The Clash forum guestbook v.2

[Henrik]

Finally got Mac OS X and thus I am able to download the demo.
I'm having problems though (posted about it in the demo thread)

[Ironikinit]

Hi. It will take me a while to play the demos and do the reading but I'm looking forward to it. It's a great project. I wish everyone involved success.

[Mark_Everson]

Originally posted by targon
Of course, poor soul forced to draw something in 40x30 pixels can't draw anything neat-looking. Proper drawing of application icons is an art in its own right, and I think its laws can hardly be applied to unit tokens, as they features are very different.
OK, I'll draw reasonable big tiles (if you actualy need something), and you may downsample it even to single pixel.
Returning to my previous post, do you need new unit graphics and what kind (if any)? Possible, move on something medival, or ancient theme needs some extension and overhaul?

Hi Targon:

This discussion is something I would like to move into the current unit graphics thread (see link in my post above). Discussions here will be lost in time, whereas in the graphics thread we will easily be able to find them, and people concerned with graphics will be able to see your ideas.

Could you move your post above to the graphics thread? I will post some requests there.

Thanks for volunteering to do some work!

Mark

[LFS]

It lets me look at the clock in the task bar at the bottom of the screen. Helps preventing getting to sleep at 2 AM.

can't argue with that - how many times have I still been up at sunrise

[LDiCesare]

There is one reason why I like windowed games (not talking about the look of the various windows): It lets me look at the clock in the task bar at the bottom of the screen. Helps preventing getting to sleep at 2 AM.
But then MOO3 has an alarm system which warns you when it is too late.
And we probably won't have separate windows like now when the game is finished, we'll have to think all the GUI over at some point (still far in the future).

[targon]

Originally posted by LFS

...however, having only just 'joined' up as well one has to accept the decisions of all those who worked on the project previously.

Of course, but does it include obvious mistakes. For example, you "trireme" tile. Spell its name. Tri-reme. "Tri" here means 3 linear arrays of oars, each side. But I can score just ~1.5 "remes". Of course, poor soul forced to draw something in 40x30 pixels can't draw anything neat-looking. Proper drawing of application icons is an art in its own right, and I think its laws can hardly be applied to unit tokens, as they features are very different.
OK, I'll draw reasonable big tiles (if you actualy need something), and you may downsample it even to single pixel.
Returning to my previous post, do you need new unit graphics and what kind (if any)? Possible, move on something medival, or ancient theme needs some extension and overhaul?

[LFS]

Q2) You're tied with really slow bytecode language, Java (mention about languages other than Lisp was censored), so Clash manages to "brake" even on fast mashines. So what about some speed-ups (like native compiling etc)?

Java rocks. It's cross platform , OO

sorry I'm a 100% java convert


java 1.4 is excellent for graphic - full screen exclusive mode produces awesome results, I had to slow down my simple space invaders game when I tried it in Full screen mode!

Some increase, say 150%, will surely inprove overall game outlook and reduce headashe due to manipulating microscopic tokens on modern big monitors.

gotta agree , I prefer bigger graphics, however, having only just 'joined' up as well one has to accept the decisions of all those who worked on the project previously.

On similar note I dislike the look of 'windowed games' and all those moveable internal frames, but note above applies.

[LDiCesare]

Current game tiles, particulary unit sprites, are somewhat small. Some increase, say 150%, will surely inprove overall game outlook and reduce headashe due to manipulating microscopic tokens on modern big monitors.

Images are actually zoomed in the code. So, for example for units, you can draw them as big as you like, they will be scaled based on the size of a tile. I think the image should roughly be square in order to be scaled nicely, but am not sure.
I like the small tiles, but a zoom function should certainly be done (later).

And yes we must remove the Win$ stuff on the web.

[Mark_Everson]

Hi targon, glad you checked Clash out! I've seen your 3D ship and other graphics on the SP site. Very cool! I'll give some brief answers to your pesky questions .

Originally posted by targon
Q1) Why you scare people with Window$ download links while the game is in fact cross-platform?

We should kill some of that. The problem is that the only platform we could provide guidance for was Win. But we should take the Win out of those links at a minimum.

Q2) You're tied with really slow bytecode language, Java (mention about languages other than Lisp was censored), so Clash manages to "brake" even on fast mashines. So what about some speed-ups (like native compiling etc)?

We don't know what is causing the graphical problems on certain reasonably fast machines. Please remember that the Clash that is out now is a pre-alpha version that has had absolutely no speed optimizations of any sort. We will do what we have to to make the game run acceptably fast on reasonably modern machines before v1.0

Q3) Does the game closely tied with ancient theme or it's only the current state?

Current state. The modern world is where a lot of the interesting stuff happens!

Q4) If you need some graphics, please suggest that kind of and what size.

Thanks for the offer! Best would be to put your offer in both of the most recent graphics threads so others will see it. From my own perspective we could use better images for economic specials (gold, etc.) than those in D7.2. See the Map Graphics Thread part III if you're interested. The other thread is Unit Graphics 2.

Current game tiles, particulary unit sprites, are somewhat small. Some increase, say 150%, will surely inprove overall game outlook and reduce headashe due to manipulating microscopic tokens on modern big monitors.

An increase is certainly possible. The other side of that coin is that we want to show the player a reasonably large bit of the map at one time. One good time to switch the unit graphics size spec would be when we go to polygons (Demo 9?). One thing you could do is show how much better you could do than what we have now with that extra 50% size.

Q5) Do you plan to employ graphics other than tiles, for example splash screens, wonders, gamecyclopedia etc?

Yes, probably all of these in the long run. Plus also accent bits for the GUI.

[targon]

Hey, people, I'm new here, so don't feel shy to blame on my pesky questions.
In fact, I'm artist from the Stella Polaris team but this job seems to be not err... dense, especialy without a line of published code or documentation. So some people suggested me to look at Clash, as you may need some more graphics. OK, Clash seems to even work, has website, on-line docs and so on. It gives completely new, refreshing feeling.
So let me ask several questions about the Clash:
Q1) Why you scare people with Window$ download links while the game is in fact cross-platform?
Q2) You're tied with really slow bytecode language, Java (mention about languages other than Lisp was censored), so Clash manages to "brake" even on fast mashines. So what about some speed-ups (like native compiling etc)?
Q3) Does the game closely tied with ancient theme or it's only the current state?

Q4) If you need some graphics, please suggest that kind of and what size. Current game tiles, particulary unit sprites, are somewhat small. Some increase, say 150%, will surely inprove overall game outlook and reduce headashe due to manipulating microscopic tokens on modern big monitors.
Q5) Do you plan to employ graphics other than tiles, for example splash screens, wonders, gamecyclopedia etc?

[Mark_Everson]

Hey Jeremy, boy does that suck! Can you post the same think in the D7 Comments thread? Maybe someone will see it and have a suggestion as to what might work as a fix.

[Jeremy Buloch]

It wont work corectly with my Windows 2000 pro. comp. I will test it on Linux soon when I get the chance. It wont let me right click on the units and wont let me move or do anything else. I have read the help in the game and the graphics look cool. Overall its good. I only wish I could play it.
-J.B.-

[Mark_Everson]

Thanks for the kind words and your comments both orange and Jeremy! When you get a chance, please tell us what you like and don't about demo 7.2. If Diplomacy is of interest, we could use your thoughts in refining our Diplomacy spec also. The thread should be visible.

Cya,

Mark

[Jeremy Buloch]

Thanks to Mark for posting in the StP forums and contributing and telling me of this project. I was now able to download the 7.2 version. I tried it and found it very good. I congratulate you guys in developing a game with good AI and other related things. I cant wait to see more of your project.
Thanks for peaking my interest.
-J.B.-

[orange]

Recently downloaded the newest version to give it a shot. Was very impressed I posted about it in another thread in a bit more detail, and also posted in the website and questionaire threads. I check in now and again. Great work guys