New Close-up Screens at Gaming Horizon

[yin26]

Well, I am trying to stay low-key for a while, but I feel this deserves a response:

First, my thanks to those of you who are open to my feedback. It's a public forum, right? I never understood people who can't accept dissenting views, etc., even if you find them incredibly annoying.

Second, it seems, oddly enough, that others here are holding on to the past. I had forgotten completely about the list fiasco on firaxis.com until it was mentioned just now. If anything, I had issues with the Firaxis QA department, and to the degree that these problems have been addressed, I doubt you'll hear much from me on this score. Yes, the game will have issues. Yes, most will be fixed. In which case, what's the issue?

As for not being a good civ player, that one just makes me laugh. What does good mean? That I devote my life to MP games on Poly? Please. I whoop the AI in my sleep a day or two after starting my first game. If you had been paying attention, you would know that part of my argument is that the game is too predictable.

As for "vet" status, here again what are you after: Little shields under my name for all my little MP affiliations at Poly? Odd, I would think that vet could also apply to somebody who played Civ 1 - 3 and contributed in whatever way to their progress. Guess not.

As I'm grateful has been pointed out, I came to Poly looking for counters to my worries. Over that time, despite the fact that I think it will be overall graphically annoying and, once again, utterly too predictable, I think that MP from the ground up and great modding options will save the game. My sense, therefore, is that my Day 1 review would be in the 7.0 -8.0 region while some later expansion packs plus mods could easily bring this up to the 9+ area. Sorry if this bothers anybody.

Finally, I plan to give Civ 4 a fair review and will only take Firaxis to task if they do something rampantly stupid. But if what people are saying here is true, then Firaxis has learned something from past mistakes, and I'm happy to limit my feedback to specific in-game mechanics moving forward.

Of course, I wonder if certain others here can let the past go themselves?

[AeonOfTime]

@yin26: Well, I am trying to stay low-key for a while

Now that's the stupidest thing you have said to date. There will always be people that apreciate your insights as well as those who don't. Forget the individual reasons, they are endless.

It makes sense that if you come into a well of happiness like this forum and try to share your doubts you will make ripples in the water. I like ripples - they add spice to life.

And now, as Civ4 is still not out we can go on raving about what it will and will not be without actually knowing anything about it. Don't you just love forums?

[Robert]

Of course you're free to have your opinion, yin.
Though you morely act like a person who enters a party and starts to shout your, indeed well phrased, complains about the party gift. And you join any conversation that's being held at the party, and turn it into a conversation about your opinion on how pathatic the party gift is.

You have the freedom of opinion.
I have the freedom to have the opinion that your opinion sucks. Mostly because it is based on almost nothing. Because it was formed before cIV was being announced and mostly because you shout it in my face in about every thread I visited since I returned from my vacation.

Please respect our opinion on your opinion.

[GAZ082]

CIV III had 7, and 8 and even 9 ratings in the firsts previews and it sucked! Owww, hell it sucked and was a big turn down Owww owww, dont make me remember that... owww!

If we want to rate CIV IV with that scale, i believe that with the fact that the AI will respect my borders (WTF! im playing a little CIV Conquests game where a civ is attacking me passing throught France, and it does not have a free pass pact with them!) and the MP thing, CIV IV will get a 12, yay!

Edit: Im with Cyber, Yin's posts are pointless and with little foundations.

[yin26]

AeonOfTime: Thanks.

CyberShy: Oh, so now it's about respecting your opinion on not telling me to leave because you don't like my opinion. Brilliant!

P.S. Your vacation was too short.

[Robert]

CyberShy: Oh, so now it's about respecting your opinion on not telling me to leave because you don't like my opinion. Brilliant!

No, I just countered your countless "I have a right to have an opinion" with your own weapons :P

I don't ask you to leave because of your opinion.
I ask you to because there's no point for you being here, since you're not waiting for a new civ game.

Like there's no need for CyberShy on the doom3 forums.
Maybe I can go there and explain how doom3 sucks imho. How civ is far more superior, etc. etc.
But in the end I'm not a fan of the doom franchise. I'm not waiting for doom 4.
If I would build doom 4 I would include diplomacy between the demons and the player. I would make it turn based, and I would put the option to get a strategy. But then it won't be doom anymore. That's why I'm not at the doom forums.

So, what are you doing here?
You've admitted that civ wouldn't be civ anymore with your ideas and if your greatest point of criticism would be granted. Well, in that case, what are you doing here?
Go to the RoN forum, or create your own game.

If you really want cIV you're really welcome to voice your opinion.
If you only come here to lay a huge load of salt on any snail.......... please please yourself and please us!

Now make your decision.
Be a fan of the cIV fan community (which doesn't prohibit criticism) or don't be a part of it.

Poly is a civ-fansite, afaik.

[Ninot]

Originally posted by CyberShy
And there's not point for us that you're here, since you annoy us.

Be careful with your liberal use of the word "us". You speak for yourself, not the entire site.

You certainly don't speak for me.

[Robert]

oh, it wasn't really nice to say anyway, so I edited it totally out. thanks for correcting me.

[korn469]

be nice guys

[Darkstar]

CyberShy, I am shocked that you'd spread around such lies and try such machinations. That sort of posting behavior is why Apolyton is considered one of the very worst of game forums on the internet! What does it matter to you, CyberShy, if Yin26 is guarded in his expectations? I didn't see a sign that stated only statements proclaiming Firaxis as the One and All Mighty Power of the Universe was allowed here.

Just for the record, Yin26 has a very long history with Firaxis, Civ, and its game communities. He has long been a super fan of the Civ series. He just wants Civ4 to live up to the fun, wonder, and gameplay that the first Civ provided to him. But, considering Firaxis prior efforts and its occasional mis-steps and stumbles, it is not suprising that Yin is not the shining supernova of optimism. I remember when Yin first started posting on Firaxis property, and it was well before "The List". Nor was he hateful of all things Civ or Firaxis after the various troubles.

Personally, I'm of a split opinion about the graphics. From an eye candy point of view, I think they are ok. But eye candy is not what's important. Being able to see the important gameplay information easily, that's what is important. I am left wondering just how easy it will be to see the important details.

I want units oversized--- I don't want them being lost in the clutter, especially considering how cluttered a city might become. I want to be able to easily click on them! Heck with "realism". There isn't anything significantly realistic in Civ to begin with, and I'm not looking for it. Just fun. Hopefully, Civ4 will provide years and years of fun as Civ1 and Civ2 did for me, but I'll be happy if I get 4 months of fun out of it.

[Adm.Naismith]

I joined this forum at SMAC time, when Firaxis closed its official forum, so many years ago my mind have forgotten.
I loved the general feeling and the good level of many posters here at Poly, with enough few flame wars.
I stayed away from this forum when became clear that the released Civ III was quite a mess (or at least half of the promised game many of us hoped and spent so many hours debating).

I still spent some time playing Civ III Conquest, but not half as much as I played SMAC.

Civ franchise has some good point and some old and rusty side. Same with Yin: he has a straight and sometime way too strong expression of concept and debating visions.

A friend can cope with defects and forgive them, looking at bright parts of someone personality; others simply can't live with it.

When Firaxis will nail down some more details about game mechanics we can go back on topic, speaking about real facts and not about fans, as I think it should be.

When the game will be released this fall (and they must be in balancing and polishing stage today, no room left for adding features or last minute rethinking, sorry) we'll have our time for happy and sad players count, newbie Poly members looking for game info and veterans leaving slamming the door.

Now it's summer time: please relax and forgive, life's too short.

[Robert]

Darkstar, please try to read and understand my messages before you reply to it.
I'm not the most evil dude in history, so I'll try to explain it to you. I have no problem with criticism. What I more or less tried to say was that yin is not waiting for a new civilization game, but for a total new game. cIV will for that reason never meet his expectations.
I wonder if it's a good reason to be on this forum if you're not a fan of the civ series anymore.

please don't think that simplistic in black and white, like I only want people to praise firaxis or civ. that's a totally different topic.

[MattNY1983]

Wow.

How 'bout you wait for the game to be released, then gripe.

[yin26]

[Shogun Gunner]

AWESOME!!!!!