*!* Guide to current design status of Clash of Civilizations - comments anyone? *!*

[Chris Wilkinson]

LGJ,

Regarding the Wonders/Achievement model, I've been busy recenetly as I just started exams, but I think that it can wait a while longer until we can see how the other models are evolving and we get a coder.

Chris

[Richard Bruns]

Nothing new has happened with the technology model.

The ecology model continues to develop and improve as more people give their input. We are trying to iron out its relationship with the new economy model Mark posted, and more input regarding this would be helpful.

The other current hot topic is the size and structure of provinces and the overall characteristics of the map.

[Lord God Jinnai]

I think in addition to the status of the existing models, I think we need to list what is pretty much set in stone (Stone meaning it can change, but only slightly unless it just totally won't work). I'm saying this in light of the recent occurance that happened with the provinces, ecology and map size discussion. This way everyone can atleast have someplace to go to easily find this stuff out.

Currently. of the 3 models I'm working on only the Technology/Research/Social Advancement model is is pretty much set in stone. The formulas may change slightly tor balance purposes. Also we will be adding the stuff for the social modfiiers and how they act, but the social/cultural model needs to be pretty much done as far as the modifiers for differnt culures and religions and such are figured out before this part can be worked on.

That isn't to say it's near completion. Just the interal structure is set up basically. The external, or actuall technologies and advances aren't done and can be easily changed.

The wonder model i would like to say should be something along the lines I have it as, but its far from being "set in stone."

The character model is still very fluid. Basically the only things "set in stone" for it is the fact that characters will be optional and they can be of differnt numbers and can be allowed change aspects of the game via. how they are used. The other thing is that it is optional, but the player can assign most, not all, (or atleast attempt to) characters to differn't positions within the government or hire them out (like privateers). This isn't manditory that you even do it once, and their will be risks and rewards for doing such.

As for the dynasty part, the only thing set in that is that dynasty's should slowly get worse. That and the fact that people seem to be leaning toward an optional player dynasty instead of a god-like character in all the other civs who lives forever.

[The Diamond]

One of the things I like most about Clash is this character idea. It now gives you a new idea...if you're at war with Spain, rather than needing to wipe them out to attain peace, perhaps you could wait for the current king to pop his clogs and hope his son, or whatever, is more friendly to you...

It also gives you the possibility to have a rebellious prince decide that he wants his kingdom RIGHT NOW and cause a minor civil war. The possibilities are amazing and it doesn't take too much to string together a few possible random events so that one minute you could be laughing at the prince fighting his king, the next find yourself with an irate governor marching on your palace with his own personal army, demanding a change...

Problem with such an idea is that the time element needs to be considered. After all, a King's lifespan could be as small as 3yrs or as long as 35. Who knows? Naturally this is a slight problem in the early stages of the game.

Taking the Civ model of time passage, it's something like 100 turns maybe until 0 BC. However, you jump in 20yr increments. Fine, but that means a all characters change every turn...it would be impossibly complicated, especially for new users.

However, if you tone it down to 1yr intervals, you'd have to wait 4000 turns until you got to 0 BC. Unless the game is horribly slow, by that stage you'd probably be considering which planet to colonise, which isn't going to help realism.

Also, what's the use of hiring a particularly good general if he's gone in two turns? You'd want him for at least 20-30 or you might not even find a use for him. I'd be interested to know what the current trade-off between time/characters is...

[Mark_Everson]

On Things That Are Locked in:

Since we have discussing province sizes and map squares sizes recently I will just paste the information in here on what is locked in and the main reasons why it is so .

Provinces:
1. Give player and AI reasonably small number of empire subdivisions to work with (ideally 10 or less, Max 20 over the long haul) Primary use of subdivisions is for govt and econ.
2. your A,B, C above.
3. Ideally 20-50 squares. (Size of historical large provinces)
4. Since empires are expected to grow, with conquest and technology, provinces should be dynamic to satisfy 1.

Map Squares:
100km /60 mile squares (this will be the standard, which can be overridden by players and scenario designers when desired)
1. military: some tactical flavor remains esp for modern warfare;
2. AI: can't have too many squares to deal with;
3. graphics: get slow above this with target comp (may be a bit too much anyway when we get all the map levels going)

Military: [added 8/17/00]
Task forces exist on the map, and can move at the individual square level. Those that don't like this amount of management can put the AI in charge of their military and handle their input through broad directives to the AI generals.

I'll try to post some similar information on the econ area soon.


The Diamond:

Ummm... you really should put these comments in the current character thread where they belong. This thread should be pretty much used only for high-level issues. I think we have satisfactory answers for your problem, although they might not have made it into the summary. Last I recall (LGJ, please correct me if I'm giving bad information) we have two reasonable ways out of the dilemma. For multiyear timespans in a single turn we will either use the dynasties idea, where you rent/use a dynasty rather than just a single character, or simply make the characters arbitrarily have lifespan something like 20-30 turns. The basic notion is that when good gameplay conflicts with reality, screw reality...

[This message has been edited by Mark_Everson (edited August 17, 2000).]

[Richard Bruns]

We are making progress on the integration of the econ and ecology models. I have recently posted a proposal in the ecology thread that involves the impact of society and technology on decisions that impact the environment. I hope to get a lot of feedback so I can improve the idea or make a better one.

I am making a spreadsheet that models technology growth so we can test the tech system.

[roquijad]

Government,Social and Riots models: New versions just released. Currently starting discussions about them in forums.

Current coding progress level: 0%

Rodrigo

[Richard Bruns]

I have developed a population model that uses age based cohorts to model the people in the civ. I am currently working on the OO implementation of this model.

I have finished the spreadsheet that models the technology equations. We are currently working on the methods for handling social technologies and the impact of social factors on the standard technologies. My next task is to create a revised tech system with OO object structure.

The ecology model has been dormant for a while, but the plans for cooperation between the ecology and disaster models have been finalized. The model will not be implemented in the near future, and is a low priority compared to the other models. In a few weeks I should have Version 3 of the model, which will include OO design.