Vanguard Saga Of Heroes - Player made screenshots released

[Harovan]

Originally posted by DrSpike
I feel the need to return to this. "Slow and challenging travel" is touted by Ralphie as a hardcore feature. We have many MMO players here, anything from a few hours a week to many hours a week. Who amongst you wants to spend your time travelling to the next area?

Nobody. You just step over the chunk border. It's a seamless world with quadratic chunks.

Slow travel was never a hardcore feature, if anything it is a role play feature because there is an argument it makes the world seem bigger and more real and adds to immersion

Yes, and the label "hardcore" or "roleplaying" you attach to it does not change this fact.

But let's face it - it's a game and I want to develop my character by doing fun things, not walk, ride or otherwise travel for hours on end. I do that in real life.

It's not hardcore and it's not challenge - it's just boring, and I sincerely hope the VG devs realise this.

The day a one-click travel is introduced, Vanguard will lose about 50% of its followers, if not more. It would completely contradict "The Vision (tm)" and that's why most of them are there.

Slow travel is a bad word by the way. There will be travel speeders. Mounts, not as late as in other games, but pretty much from the beginning. Player-made vehicles. Player made ships. Caravans. With the latter you travel overnight. You join it, log off and when you log in again, you'll be at the destination (or the last reached waypoint).

It's of course not "A says to the guild: Temple of Veeshan raid LFM" - "B says to the guild: BRT, 5 min".

As for your preferrences, shrug, well, let me reiterate... WoW, GW, EQ2, even EQ1... you have enough to choose your games from. All with one-click-travel.

Qilue: Yes, I told you, this game is not for you. Play WoW or EQ2, both excellent new games with expansions now and then. By the way "No fun" is not part of the FAQ, at least last time I checked. And you can solo. Soloers are just not the target audience.

EDIT: Both of you can by the way join the forum at www.vanguardsoh.com and share your opinion. The developers visit the forums on a daily basis, up to Brad, and will discuss game concepts. I think they can explain the game concepts much better than I can, old and grumpy as I am.

[DrSpike]

Hehe I knew I'd get ya.

I've been reading about VG and they seem to be claiming 'slow travel' without making it just an annoyance. Something like being able to travel overnight sounds ok. Something that means major downtime between action for no reason no one sane wants. I think.

[Harovan]

I think it comes down to having to choose the area you're in with some care. Travelling to the next city or outpost, or to the next chunk or even 2 or more chunks away ain't no issue - that's what mounts are for. By the way, your mount is also your storage for your spare armor - in case you "lost" your main set somewhere deep in a dungeon. Think of the horse waiting for you at the dungeon entrance.

To cross a continent from east to west, or north to south, or to get to another continent, however, could take a while. The world is fairly large. But you can always join a caravan and go neck a beer.

You'll be not able to join a raid at another continent within 5 or 10 minutes, as you can in EQ2 (I did that exercise quite a few times). You'll be able to join a group or raid within a few chunks from yours in that time without a problem. It's just not click-and-there, and you may have to dodge some mobs.

[Skanky Burns]

Originally posted by Qilue
Slow travel

This makes travel significant, and perhaps disuades people moving from area to area instantaneously. Provided the challenges are actually somewhat interesting, this still may not be bad.

Harsh death penality

If you complete your corpse run, you get most of that lost experience back which means death is slightly more bothersome than leaving an item at home. You have to run from home all the way back to where you were fighting.

No soloing

The focus is not on soloing, but there is soloable content. (Admittedly, a leaked review from a disgruntled beta-tester stated that you couldn't get anywhere soloing).

No fun

He agreed with this one too, but such a statement is subjective.

Items rule all

True.

[DrSpike]

omg Ralph has brainwashed Skanks into becoming a fanboi!!eleven!one!!!!

[Harovan]

That's vanboi for you, Spikes.

The yearly meeting of vanbois is the Fanguard, by the way.

[DrSpike]

[conmcb25]

Originally posted by Skanky Burns

Because it is published by a particular company is a pretty stupid reason to boycott a product. Especially a product that took this particular route so as to avoid SOE-style debacles where the publisher also had control over the direction of the project and at what point the product would be released.

Sigil had a number of alternatives to using SOE as publisher. They could have remained with MS in control, meaning Microsoft could have demanded the game be released two weeks from now in its almost playable state. They could have chosen another publisher that is either too small to handle the expected load and hence increase downtime for the players, or too inept at publishing to keep their servers up.

As a publisher, SOE is good. As a game designer, not so much. Since they are in this deal only in a publishing capacity, we the players get the good without the bad.

While I respect the fact that the decision is yours to make regarding boycotting this game, I feel that the message you are sending Sigil is actually contrary to the one you think you are sending. By boycotting you are telling Sigil that you feel a publisher (just like SOE or Microsoft) should have control over when the game is ready to be released rather than having the people actually making the game make that decision. Ironic.

Maybe, but I just won't give any more money to SOE or any group involved with SOE. There are plenty of publishers out there, and whether its game development or publishing SOE gets the thumbs down from me.

[DrSpike]

Hehe, SOE hatred is pretty widespread it seems.

[Skanky Burns]

True, but it just encourages companies to remain in situations where companies like SOE call the shots, usually to the detriment of the game, the players and in the longrun, to the company too.

[Harovan]

I would understand his outrage if SOE would be really publishing VG. But this is not the case. See my post at the previous page.

Who deprives himself of an otherwise good game, just because an unliked company is involved (and I may reiterate, in a marginal way, not as publisher but just as server host!), is in the same position as the six years old, who refuses to eat his dinner because evil mum made him to clear away his toys.

I hated the guts out of Infogrames. Did I refuse to play Civ3? No.

[conmcb25]

Whatever Sir ralph, some of your comments in these forums occassionally remind me of a six year old so touche'

Did you ever play SWG? What SOE did to that game and how they virtually alienated the netire community was criminal. They will not get any more of my money, and especially since two of my kids loved that game, and got screwed over in the total revamps SOE did without community input. Mess with me and Ill deal with it, mess with my kids and you will truely piss me off. When someone gives me horrendous service, I dont go back, I vote with my checkbook.

If that makes me a six year old then so be it.

So hosting servers, publishing or developing if it has the SOE name in any way shape or form they won't get my money.

I have my eyes on LOTRO anyway

And at least Turbine listens to there community.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by conmcb25
Whatever Sir ralph, some of your comments in these forums occassionally remind me of a six year old so touche'

Did you ever play SWG? What SOE did to that game and how they virtually alienated the netire community was criminal. They will not get any more of my money, and especially since two of my kids loved that game, and got screwed over in the total revamps SOE did without community input. Mess with me and Ill deal with it, mess with my kids and you will truely piss me off. When someone gives me horrendous service, I dont go back, I vote with my checkbook.

If that makes me a six year old then so be it.

Your loss.

So hosting servers, publishing or developing if it has the SOE name in any way shape or form they won't get my money.

I have my eyes on LOTRO anyway

My condolences.

And at least Turbine listens to there community.

their

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by conmcb25
Whatever Sir ralph, some of your comments in these forums occassionally remind me of a six year old so touche'

/me chuckles.

[DrSpike]

Btw for what it's worth I wouldn't deprive myself of a good game just because of SOE's small involvement, but I understand those who do. There are parallels in many areas of consumer behaviour, and ultimately, if you feel strong enough about something, you have the right to (and should) exercise your vote with your wallet.