Apolyton Civ4 PREVIEW (By Solver) - Part 2 online

[Aks K]

Originally posted by Solver
Stone and Marble are less common than other resources. You should not assume that you're going to have one of those close to you in every game.

This sounds reasonable. Thx.

Aks K

[Niptium]

Ok ! I have a well thought out question Solver or Mark.

You said that when you spread a religion - the game puts an icon next to the city saying - this city has taoist or christian or muslims followers... but it doesn't show any people being muslim (etc...) or any percentage. Its just like saying there is jews, there is christians in the city.

You also said having more than one religion can give you a boost in later stages.

My questions are:
1) What's the benefit of chosing the civic that stops any other religion from spreading in your empire ? What's the benefit of having an homogenous religion ?
2) And if in one city there is more than one religion. If there isn't percentage - how can the game illustrate that it's only the ones with the state religion that gets a boost ?

Thanks a lot !

[alva]

1) What's the benefit of chosing the civic that stops any other religion from spreading in your empire

Who said it's a benefit? Maybe that's the bad part. The good thing about it though is that others can't get a line of sight into/from your cities.

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Niptium
My questions are:
1) What's the benefit of chosing the civic that stops any other religion from spreading in your empire ? What's the benefit of having an homogenous religion ?
2) And if in one city there is more than one religion. If there isn't percentage - how can the game illustrate that it's only the ones with the state religion that gets a boost ?

if you go to war with a civ of a religion different from you state one but which is spread in some cities of yours, you'll have an increased war unhappiness on those cities

[gunnergoz]

Originally posted by ajbera
Didn't millions upon millions of people starve in the USSR when Stalin tried to collectivize the farms? Just asking...

The occasion of collectivisation was an opportunity for Stalin to starve out entire portions of the population, especially in the Ukraine, that had resisted collectivisation. Food was exported out and little was left for the residents. Distribution was allowed to go to the cities in particular. This basically broke the back of the independent Ukrianian farmer class, which was seen as an obstacle to Communist rule and a potential source of nationalist resistance.

[Solver]

1) What's the benefit of chosing the civic that stops any other religion from spreading in your empire ? What's the benefit of having an homogenous religion ?

Enemy doesn't get bonuses (like Shrine gold) from spreading his religion to your cities. Plus, that civic also gives your units free XP, it's actually an aggressive choice.

[Zhahz]

Thanks for the preview(s) and answering so many questions.

I've read many times that ICS is gone...meaning infinite city sprawl...but in most late/end game screenshots I've seen the maps have been full of cities...from coast to coast...just like always. Perhaps not as many cities as you'd see in Civ3 (mercifully) and ideally placed more intelligently instead of spewed all over.

So I guess it would be more appropriate to say that "immediate" city sprawl is gone...because it looks to be tougher and/or a serious gamble to expand too early but apparently over time you can develop a sprawling empire? This works for me but it seems like the terminology involved is off if you can, in fact, develop a huge empire over time and maps are usually covered in cities eventually.

And, I believe you mentioned somewhere about having conquered two other civs to get a nice sized empire of around 16 cities, so there must be mechanics over time that allow you to have a larger empire without destroying your economy. It'd be pretty pointless to have domination and conquest victory types if pursuing that was a sure road to ruin!

Anyways - I'm looking forward to the next installment of your previewing.

Cheers!

[conmcb25]

I think what Solver (and others) have been saying is you can expand once you decelop the cities you have to support the ever increasing cost of adding to your empire.

But that in effect is still the essential end of ICS where you tried to get as many cities as you could as quickly as possible.

Its more intelligent and thought out growth.

[Harrier UK]

Not sure if this has already been asked or not.

If you select a settler in the build queue - does the game tell you how much extra maintenance a new city will require.

The same if you have previously built a settler and now select the build option are you told how much gold you will need to maintain the new city. (Your financial circumstances may have changed!)

[Martinus]

Originally posted by Zhahz
Thanks for the preview(s) and answering so many questions.

I've read many times that ICS is gone...meaning infinite city sprawl...but in most late/end game screenshots I've seen the maps have been full of cities...from coast to coast...just like always. Perhaps not as many cities as you'd see in Civ3 (mercifully) and ideally placed more intelligently instead of spewed all over.

So I guess it would be more appropriate to say that "immediate" city sprawl is gone...because it looks to be tougher and/or a serious gamble to expand too early but apparently over time you can develop a sprawling empire? This works for me but it seems like the terminology involved is off if you can, in fact, develop a huge empire over time and maps are usually covered in cities eventually.

And, I believe you mentioned somewhere about having conquered two other civs to get a nice sized empire of around 16 cities, so there must be mechanics over time that allow you to have a larger empire without destroying your economy. It'd be pretty pointless to have domination and conquest victory types if pursuing that was a sure road to ruin!

Anyways - I'm looking forward to the next installment of your previewing.

Cheers!

ICS is not synonymous to having many cities.

ICS is a strategy of pumping settlers after settlers and founding cities wherever possible, as a sure way to win the game. This is gone.

As you said, if what you say was true, and "death of ICS" meant you can't have a big and prosperous empire, then domination or conquest victories would be impossible.

[Solver]

Originally posted by Harrier UK
Not sure if this has already been asked or not.

If you select a settler in the build queue - does the game tell you how much extra maintenance a new city will require.

The same if you have previously built a settler and now select the build option are you told how much gold you will need to maintain the new city. (Your financial circumstances may have changed!)

Interesting idea, but no. Until you actually have that new city, you don't know how much it will cost. Then again, you'll soon figure it out.

[ajbera]

Solver: on what screen do you see the AI civ's civic choices? Do you know what they are upon contact with that civ? I mean, you can't demand an opponent change his civics if you don't know what they are.

[ixnay]

http://apolyton.net/dir/index.php?sid=316910789&id=4853&t=fullimage&toprate=5.0000&tophits=5526&cat=346

Those 5 icons at the top of the screen (next to '(Furious)') seem to show which 5 civics they're running.

[GeoModder]

And on the left hand side is appearantly the state religion depicted.

[Harrier UK]

Originally posted by Solver
Interesting idea, but no. Until you actually have that new city, you don't know how much it will cost. Then again, you'll soon figure it out.

So unless you have a healthy income or bank balance it would be easy to get into debt. Which I suppose is the intention to stop ICS. It would have been nice to know the increased maintenance before building a city to avoid this.

You can make a rough guess I suppose by noting down how much the increase in maintenance was from your last city and estimating what the increase might be.

example:
if 3 cities cost 33
4 cities cost 57 (+`24)
5 cities cost 88 (+ 29) .
The 6th city must add around 35 or more.

Solver, if you do go into debt by building a city you can not afford what happens. Do you lose military units as in civ3?