why is econ such a problem at even the easiest setting?

[vmxa1]

I am still trying to work out some of the things that I do not care for in this game as I think it could be fun.
Too many votes and they are too frequent. They have too large of an impact, especially at the lower levels.

One thing that is annoying me is that even a planet that is quite large 30+ and has :

Bank, Embassy, Fusion plant, Habitat, Soil (6 maint).
Rev 27 Spend 43, building Gravity Accel and a Constructor.
No planet is able to have enough income to met its spending, even though I did not make any purchases on time. I have one frieghter working and two more heading out. I have some pledged income. Morale is 50%.
Now I am not saying that things could not be done, what I am saying is why on earth would a game set to the lowest setting and having no extra structures build, be running in the red?
What I mean is why would you construct the basic econ model such that you will have trouble managing it at the baby setting?
Yes, I could trade more, but you should not have to so early in the game (2194).

[Jon Shafer]

Just wait 'til you get to the higher difficulty levels...
Then you're in the red and the AI civs are a mile above you with half as many planets.

[vmxa1]

I am not looking forward to it. Really I am hoping some things will be changed, such as too many votes and them being too powerful. Trade being too much of a factor in the game for my taste.
I mean it is not hard to win, but I want to be able to build all of my structures and I do not want to be constantly making trades ro trying to make them.

[vee4473]

I agree that it is a bit daunting at first to keep the economy in the +.

Yeah, you can adjust the spending slider to keep a handle on it, but then it takes forever to build anything.

The credit system is cool, but wow, being strapped for 15bc/turn for 100 years can really hamper the early game.

[Eric S]

I think the reason that the planet in question is in the red is because you have to finance the construction/research, and that is included in the numbers. If you reduce your funding level, you'll probably see the planetary expense numbers drop. Unlike the Civ-type games, you don't get your production for free in GalCiv. That's what makes trading (freighter trading, not diplomatic trading) so important. I've never seen a developed planet that was in the black by itself, unless the funding slider was set very low.

Which makes a Manufacturing center doubly expensive, because not only does it require a maintenance fee, but now you have more production capacity, so it's more expensive to fund that planet to the same % of production capacity. It's still worth it if you have enough trade coming in to pay for it, though. I've had times my trade was bringing in more than my taxes, and if you understand the freighter system, it isn't hard to keep most of your planets maxed out at 100% funding.

[WarpStorm]

Plus, don't forget to build trade enhancing starbases.

[vmxa1]

Like I said the means to avoid the finace issues are available, but I just do not see why it should be a problem at the lower levels.
The econ works the same regardless and I wonder if that is a good thing to dump on newbies?
I just have a peeve with games not making the easiest level, well easy.
I can handle it, but I should not have to. I wan tthe struggle to come as I move up to the higest levels.
When one plays Moo on tutorial level, they do not strain, that is for hard and impossible. When I play on impossible, I know what I am doing, so lay it on me. Not when they open up the box for the first run.
If you do not want to adapt the AI, fine give a bigger cash start at the lowest setting.

[Fried-Psitalon]

I think you might be doing something odd- in only my second game *at all* and my first completed one, I didn't run into any problems keeping my finances afloat. You just have to be willing to use multiple methods of funding:

Trade route increasing starbases
"Money over time" trades - I prefer these to "Up front"
Be picky about your first planets


It's also worth noting that you can pull a LOT more money from other Civs on the lower levels with your tech. Moving it from "Beginner" to "Sub Normal" (racial intelligence) has found me grinding my teeth in frustration sometimes- they DO NOT want to give things up as easily. I've found myself rabidly pursuing diplomacy to fix this.

[Harry Seldon]

Diplomacy won't fix that even if your diplomacy is incredible. I'm playing one on subnormal and have friendly relations with the Yor and Arcean. They will not trade me the battleship or dreadnaught techs. I've tried to trade them eleven techs and three thousand dollars and they still won't trade. And this is with them repeatedly asking me to help them stave off the Drengin.

[vmxa1]

Trading war techs is something ost should be loathed to do, it makes sense to me.

Yes, I know I could spend all my time trying to sell tech to get cash, but that is not fun and should be nerfed.
In my current run I am being more selective about my planets and that has help. I also am not building social type stuff.

[Harry Seldon]

I've gotten burned not building social stuff. Bad moral, slow build queues, no culture. I can't seem to find a good balance.

[Malleus]

Originally posted by vmxa1
Yes, I know I could spend all my time trying to sell tech to get cash, but that is not fun and should be nerfed.
In my current run I am being more selective about my planets and that has help. I also am not building social type stuff.

Well, perhaps this is not the game for you? These are keys to success in the game. It was designed this way. It's fun!

M

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by Malleus

Well, perhaps this is not the game for you? These are keys to success in the game. It was designed this way. It's fun!
M

Yes it may turn out that I will not enjoy it, if that is the only method. In Civ III it was a big help, yet you could get by with out it, but it is much harder in Galciv as lessor planets are not productive.

I just do not see how it can be "fun" to go to all of the races constantly and try to sell them something.
It is very tedious and boring to me.

Searching the map, acquiring new planets, improving my planets, learning new tech, those are exciting and fun things. Combat is interesting, but trying to make a deal it not.

[Fried-Psitalon]

I sit more in the middle on this. There does need to be SOMETHING to make trades run a little more smoothly, even if it's as simple as having the trade offered remain in the window if it fails so you can modify it instead of having to reclick EVERYTHING over.... or a "Civ-type" advisor who says "No way, maybe, probably, yes they'll take that, and "Wow, Christmas for the Drengins!"

[vmxa1]

I like the way (CivIII) you can just say what do you want for this or what will you give me for this. Now I have to take a stab in the dark and then adjust it over and over, yeah that is fun.
Especially when they have one thing I want and I have no idea what it will take to get it. I offer two items, then 3, then 4 and then I give up. So if I could say what do you want and they could tell me or say no way.