice summary. And looking at that summary, I can with great pleasure see that both Lists have been read carefully by the devs.

[Solver]

And looking at that summary, I can with great pleasure see that both Lists have been read carefully by the devs.

Took you long enough

[Nikolai]

Took me or took us? Some times I hate the English "you". I dont know for the others, but I read the List very much when it came and was a part of the List for Civ4 from the beginning, so I know what to look for I guess.

[Solver]

I meant it took you (you specifically) long enough to figure out that the Lists have been read carefully

[Nikolai]

Ah, I see. Now, I'm pretty sure I've said similar things before. But you must confess this XP has a lot more List things in it than Warlords?

[Solver]

BtS has a lot more of everything than Warlords