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An occupational hazard for a thief or justification for a murder charge?

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  • An occupational hazard for a thief or justification for a murder charge?

    "You're dead," Minn. homeowner told teen burglar

    LITTLE FALLS, Minn. - Jurors heard an audio recording Tuesday of the moments when two teenagers were fatally shot by a Minnesota homeowner who says he feared for his life after several previous break-ins.

    Byron Smith, 65, of Little Falls, is charged with first-degree premeditated murder in the slayings of 17-year-old Nick Brady and 18-year-old Haile Kifer on Thanksgiving Day 2012. The shooting stunned the small city and stirred debate about how far people can go in defending their homes.

    Smith told police that he armed himself and set up recording devices following repeated break-ins. Morrison County jurors heard glass break on the recording, then two gunshots as Brady groaned. Smith told Brady, "You're dead," the Star Tribune reported.

    Almost immediately after Brady is shot, rustling of a tarp can be heard, then a dragging sound and heavy breathing. Smith has said he had moved Brady to a workshop in his basement to keep him from staining the basement carpet.

    The audio continued with the sound of a gun reloading, then more deep breaths. In a quiet, low voice several minutes later, a female mumbles "Nick." Gunshots are heard again, as well as the sound of Kifer falling. Smith quickly said "Oh, sorry about that." Then Kifer said "Oh my God!" and screams.

    Amid more shots, Smith told Kifer, "you're dying," and then calls her a derogatory name for a woman. After more heavy breathing and another dragging sound, Smith calls Kifer the name again. After more movement, the crack of a gun is heard.

    Prosecutors stopped playing the tape after that gunshot. The courtroom was silent except for a woman holding back sobs, the newspaper reported.

    Prosecutors said during opening statements Monday that Smith planned the killings and was waiting in his basement. Smith's attorney said his client was terrified after several increasingly violent break-ins and hid after he heard a window break and footsteps upstairs.

    Smith is a retired security engineer for the U.S. Department of State. Kifer and Brady were cousins. The two were well-known in the community, and both were involved in sports.

    Court documents from another case show Brady had burglarized Smith's property at least twice in the months before he was killed.
    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/youre-d...-teen-burglar/

    I don't get the justification for a criminal charge here at all much less one of murder 1. Can a lawyer explain it?
    I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
    For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

  • #2
    Originally posted by DinoDoc View Post
    I don't get the justification for a criminal charge here at all much less one of murder 1. Can a lawyer explain it?
    Not a lawyer. But here goes. Normals have these things called morals. Murder is sometimes frowned upon.

    I hope this helps.
    To us, it is the BEAST.

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    • #3
      How is this murder?
      I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
      For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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      • #4
        The long pause tends to prove a lack of need for self-defense. That makes it murder.
        AC2- the most active SMAC(X) community on the web.
        JKStudio - Masks and other Art

        No pasarán

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        • #5
          As opposed to an occupational hazard for thievery?
          I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
          For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

          Comment


          • #6
            It's both. Based on the little information I have, I'd be inclined to let the first killing slide, maybe. Killing the girl was stone cold, and just flat out murder, from the sound of it.
            AC2- the most active SMAC(X) community on the web.
            JKStudio - Masks and other Art

            No pasarán

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            • #7
              The "you're dead" comment and the taunts to the girl make is sound more premeditated.

              But if you're setting this up, WHY WOULD YOU MAKE A RECORDING.

              Much easier if the two were just found dead on you property.
              It's almost as if all his overconfident, absolutist assertions were spoonfed to him by a trusted website or subreddit. Sheeple
              RIP Tony Bogey & Baron O

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              • #8
                The guy should go to prison for being an idiot. The whole point of killing people is so that you can frame the narrative as you see fit. If he hadn't been recording he'd be as free and clear as Zimmerman.
                John Brown did nothing wrong.

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                • #9
                  She also broke into an occupied dwelling. The default presumption in my view at least is that the people that do that come prepared for violence.
                  I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                  For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Worrying about stained carpets seems incompatible with being fearful that one's life is in danger.
                    Pool Manager - Lombardi Handicappers League - An NFL Pick 'Em Pool

                    https://youtu.be/HLNhPMQnWu4

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                    • #11
                      I'm not certain this is what you'd call premeditated though. I always thought premeditated would be more like planning to murder somebody, rather than just opportunistically gunning down a defenseless intruder. Like if he'd lured them into the house with some sort of bait, and then killed them, that would strike me as premeditated.
                      John Brown did nothing wrong.

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                      • #12
                        Most people frown on shooting a person that is already down from being shot.
                        It's almost as if all his overconfident, absolutist assertions were spoonfed to him by a trusted website or subreddit. Sheeple
                        RIP Tony Bogey & Baron O

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by DinoDoc View Post
                          She also broke into an occupied dwelling. The default presumption in my view at least is that the people that do that come prepared for violence.
                          Executing someone after you've already shot them is murder.

                          You are seriously fucked in the head if you can't figure this out for yourself.

                          You should feel bad that this revenge porn BS has you creaming your pants.
                          To us, it is the BEAST.

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                          • #14
                            What he said.
                            AC2- the most active SMAC(X) community on the web.
                            JKStudio - Masks and other Art

                            No pasarán

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Felch View Post
                              I'm not certain this is what you'd call premeditated though. I always thought premeditated would be more like planning to murder somebody, rather than just opportunistically gunning down a defenseless intruder. Like if he'd lured them into the house with some sort of bait, and then killed them, that would strike me as premeditated.
                              MAYBE SETTING UP THE TARP HUH

                              Planning to dispose of a body kinda falls under "premeditation".
                              To us, it is the BEAST.

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