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Thread: American Civil War (McMonkey vs Techumseh)

  1. #181
    techumseh
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    Atlanta celebrates, prepares for siege.

    General Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson and his Army of Mississippi were given a warm welcome by the citizens of Atlanta this week. A great ball was held in honor of the famous general, who has been responsible for the defeat of three yankee armies and the capture of Gens. Sherman, Rosecrans, Thomas, Schofield and McPherson.

    General Jackson ordered his officers to leave the ball in time to be in bed by 20:00 hrs. "We have many trials ahead of us", he said. "Enjoy yourselves tonight, for tomorrow we must prepare for a very difficult struggle. Everyone must sacrifice if we are to defeat the damned yankees."

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  2. #182
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    Union June 1865

    One fears the ball held in honour of General Jackson was attended by a double and the great man is elsewhere. Union sentries are ordered keep their eyes peeled for any unusual movements in the Rebel lines!

    South of Chattanooga two CSA Infantry Regiments are destroyed for the loss of two US Heavy Artillery. In the east the wave of Rebel harassment squads is dealt with (I think I got them all anyway!). A total of seven CSA Infantry Regiments and one unit of Irregulars are wiped out for the loss of two US Heavy Artillery and four US Infantry Regiments. On the road between Augusta and Savannah two CSA Infantry Regiments are destroyed for the loss of one veteran US Infantry Regiment.
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  3. #183
    techumseh
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    Atlanta digs in.

    Atlanta prepares for a fierce battle. Defenses around the city are strengthened. Gen. Stonewall Jackson is everywhere, urging the soldiers and citizens to greater efforts.

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  4. #184
    McMonkey
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    Union July 1865 - The End Game

    As the scenario moves into its final five turns both sides make their calculations for victory or survival. South of Chattanooga the Federal Army if forced into a desperate and bloody battle for control of the railroad to Atlanta. The four CSA Infantry Regiments holding the hill overlooking the Conasauga River are driven from their positions and destroyed after a fierce assault that saw the loss of two US Heavy Artillery and ten Regiments of Infantry. Further east one CSA Regiment south-east of Columbia is forced to surrender and a Regiment of Hampton's Legion north-east of Charlotte is destroyed for the cost of one US Heavy Artillery.



    Out west the campaign to subdue the Sioux gets under way and Lower Santee is captured.

  5. #185
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    and the save...
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  6. #186
    techumseh
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    Waiting for the yankees.

    Confederate scouts keep a keen eye for yankee troop movements.

    Drew, I take off Thursday morning for some holidays. I won't be able to play after that for a couple of weeks.

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  7. #187
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    Union August 1865

    An assault is launched on the defences of Savannah by the Army of General Meade. Six Regiments of Rebel Infantry, one of Hampton's Legion and of State Militia unit are killed for the loss of nine Heavy Artillery. Four Irregular units are also destroyed. Charleston is now completely isolated.



    In the eastern theatre several skirmishes take place to keep the rail roads clear of Rebels. One CSA Infantry Regiment, one of Cavalry and one of Hampton's Legion are destroyed for the loss of three Heavy Artillery. Fayetteville is captured. One CSA Infantry Regiment and two of Militia are destroyed or captured.



    In Georgia the Army of General McClellan finally links up with the Army of Tennessee and captured La Grange to totally encircle Atlanta. The battle begins with another assault on the Rebel positions blocking the Chattanooga to Atlanta rail road. Four CSA Infantry Regiments are destroyed for the loss of two Heavy Artillery and three regiments of US Infantry. To the south-east of Atlanta Federal troops take possession of a strong position on a hill/river square to block the Macon to Atlanta line. One CSA Infantry Regiment is destroyed. The four regiments of Union Infantry in the hills to the east of Atlanta head south to the lowland along the Macon to Atlanta line then head north up the line taking out a CSA Infantry Regiment for the loss of one of their own. General McClellan dispatches a Heavy Artillery unit to take out the other CSA Infantry Regiment.



    This paves the way for the remaining three regiments to move up to the outskirts of Atlanta. Units of the Army of Tennessee approach from the west allowing units of McClellan's Army to slip past the city under their covering fire. The combined armies launch an attack on La Grange. One Militia unit, two CSA Infantry Regiments and a General are destroyed. There are rumours the General is none other than Stonewall Jackson but they are yet to be confirmed.

    The Unions strategy for total victory is now clear for all to see, but there is a concern amongst the Staff Officers and politicians that time is running out and one last crushing defeat must be inflicted to convince the French and British that a Texas-Louisiana rump state is not viable and the Union of North and South and an end to slavery is the only legitimate outcome to this war.
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  8. #188
    techumseh
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    A desperate break-out.

    General Forrest, in command of the main army at Atlanta, finds himself cut off from his communications, as well from General Stonewall Jackson. Unconfirmed reports arrive that Jackson has been killed or captured La Grange, SW of Atlanta. Still in command of a large army, Forrest decides to break out towards Augusta, hoping to link up with Gen. C. Generic's corps in Macon.

    The army marches out and attacks the yankee army at Athens, Ga. Wave upon wave of confederates are mowed down by the yankee infantry entrenched on the hills. When the yankee troops are finally worn down, Forrest leads a final attack in person, breaking the last Union line, and capturing 3 generals, including McClennan and Sheridan. After losing 80% of his force, Forrest halts, too exausted to move further.

    Meanwhile Gen. Generic's corps moves east and north towards Augusta. In heavy fighting, he clears the river crossing at Louisville. Moving north, he overwhelms the escort of Gen. Meade, capturing him, then moving up to Augusta, finally taking it after heavy fighting. Total losses are approx. 15 infantry rgts, 1 heavy artillery battery and 4 generals captured for the North, and 16 infantry rgts lost for the South.

    The South has won another victory, but at an enormous cost. The resources of the Confederacy are almost exausted. President Jefferson Techdavis convenes a cabinet meeting to assess the prospects for continuing the war.



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  9. #189
    techumseh
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    CSA SURRENDERS!

    Army of Mississippi lays down arms!

    The Confederate cabinet, in consultation with Gen. Forrest and other senior officers have decided to seek an armistice.

    "Soldiers and sailors of the Confederacy. You have fought with bravery and sacrifice. You have won victory upon victory. But all the blood, all the heroic sacrifice are to no avail against the massive industrial might of the North. Go now, with heads held high. You have done your duty, and more.

    Who can fathom the intent of the great designer, who allows such suffering, and permits the construction of yankee heavy artillery at such a low cost? In the next world, suffering will be unknown, and heavy artillery will cost 12 to 16 rows of shields. But that is far off. Today we must bear the burden of defeat, knowing we have done our best. Thank you and goodbye." - President Techdavis


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  10. #190
    techumseh
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    Stonewall Jackson's Funeral

    The Union has repatriated the body of General Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson, the greatest general of the late Civil War. They have generously allowed him to be buried with full Confederate military honors. General Sherman served as one of the pallbearers. May peace be with him, and with all of us.


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  11. #191
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    President Lincoln welcomes the wise decision of the Confederacy to lay down its arms. Far to many brave young Americans on both sides have sacrificed their lives. Now will come a time of peace and rebuilding. There are great wounds to heal in our society and the continuation of this bitter war and the needless slaughter our thousands more men would have only made these wounds harder to heal. God bless America!



    General McClellan's memoirs are underway.

  12. #192
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    Re: Heavy Artillery

    I'm not so sure the Heavy Artillery is under priced. I often had to sacrifice an expensive HA to clear a Conscript Regiment that had taken up a strong position in an inconvenient area. If you put the price up too high then the Union player will probably just spend his cash on loads more cheap Conscript Infantry. Lots will get wasted in attacks but some will survive and become veterans and given the choice I would prefer two veteran Infantry over one single shot heavy artillery piece! I haven't done the calculations to work out the average number of green and veteran Infantry it takes to kill each type of enemy unit so my theory may prove incorrect.

    In many ways the war followed a roughly historical path in terms of the outcome. The Union faired better in the east than it did historically, but it did just about enough when one of its Generals achieved a breakthrough of enemy lines and was able to use the space to manoeuvre deep behind enemy lines, isolating targets and carving the Confederacy into manageable chunks. Perhaps a better General with the same resources I had would have been able to do better, but I think we matched each other much of the time, trading blow for blow until the North's industrial might told.

    CASUALTIES:

    Confederacy
    Forts - 3
    Infantry - 402
    Cavalry - 104
    Artillery - 15
    Heavy Artillery - 2
    Generals - 21
    Ships - 10

    Union
    Forts - 1
    Engineers - 2
    Infantry - 331
    Cavalry - 11
    Artillery - 14
    Heavy Artillery - 79
    Generals - 25
    Ships - 33

  13. #193
    McMonkey
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    INITIAL UNION STRATEGY

    Deciding that General Scott's Anaconda plan was too slow and cautious the war strategy is decided amongst the top brass and this is what was scrawled on a napkin, later to be transcribed and used as the blueprint from victory. As with any plan it was unlikely to survive first contact with the enemy. Still, the Union had to begin somewhere!

    1st Campaign - Kentucky and Georgia (Start October/November 1861)

    Objectives: (4) Nashville, Chattanooga, Atlanta and Montgomery (+ will support 2nd Campaign)

    Base of operations: Evansville

    Sneak troops round to west to set up block and cut RR

    2nd Campaign - Mississippi (Start early 1862)

    Objectives: (1) Memphis

    Base of operations: Cairo

    3rd Campaign - Virginia and the Carolinas (Start mid 1862)

    Objectives: (8) Richmond, Petersburg, Norfolk, Raleigh, Columbia S.C., Charleston, Wilmington and Savannah

    Base of operations: Washington D.C. and Annapolis (Sea)

    4th Campaign - Louisiana (Start late 1862)

    Objectives: (2) Mobile and New Orleans + Apalachicola

    Base of operations: Key West

    Take Apalachicola first then it is 26 sq to Mobile

    Final Campaigns (Start early 1863)


    Pittsburg vs Wheeling

    New Albany vs Louisville

    St. Louis vs Springfield Missouri

  14. #194
    techumseh
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    The Lost Cause. A Southern Revisionist History.

    The South should have won. The scenario defeated them. And so the debate of the history of the scenario repeats the debate of the actual history. My case:

    I've taken a look at the casualties on both sides at 3 points in the game: June 1864 - the turn Richmond fell, March 1865 - the turn Atlanta was recaptured by the CSA, and September 1865 -the turn the Confederates surrendered.

    In my opinion, the decisive event was the fall of Richmond in June 1864. This was totally unexpected (by me) and unhinged the entire Confederate strategy of a static defense in the east and an active one in the west. Unable to counter the Union offensives in the east after the loss of it's key defensive position and it's best general, CSA victories in the west were insufficient to turn the tide. More aggressive Union generalship helped also, as constant pressure along the Chattanooga-Atlanta line, despite Union defeats, facilitated the isolation of Atlanta and the loss of Stonewall Jackson.

    Let's look at the stats. Infantry is the key unit - cavalry and artillery losses are insignificant in comparison. By June 1864, the CSA had lost 104 infantry units. By March 1865, they had lost 217 infantry, an increase of 208% in only 9 months. In the last 3 months, the CSA had lost another 69 infantry, for a total of 286, or 275% over the losses at June 1864. By contrast, the US had lost 172 infantry units by June 1864, and 258 by the end of the game, or an increase of just 144%.

    In the same period, CSA militia losses skyrocketed from 65 to 178, almost triple. During the same time, US militia losses were light, only increasing by 13. These numbers reflect the loss of city garrisons by the CSA in the last 9 months of the scenario.

    The last statistic of interest is the loss of heavy artillery by the US side. These units have the 'missile flag', so are destroyed after attacking. The US had expended 26 up to June 1964, or 1/3 of the total used in the first 42 turns of a 60 turn scenario. By March of 1865, they had used 66 and by the end of the game, 79 in total.

    What this shows is that Union losses exceeded those of the Confederates up until the last quarter of the scenario, and that the loss of Richmond was a "game changer". The Union strategy of mass building heavy artillery units was very effective in demolishing one Confederate position after another, and increasing CSA losses to an unsustainable level. This is realistic in the sense that it represents the industrial superiority of the north as the Civil War progressed.

    However, it is not representative of the historical military situation or the realistic potential of the north..../
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  15. #195
    techumseh
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    However, it is not representative of the historical military situation or the realistic potential of the north ... because it doesn't reflect the effective tactical combination of arms. In other words, heavy artillery is there to support the attack of the infantry, but can't replace it. Heavy artillery units were primarily utilized to support attacks on major fortifications, and their use in the game should be more limited. The only way to do this is to make them more expensive, say +50%.

    What is your policy regarding replays? I don't know if you did this, but I admit that on a few occasions after a disasterous start, I started my turn over. Allowing unlimited replays would skew the results, especially with heavy artillery. With 2 hits and 4 firepower, they have a significant random factor, which can be negated with replays. My intention was that while any single attack with a H.A. could wipe out any single defending unit, on average 1 1/2 to 2 H.A. units would be needed to take out one entrenched defender.
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  16. #196
    McMonkey
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    I found that against Consripts the HA more often than not won outright. Against Volunteers, Elite units and Cannons they occasionally won outright, often caused severe damage (50%+), sometimes caused minor damage and very occasionally had no visible effect (). If I was unable to afford Heavy Artillery I would have just cranked out way more Infantry. My assaults would have been much more costly in lives but I think that would have been somewhat balanced out by the small amount of Infantry that would have survived combat to become Veterans, unlike HA which were always destroyed. Veteran Infantry has a much better impact in a city assault than green troops.

    All that said though, as I will be playing the Confederates in the next version a 50% increase in HA cost would be most welcome

    I think the scenario played out in a fairly historical way with the Union launching some over ambitious early attacks only to be sent reeling by superior Confederate Generalship. After this the Union became more cautious and was willing to use its industrial advantage to build up vast manpower and fire-power superiority before embarking on an attack. In the end it was this vast build-up of Infantry and Heavy Artillery plus a few Generals, unleashed in one swift attack on Richmond that turned the tide of the war in the Unions favour. Once we had gained the initiative every effort was made to keep the blows coming and keep the Rebel defences off balance with outflanking manoeuvres. It took all my organizational skills to keep a flow of troops moving along a narrow corridor, flanked by Rebel holdout cities, pressing towards the final objectives. My victory was one of organizational and logistical skill over inspired Generalship.

    Systematic replays to gain the best possible combat results would be cheating, but I'm sure most players would admit to the odd re-load after a slip of the finger sends a ship to the bottom of the sea or a unit off its intended course into a position where it will face certain death. There is really no way to tell if someone is replaying turns to get the best possible results, but at the end of the day they would only be cheating themselves as any victory would be hollow. I think an unending succession of outrageously lucky engagements would also rouse the suspicion of the other players. One only has to test the units out to get an idea of their combat potential and likely losses.

  17. #197
    rikki84
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    Any chance this scenario will become available for anyone else to play?

  18. #198
    techumseh
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    Quote Originally Posted by rikki84 View Post
    Any chance this scenario will become available for anyone else to play?
    Absolutely. Give me a couple of weeks to make the changes I have in mind, and I'll post the final version here.
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  19. #199
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    Awesome, it looks great

  20. #200
    Harry Tuttle
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    I applaud both your efforts. You both have gone above and beyond for this scenario, something not seen since Red Front was a new thing. As an American I also applaud your seriousness and detail while playing the scenario. Very good job guys!

    This looks to be a very flushed out scenario and would also welcome a posting of the scenario in full.

  21. #201
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    Thanks Harry. I had a great time playing this scenario. Coming home from work I would be hoping Techumseh's turn would be there waiting for me. I think the balance is almost spot on now, after a few more tweaks it will be perfection! Its a shame the AI isn't more capable as it would be great to have a single player version, alas I think the map it just too large for the AI to cope with I expect it would be possible to make a single player version for one side using events and non-symmetrical unit stats, but I doubt it would be as much fun as a two player battle.

  22. #202
    techumseh
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    Thanks from me also, Harry. It was much fun, as Drew says. I hope that the scenario and the playing of it was respectful of the war that still helps shape your country, despite the occasional attempt at irony and humour.

    Drew, I hate to tell you this, but I think the scenario is substantially weighted in favour of the north. Most of the changes I'm making for the final version will benefit the south. Union units will cost more, heavy artillery will cost lots more, southern research will be speeded up, and generic confederate generals will be created at the same rate as Union ones. On the other hand, 1/2+1/2 defensive positions will be reduced in number, and the defense factor of ironclads will be significantly increased.

    As far as a single player game is concerned, I wouldn't consider the current map/scenario as a viable starting point. It should be a much smaller map, with the CSA as the protagonist, and the Union played by the AI, with (increasingly more) massive reinforcements created by events which eventually overwhelm the south.
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  23. #203
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    Those changes sound good to me, especially as I've called first dibs on the Rebs next time I take it 1/2+1/2 defensive positions refers to rivers in hill squares? If you take away too many good defensive positions in the countryside you could force players into cities which would end up with the game being a series of sieges. I liked the fact that much of our game was fought out in the open, it made good use of the large map. The defensive positions allowed mobile operations far from friendly cities and also allowed a few defenders to hold up a larger force. Useful when trying to guard long borders!

  24. #204
    techumseh
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    Mostly rivers in river terrain squares, actually. In a game where the most cost-effective attacker against defending infantry is infantry, small defensive bonuses count for far more than in scenarios where high-attack artillery and armour units are readily available. Rivers on river terrain give a combined defensive bonus of 225%, which are pretty solid defensive positions, especially if there are fewer heavy artillery units around.

    Don't worry, I will keep most strategic defensive positions and may even add a couple (ie. Fredericksburg and Petersburg). Mostly I will be eliminating rivers running through cotton fields, and just using river terrain.

    I'm also thinking of replacing the victory conditions with something more realistic and a bit more sophisticated. Instead of forcing play to continue to the end of 1865 (didn't happen), then counting objectives, I think the victory conditions should force the Union player to hit a set number of objectives by a certain time in order to win a decisive victory, a bit longer to win a marginal, and so on. If he fails to achieve this by the end of 1865, it's a decisive defeat.

    Having checked my available event memory, I found I still have over 1/5 left (21kb), which is lots. So I should be able to create events which ends the game when the Union accomplishes it's requirements and automatically announces the level of victory. What do you think?
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  25. #205
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    Sounds good to me. I did notice that a few cities and historically important towns were not on the map. I'm not an expert on the Civil War and perhaps some of the smaller towns were only notable due to a battle being fought there and don't merit a place or cannot be fitted in due to limited map space, but here they are:

    Would you consider adding:
    Birmingham, Alabama
    Gettysburg
    Biloxi
    Baton Rouge
    Natchez
    Shiloh (perhaps too small)
    Covington (to put something between Cairo and Memphis)
    Hagerstown
    Williamsport
    Manassas Junction
    Chancellorville
    Charleston, Missouri
    Columbus, Kentucky
    Shreveport, Louisiana
    Onancock

    I would suggest dropping:
    Schenectady
    Saginaw
    Kalamazoo
    Sarnia and perhaps a few other British cities

    The Shenandoah Valley!

    I would also add rivers (the original type using keu's excellent CivRiver tool) to add some rapid movement capability up and down the Shenandoah Valley. Historically a lot of the action in the east took place there despite there being no continuous railroad along the valley. In the game I think it would be unlikely for the Confederates to launch an attack there as things stand. Even if they could mass a force and catch the Union off guard, by the time they had moved to the end of the Valley the Union will be able to bring in enough reinforcements to block them and will be able to reinforce much more easily than the Rebels with no RR links. A river running through the Valley would make a Rebel Campaign there a much more viable option! Looking at my maps the river could begin at Waynesboro (or square 180,90) where it would link with the Charlottrsville to Staunton RR line and then run through Harrisonburg and Winchester and end at Harper's Ferry. Although the north and south forks do not run directly through Harrisonburg or Winchester they are close enough on the scale of the map for this to be perfectly realistic.

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    Great Scenario, Techumseh
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