Archaic World Scenario

[LordShiva]

great idea.

i definitely think an indian civ should be in there, but it's going to be hard. "King Rama" won't work - Rama is an Aryan/Vedic name that came with the invaders who replaced the indus valley civ. So are the ramayana and other vedic epics. And "Harappa," "Mohenjo-daro" are actually modern names of the towns near which the ruins were found. Noone knows the names of the original settlements. Including a "Vedic" civilization would be alot easier - city names, leader names, wonders, etc. are all readily available.

[sophist]

Originally posted by molly bloom

Take three men: a Liberal (Dadabhai Naoroji - MP for Finsbury 1892-95), a Tory (Mancherjee Bhownagree - MP for Bethnal Green 1895-1905) and a Socialist (Shapurji Saklatvala - MP for Battersea 1922-29). These men, Britain's first Asian MPs, all belonged to the small and highly influential Indian community known as the Parsis.

It is believed that Feroze Khan, aka Mr. Indira Gandhi, had a Parsi father.

[evilnerd15]

I would suggest adding the Temple of Solomon to the list of wonders.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by LordShiva
great idea.

i definitely think an indian civ should be in there, but it's going to be hard. "King Rama" won't work - Rama is an Aryan/Vedic name that came with the invaders who replaced the indus valley civ. So are the ramayana and other vedic epics. And "Harappa," "Mohenjo-daro" are actually modern names of the towns near which the ruins were found. Noone knows the names of the original settlements. Including a "Vedic" civilization would be alot easier - city names, leader names, wonders, etc. are all readily available.

If there's one thing I've felt that Civilization has lacked, it's been a sufficient amount or variation in non-European civilizations, or at least civilizations viewed as an integral part of Judaeo-Christian culture.

The Cholas might be a good Indian dynasty, I think.

It would be pleasant to see early wonders that weren't Graeco-Roman or Hellenistic- like the temple complexes at Khajuraho, or Pagan, Borobudur or Polonnaruwa or the Jainist site at Sravanabelgola- with the 17 metre high statue of the sage, Gomateshwara, larger than any statue of Rameses II.

[Alexander I]

Originally posted by molly bloom

If there's one thing I've felt that Civilization has lacked, it's been a sufficient amount or variation in non-European civilizations, or at least civilizations viewed as an integral part of Judaeo-Christian culture.

The Cholas might be a good Indian dynasty, I think.

It would be pleasant to see early wonders that weren't Graeco-Roman or Hellenistic- like the temple complexes at Khajuraho, or Pagan, Borobudur or Polonnaruwa or the Jainist site at Sravanabelgola- with the 17 metre high statue of the sage, Gomateshwara, larger than any statue of Rameses II.

Well, considering that the scenario is from 3250 BC to 1000 BC, the Chola are out, as they didn't exist for at least another millenium.

Since Jainism was started by Vardhamana Mahavira, who was roughly contemporary with the Buddha, their stuff is also too late.

As far as Graeco-Roman wonders are concerned, the Romans are too late as well. I think I only listed one proto-Greek wonder too. All the "classical" wonders would be too late, excluding the Pyramids.

The point of the scenario was to create a really archaic world, before the ancient (really the "classical") world that most people think about (Greek/Roman city-states, Maurya, Qin/Han Dynasties) actually existed.

In fact, it's pushing the limits to even include people like the Mycenaeans.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Alexander01


Well, considering that the scenario is from 3250 BC to 1000 BC, the Chola are out, as they didn't exist for at least another millenium.

At the risk of pointing out the perfectly obvious, I didn't suggest the Cholas as an archaic world dynasty, I suggested them as a good 'Indian' dynasty- especially as Civilization's emphasis so far seems to have been on either the Moghul dynasty and an Indo-Saracenic wonder, or modern Indian history.

I was actually making a point about what Civilization has left out generally.

It's largely omitted the Aryan/Hindu and Dravidian civilizations and dynasties and Buddhist, Jain and Hindu wonders, and it's not like India/South East Asia doesn't have a wealth of them to offer.

[Alexander I]

Originally posted by molly bloom

At the risk of pointing out the perfectly obvious, I didn't suggest the Cholas as an archaic world dynasty, I suggested them as a good 'Indian' dynasty- especially as Civilization's emphasis so far seems to have been on either the Moghul dynasty and an Indo-Saracenic wonder, or modern Indian history.

I was actually making a point about what Civilization has left out generally.

It's largely omitted the Aryan/Hindu and Dravidian civilizations and dynasties and Buddhist, Jain and Hindu wonders, and it's not like India/South East Asia doesn't have a wealth of them to offer.

I'm just confused as to why you mentioned that here, since we weren't discussing that issue.

[ArchdukeNewell]

Originally posted by Alexander01

I'm just confused as to why you mentioned that here, since we weren't discussing that issue.

Why here indeed!

She's so fixated upon her own agenda that everything she says concerns some issue of Civ unfairness, political correctness, or down right antagonistic argumentativeness.

I point out that she has disagreed with absolutely everything I have ever said.

[Alexander I]

Hey let's not have a flame war here, ok?
That's not the direction I wanted this thread to go.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Alexander01


I'm just confused as to why you mentioned that here, since we weren't discussing that issue.

Funny, I don't recall there being an embargo on spontaneity.

I point out that she has disagreed with absolutely everything I have ever said.

ArchdukeNewell


Wouldn't anyone with a scintilla of intelligence ?

[Alexander I]

Originally posted by Alexander01
Hey let's not have a flame war here, ok?
That's not the direction I wanted this thread to go.

MollyBloom, please reference the above.

[Datajack Franit]

Troy civ:

First city: Troy

second city: hmmm

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Alexander01


MollyBloom, please reference the above.

If you want a job, join the Peace Corps.