CIv4... Beware the planned obsolescence!!!

[Zoid]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph


You might want to check your math, fanboi. It's wrong in several places.

Well, the end result is about right anyway. 265/1900 ~ 0.14$

[Robert]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph


You might want to check your math, fanboi. It's wrong in several places.

uh, yeah that's true.
I changed some info since I thought that 2000 hours on cIIv might have been stretched things too far

I was too lazy to redo the entire match thing so I just adjustsed the end result.

I never thought anybody would be crazy enough to check it

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by AeonOfTime
That's true, and will be even more true of Civ4 if they get it right. That's okay as it can give Firaxis the financial 'backend' to do some great expansions... But I agree that good features should not be exclusive to expansions.

By "get it right" you mean "exactly as I want it", right? (As opposed to "the game that will sell the best.")

[KyuuA4]

Originally posted by CyberShy
I bought:

civilization: $5
civilization 2: $50
civilization2 MPG: $40
civilization2 tot: $40
civilization 3: $50
civilization 3 PtW: $40
civilization C3C: $40
--------------------------
total: $265

hours played:
civilization: 500?
civilization 2: 1000?
civilization 3: 400?
-----------------------------
total: 3800

265 / 3800 = $0.12 per hour
man, that's really cheap!

Actually... you could have calculated this way:

Amount spent on games:
$265

*Amount y'could've earned at minimum wage INSTEAD of playing:
3800 hours played x minimum wage (5.15 per hour) == $19570

*NOTE: Assuming one would be crazy enough to work that much EXTRA.

===

Total Amt. that could have still been in the pocket:
$19835

[Kuciwalker]

Idiotic comparison, apples and oranges. By that logic, all entertainment is a waste of money - why, you could be earning money! Except doing that is pointless if you don't spend it on entertainment.

[ew0054]

I am interested in making a real world Earth model, complete with as many cities (accurate to city populations using the formula (((size*(size+1))/2)*10000) + (1000 * food))), which I extrapolated while playing. I have created an Excel sheet which shows the calculations for city sizes up to 63 (20 million people). If anyone is interested in it, I have it at http://www.erniewerbel.com/civ3pop.xls

My point is that I would like to see heaps of civs, to create as unique, and realistic game world as possible. I start in the modern era, use months as the unit of time, and set the starting date to whatever month/year it is now. I often use the Iriquios for Australia (since American rule the US continent), and I put Carthage for Canada (just a substitution), and do similar stuff. Where I don't have a modern civlization to implement where it is needed, I use one of the long-gong ancient ones to substitute it.

Also, they better have Aluminum in Civ4! Aluminum rules and I didn't see it on their list. I think it's one of the most important resources of the modern era and I really hope they keep it. I like the ideas of other commodities like tropical fruit, and making all resources tradable is awesome. Glass would be an interesting one; a luxury perhaps. Did I see silicon on that list? I forget. I can think of a hundred more.

[Kuciwalker]

We don't want tons and tons of resources. They're strategic resources, meaning that there should be significant strategy involved. As a general rule, the more instances of something that exist (in this case types of strategic resources), the less strategy is involved with them.

[ew0054]

That is a good point. I'm looking into the realism aspect though. Consider this next idea, and I'm sure I'll get people agreeing with me on this cause I feel it makes perfect sense.

In Civ3, you could make a map of only grassland with NO strategic resources, yet still be able to advance to the modern era. Sure, you can't build spaceships without aluminum and what not, but you could get the technology to.

I think that's wrong. If there were no iron, how could we as humans have learned Iron Working? Now I don't think the resources should appear before the tech that needs them is discovered either.

Here's what I do think would strinke a balance for this. You can research to Iron Working, for example. This makes Iron appear. BUT, in order to advance BEYOND Iron Working (to the techs that branch off it), you need to HAVE Iron.

Wouldn't that make more sense? Think about it. Resoucrces had to be available in order for engineers and scientists to develop prototypes of later inventions such as the automobile and cannons. How could this have been possible without already having the resource?

I think that in Civ3, just having the tech represents having access to everything the tech needs. I think that's a bit flawed.

[Xorbon]

On "Gilligan's Island", didn't the Professor create a car using only bamboo and coconuts?

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by ew0054
That is a good point. I'm looking into the realism aspect though. Consider this next idea, and I'm sure I'll get people agreeing with me on this cause I feel it makes perfect sense.

In Civ3, you could make a map of only grassland with NO strategic resources, yet still be able to advance to the modern era. Sure, you can't build spaceships without aluminum and what not, but you could get the technology to.

I think that's wrong. If there were no iron, how could we as humans have learned Iron Working? Now I don't think the resources should appear before the tech that needs them is discovered either.

The simple answer is that resource tiles represent major resource deposits, but all resources are available pretty much anywhere in small quantities (this is true).

[Solver]

What Kuci says, plus simplification. The resource model is simplified of course from the real world, or else indeed, a civ without access to iron would be screwed forever.

[AeonOfTime]

In a civ3 game lately, I was eagerly awaiting aluminium to be able to built modern armor, only to find out that there was absolutely no aluminium on the map. Needless to say, that was an interesting endgame...

[KyuuA4]

Originally posted by AeonOfTime
In a civ3 game lately, I was eagerly awaiting aluminium to be able to built modern armor, only to find out that there was absolutely no aluminium on the map. Needless to say, that was an interesting endgame...

Now, how the heck did that happen? I mean... not ever?

[AeonOfTime]

Now, how the heck did that happen? I mean... not ever?

No, not ever. It was a random generated map, without any custom rules so I honestly don't know how it could happen, but that's how it was... I even turned off all elements on the map to make sure, and there really was no aluminium.

[Kuciwalker]

There's a very low but not nonexistent chance of that happening.