How will GalCiv react to the Moo3 delays?

[WarpStorm]

Can you still get the beta version of GalCiv?

[Draginol]

We've been torturing ourselves on that very issue: Would you be better off releasing BEFORE MOO3 or releasing AFTER MOO3.

Release before MOO 3 and you get people giving MOO 3 the benefit of the doubt. We've seen that in our own beta program who haven't even played MOO 3 in beta. Any imagined short coming in our game surely won't exist in MOO 3 which will "kick our ass" (as one MOO 3 fan put it).

Of course, coming out AFTER MOO 3 (or trying to) has its own risks. Could end up delaying GalCiv only to have MOO 3 get delayed again.

MOO 3's marketing has been pretty strong.

Consider this: It's gotten previews in every game magazine and webzine. I've personally visited many of the game magazines/webzines and demoed the game to them various times in the past year. By comparison, we've gotten very little coverage.

Clearly they're doing something right to get all that coverage.

As a gamer, I want MOO 3 to be really good. I've been looking forward to MOO 3 for a long time. Obviously it would be ideal if they weren't coming out so close to one another.

[TCO]

As a competitor, you should hope for problems with Moo3.

[moomin]

Gee, GP, I think Mark got your number when he thought you were out on a trolling spree.

Competitor or not, of course Stardock should hope for Moo3 to be a huge hit - the additional interest in the TBS 4x space format is guaranteed to trickle down to quality offerings like GalCiv if it does. That effect will far outweight any competitive crowding out that may happen.

It's not like any of these games are going head to head with Warcraft III, after all.

[LDiCesare]

Before or after, that is a hard question indeed.
It all depends on the amount of PR you can get...

[TCO]

Originally posted by moomin
Gee, GP, I think Mark got your number when he thought you were out on a trolling spree.

Competitor or not, of course Stardock should hope for Moo3 to be a huge hit - the additional interest in the TBS 4x space format is guaranteed to trickle down to quality offerings like GalCiv if it does. That effect will far outweight any competitive crowding out that may happen.

It's not like any of these games are going head to head with Warcraft III, after all.

1. I troll a little...but it is all in fun. I wasn't really trolling there. Just being smartassed.

2. I'm more interested in the game development than the games...at times.

3. Brad already gave a cogent explanation for why Moo3 hurts GalCIv rather than helping it. Pie division is more important than pie growing--the products are more substitutes than complements.* Sure they have characteristics of being each. But the substitute dimension is more important than the complement one.

4. Of course our interests as gamers are not exactly aligned with Brad (some areas where they merge...but others where there is conflict). So we as consumers would benefit from success of both games. That's why I got this forum set up. It's in our interests not to be beholden to QS and Moo3.

*You may want to read a very light business book: Coopetition by Naglebuff.

[Urban Ranger]

Edan,

Sure, like Neverwinter Nights. I reckon it's not as much as the wait but all those release dates that got to people.


Asmodean,

Not sure about that. I think they'd do better to really kickstart the marketing right before the game is released.

[Asmodean]

Yeah, of course they should do that, but in the end they have MoO2 backing them up, and that does count for a lot.

Asmodean

[moomin]

Originally posted by GP
Pie division is more important than pie growing--the products are more substitutes than complements.

Hmmm. Color me unconvinced. There will be something of a substitution effect in the primary segment - 4x TBS geeks like us - but a high, profile, successful Moo3 launch will attract interest for GalCiv from a much larger target audience; gamers in general, who might be into playing, say, Counterstrike today. If Moo3 manages to convince 1% of that segment into looking at additional 4x TBS, I could well imagine it'd outweight a 50% substitution loss in the primary segment.

And pointing at a book won't help your case - I've done enough of these, thankyouverymuch. If you could provide a hard analysis, say from a marketing-mix perspective and indluding the five-point industry force model I'd be a lot more willing to accept you conclusion. But I'm far too lazy to do so myself, so I'll go by gut feeling. And by the old adage that in entertainment, substitution is between segements, not in them.

[TCO]

The five forces model is just qualititative. I don't have a whole qualitiatve business case...and certainly not a marketing conjoint analysis. I'm going off of Brad's remark in this thread.

[Zoid]

Originally posted by Draginol

Consider this: It's gotten previews in every game magazine and webzine. I've personally visited many of the game magazines/webzines and demoed the game to them various times in the past year. By comparison, we've gotten very little coverage.

Clearly they're doing something right to get all that coverage.

Like giving them large amounts of money...

But on-topic I would go for an early release. If that wouldn´t hurt the game that is (Civ3 *shudder*). If MoO3 is as ****ed up as everybody says it is, people will still buy it, but after they discover it´s crap they will return to GalCiv.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by moomin
Competitor or not, of course Stardock should hope for Moo3 to be a huge hit - the additional interest in the TBS 4x space format is guaranteed to trickle down to quality offerings like GalCiv if it does. That effect will far outweight any competitive crowding out that may happen.

That would be my take on it too. If Moo3 is a big success, Galcivs can latch itself onto the same bandwagon, so to speak. If people are impressed by one product of a particular genre they're much more likely to want to try out others as well...
OTOH if Moo3 turns into a bit of a flop or is subjected to more serious delays, Galcivs can portray itself as a viable alternative.

The substitute over complement angle strikes me as overly conservative. I can see it being applicable perhaps for a few weeks after release, if indeed they are released near-simultaneously, but not in the longer term.

[TCO]

Brad, it looks like you and I are on the same side. Unfortunately, Poly's administration is very "tender" about teasing the the gaming developers. And my attempt to "generate discussion" at the Moo3 forum about your Feb 25 prediction was locked.

Maybe you will give me some "food for discussion" later. This sort of stuff is what online communities thrive on.

[MarkG]

GP, you dont need to troll, misinterpreting people in order to generate discussion. You ought to know this by now....

[TCO]

Ok.