Dark Avatar Impressions

[yin26]

Do we want Iron Man games? As in NO do-overs? Or are we trying to craft the best story/score within a certain time frame? I'm not that big on maximizing score, but I love to see people play with flair -- intrigue, backstabs, major upsets, etc.

[Hydro]

Personally, I'm OK with tech trades. That is, after all, one of the benefits of the Diplomat super ability and investing in yellow techs.

I would say that do-overs are against the spirit of any such demonstration. Or, if you do, come out and say so.

I'd like to see a story crafted as part of the AAR, but it isn't necessary (plus, some folks would see that as a chore). I guess I've played SMAC too long, and that helps in immersion: take on the mantle or ethos of your race and play accordingly. Of course, events (and neighbors!) will drive you in certain directions, but that is part of the fun!

My proposal: 2 themed games that can be played, and AARs posted by the authors. Screen shots would be welcome! They posts can be in the form of a storyline, or can be of a more technical nature. Regardless, the idea is to have these be a learn-by-watching Gal Civ 2 University.

Game 1: But I’m The Good Guy
The Dread Lords are defeated, but the galaxy is in shambles. Alliances have dissolved into petty squabbling, economies have imploded, and technology lost. All that remains is a memory of empire and a burning desire to right wrongs…or avenge wrongs.

GC2: DA
Player: Iconians (good)
5 AI players: Yor, Korath (evil); Thalians, Terrans (neutral); Torians (good)
2 minor races
Small galaxy, common everything, standard settings
Special – Yor at war with Iconians (ancient vengeance against former masters); Torians at war with Korath (old vengeance against Drengin)

Game 2: You die, she dies, everybody dies…
The dust has settled and only those that did what was necessary have survived the Dread Lords. The weak races are but a lingering memory of ineptitude, and some of them have made worthy slaves. Ah, but there are others. Perhaps they are not so soft, but that will make victory all the more delicious (literally!).

GC2: DA
Player: Korath
5 AI players: Drengin, Yor, Korx (evil); Krynn, Thalians (neutral)
3 minor races
Small galaxy, common everything, standard settings
Special – Drengin and Korath at war

Thoughts?

Hydro

[LordTheRon]

I'm game too!

I like the concept of both playing a good race and an evil race. I'm an Iconian fan too but I haven't played them in DA yet.

For techtrading we can put in the variant that it's only allowed to trade if the AI proposes a trade. But I'm ok with full techtrading too.

[Solver]

For the record, I hate reloading saves and maximizing score. For example, before finishing a game, I don't maximize my pop for more score...

[LordTheRon]

I really dislike maximizing scores and reloading. Making mistakes is part of the fun of the game. The AI makes mistakes so the human should live with his mistakes too. So no reloading for me.

Maximizing score is even worse. What's the fun in just clicking and waiting to get more points?

Does this mean you are in Solver?

[Solver]

Possibly .

[Stuie]

This sounds like fun... despite the fact that I dislike small maps.

[yin26]

I like your plan, Hydro. Would you like to generate the save?

[Solver]

Small with 5 AIs actually sounds crowded. I typically play with 5 AIs on Medium maps. So I guess this'll make them more aggressive as they fight for lebensraum.

Anyway, keep in mind the fact that I suck at actual playing, despite being an analytic .

[LordTheRon]

Originally posted by Solver
Small with 5 AIs actually sounds crowded. I typically play with 5 AIs on Medium maps. So I guess this'll make them more aggressive as they fight for lebensraum.

Anyway, keep in mind the fact that I suck at actual playing, despite being an analytic .

According to this topic, it seems we all suck, so this should be great fun!

5 AI's IS crowded, but it gives some nice extra things to think about for the startup strategy I think.

[Solver]

So the only question is who sucks more?

[yin26]

Ah, but I'm horrible with flair!

[Hydro]

I don’t think the purpose of this exercise is to be super-competitive (I’m not a go-for-throat type myself). I see it more as an opportunity to either share a story as it unfolds (an AAR story) and provide a summary of what you did (technical AAR). Perhaps there might be a summary at the end of what went right or what might be improved. As to reloading, I’m just to lazy to do this. Plus, it sucks the fun out of the game (and is kind of pointless to boot).

If everyone is OK with these setups I’ll put together an Apolyton GC2: DA AAR University thread with a little info on the purpose, the scenarios, and suggestions on how to post. I may create the maps using the map editor to ensure an ‘interesting’ situation, but I’m not sure how or if it works in DA. More likely, I’ll just set up a normal sandbox game. I’ll make sure the player has a few cool tiles in their home planet to make it interesting (or I suppose you can do ^N)!

I’ll work on it this weekend and will post Saturday.

I thought of a few more ideas for possible games:

Game 3: In The Pocket

The battle against the Dread Lords has finished and the major races now have the resources to start colonizing the rest of the galaxy. One promising sector was almost unpopulated before the confabulation of the Dread Lords and colony ships from six races arrive more or less at the same time. While exploring one of the worlds the impetuous Terrans stumble upon an Arnorian artifact. It is activated and there is a pulse of light and then…nothing.

Or, it seemed like nothing. Panicked calls come in from HQ that most of the galaxy has disappeared! Did the device obliterate most of the known universe? The Arnorians were so powerful, it might just be true. Eventually a different but almost as horrible truth becomes known: the device activated a pocket universe, and everyone in this sector is trapped in it. After this stark realization a more chilling question remains: are there Dread Lords – imprisoned ages ago and primed for conquest and revenge – in this pocket of time and space? There may be rescue, but first there is a more important mission: to survive.

GC2: DA
Player: Terrans (neutral)
5 AI players: Torians, Drath (good); Drengin, Korx (evil); Krynn (neutral)
No minor races
Small galaxy, common everything, abundant habitable planets; standard settings
Special – are the Dread Lords present?

Game 4: And Miles To Go

An area separated from the rest of the galaxy by a wide starless gulf remained un-colonized for almost a decade after the invention of the hyperdrive by the Terrans. Specially outfitted colony ships were finally dispatched with the expectation that they’d take years to arrive at their destination.

Then the Dread Lords struck and the home empires were suddenly occupied with a fight for their lives. The sad truth is that there would be no reinforcements, no additional colonists – nothing. Moreover it appears the war against the ancient evil is going poorly, but it is possible that this far-flung outpost might be allowed to develop unnoticed…maybe.

GC2: DA
Player: Thalians (neutral)
4 AI players: Yor, Drengin (evil); Altarian (good); Arceans (neutral)
Small galaxy, common everything, standard settings
Special – none

[LordTheRon]

I won't be at home during the weekend, but I'll pick up on Sundayevening or Mondayevening.

[ShroudedMist]

Hello all. I thought I would chime in on my DA impressions.

First of all, it's definitely a worthy expansion pack. Extreme worlds, mega events, super abilities and customizable races all help to evolve the gameplay of DA over GC2.

The biggest issues I have currently are the following:
1) The algorithm used for the Autoexplore function is grossly inefficient and has tons of overlap and outright stupidity in its execution. When ships only move 2 or 3 parsecs/wk in the early game, wasted moves due to a poorly designed Autoexplore function can easily be the difference between you finding the top quality planets and resources or losing them to other civs or minor races. It's definitely an area of the game where the smart player is forced to micromanage each explorer ship individually.

2) The Super Hive super ability is overpowered. This super ability, for those unfamiliar with it, allows the civ to construct factories much faster than another civ. I gave this issue some thought last night and decided what is the crux of the issue. Coupled with the fast build time is the added bonus of being able to BUY factories much cheaper than other civs. A tier 1 factory can be bought for 90bc while another civ is forced to pay 438bc. Similar differences exist for the higher tier factories. This allows the player to really crank up production capabilites fast through a combination of outright purchasing and fast build times. If it was changed to simply be fast build times but normal costs to purchase then it would feel a bit more balanced I think.

I hate to suggest something be nerfed. Maybe it's merely my playstyle but when I'm so smitten on a specific super ability to the detriment of all others it suggests that the ability might need some adjustment. Please remember that I like to play Gigantic maps so these issues might be as problematic on the smaller maps where the colonization phase ends much earlier.

3) Tech Trading. Solver discussed this quite well in his review and it sounds like there is a patch out that might address this issue. As it stands currently, AIs trade their military techs way too much with each other. You end up with no specialization between the AIs. This also makes it quite easy for a human player to sit around focusing on production and yellow techs for a LONG time (remember I play gigantic maps). When it looks like the number of worlds available to colonize is starting to wind down, you can merely hit up the minor races for a whole battery of weapon techs. I love the idea of diplomacy, tech trading and what not. Hopefully upcoming patches will help to address this. As it currently stands, I'm choosing to turn off tech trading to keep myself from being a lazy and in turn making myself research military techs on my own in advance lest I be caught unprepared.

4) Laziness in checking AI color and flag choice at the start of the game combined with the inability to change flag and/or color in midgame. There needs to be a basic sanity check at the start of each game to ensure that the AIs chosen do not have identical flags or colors to the ones chosen by either the player or another AI or minor race. For instance, if I choose Dark Blue as my color, then the game should simply change the color of the Terran AI to something unique if they're going to be in the game. Secondly, something needs to be added to set apart dark colors from the background colors of both the minimap and the main screen. Outline dark colors with a slight white outline or something. Set your the color of your civ to black and watch yourself be unable to see your black ships and starbases on the main screen.


I usually play the following:
difficulty: Crippling
size: Gigantic
9 random civs
8 minor races
Loose Clusters, abundant everything
Normal research

I totally understand people who enjoy playing the game on Normal difficulty due to having kids (I have 3 young ones myself). However, I urge you to try some games at Tough or above and enable "Force AI to use max cpu". This seems to be the tipping point for when you start to see a bit of a challenge from the AI where it isnt a foregone conclusion that you'll wipe the floor with the AIs once the colonization phase ends based on the # number of worlds gained, research levels and production capacities.

I love the random events too. It'd be great to see Brad add a bunch more into the mix in future patches and maybe add an option for determining how often they occur. The first time I saw the Jagged Knife mega event I was like W T F! The pirates snagged a good 20% of my worlds and some of them were high PQ ones to boot.

Anyways, you guys asked for some more input so there you go.