Beyond Alpha Centauri:: Discussion Thread 2

[Mellian]

Originally posted by Lonestar


Guess you haven't seen B5: Legend of the Rangers yet. The second ship is a Minbari Ranger ship, built 12 or so years before the Shadow War. Countrary to appearences, it is not organic.

Thats what happens when you don't have a TV available with Cable or Satellite or Digital and not being able to fit into the schedule of life Currently with my billeting family which as satellite, but all of the good channels are not available

[Lonestar]

Originally posted by Mellian


Thats what happens when you don't have a TV available with Cable or Satellite or Digital and not being able to fit into the schedule of life Currently with my billeting family which as satellite, but all of the good channels are not available

Pretty good flick.


...as Series Pilots go. Kicked the crap out of "The Gathering", that's for sure.

[Frankychan]

saw every B5 episode there is....except Crusade, which I thought was fooey!

Legend o' da Rangers? Me saw, me like. Me like how evil look bad. Me like 'Turk' who is Drahzi strong-arm of crew. When he explain what his name mean, me laugh.

[Lonestar]

Originally posted by frankychan
saw every B5 episode there is....except Crusade, which I thought was fooey!

.

Yeah, well, I think Crusade was pretty damn good. The ship was kick ass, especially.

Now we have to wait for the LOTR series to find out about the Drakh plague....


Incidently, The Protectorate, in the next post or the one after, is going to bring up the new Flagship, the 2.6 km Victory. Has no Marines, is a strictly Space faring vessel.

Guess what it looks like.

[Lonestar]

Sovereign, this may be a case of the Pot complaining of the Kettle's complexition..or vice versa...I'm not too good with metaphors, but when you have a big confontation with my boys, CHECK IT OUT FIRST!

Second, You have somehow completely misread Protectorate culture. The Protectorate does not "broadcast" transmissions. No signals leave or enter the system except on narrow band frequencies aimed at the "Ansible" (the collection of Tachyon Transmission relays the Protectorate has established. The relays are 2 ft x 2ft, so don't waste your time trying to find them.).

A Culture built around isolation wouldn't be making transmissions capable of being heard from outside the solar system. Certainly not uncoded transmissions.

Thrid: Uncoded transmissions. It's astonishing that you would be able to find out we're Human and speak English, what our government does (as if that's a regular broadcast anyway. Except on PBS). Especially as all our transmissions that would be leaving system (hell, planet to ship or planet) are heavily encoded. Like, encoded as you need another machine at the end, and you need to know what pi to the 34th decimal has to do with it.

-----------------------------------------------

So, how do we fix this snafu? Well, you could have simply read the names off the hulls, less dramatic but you would have found out we were humans that way. ("San Jacinto...why the hell would aliens speak Spanish?")

I'll aknowledge you probaly have the ability to sneak into the Roving system...it's not devolped, doesn't have Gravity wells set up to yank in-coming ships into realspace. So, the actual sneaking in doesn't need to be fixed.

But you need to do something about those "Intercepted transmissions", pronto.

But good post besides the complete mess up of Protectorate Culture/Protocol. I, of course, would never create such a screw-up.

[Sovereign]

ack! Sorry about that... I thought I sent you a PM about that, guess it didn't go through

I was under the assumption that civilizations would have some sort of enterainment, like movies, holo-vids, radio, etc. and Magellan picked these everyday chatter of the Roving populace. Suppose aliens explored our solar system, discovered signals emanating from Earth, and read these tranmissions as these Satellite TV uplinks showing the 500 channels. The same idea applies to the movie CONTACT, or was it ARRIVAL where aliens recieved Hitler's speech and sent it back to Earth with instructions to build the ring structure to teleport the ship to the alien landscape.

I'm not saying I dechipered your military stuff or top secret stuff Lonestar, just your populace's chatter and enterainment, phone calls, radio chatter, intercontiental tachyon signals (remember UCS has tachyon tech), and various on-planet tranmissions, NOT interstellar (if thats what you're referring to).

How shall we proceed to fix up this fiasco? I'm willing to edit some content. Remember, this is my very first time doing this kind of story stuff, and you can be assured I'll know exactly what to do next time. Sorry about the fiasco

[Mellian]

So, how do we fix this snafu? Well, you could have simply read the names off the hulls, less dramatic but you would have found out we were humans that way. ("San Jacinto...why the hell would aliens speak Spanish?")

Ahhhhhhh!!!!!!!! the Spanish have survive the nuke bombarments in WW3 ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!! wait, i wonder if they have tacos?

I'll aknowledge you probaly have the ability to sneak into the Roving system...it's not devolped, doesn't have Gravity wells set up to yank in-coming ships into realspace. So, the actual sneaking in doesn't need to be fixed.

What have i told you about those Gravity Wells, hmm? If you still want them, just have them at the mostly likely entry points into the system from various nearby systems.... then after pulling them out of FTL (not like a magnet), the GravWell prevents them from jumping away.... but can try to out run the Protectorate ships and try to get out of range of the Grav Well, then Jump. They could also try to destroy the Gravwell Doubt the Grav well in powerful enough to act like a Star, which requires a lot of power to do that. So while covering the most like directions ships will come in from, ships that knows what they are doing will be able to sneak around them by jumping to the middle of nowhere and then jump towards a Protectorate system so, making it still nescessary for the Protectorate to patrol their entire system....and have ships at the GravWell locations............ Fine with you? GravWells help, but not the perfect solution.

But good post besides the complete mess up of Protectorate Culture/Protocol. I, of course, would never create such a screw-up.

sure sure

[Mellian]

I was under the assumption that civilizations would have some sort of enterainment, like movies, holo-vids, radio, etc. and Magellan picked these everyday chatter of the Roving populace. Suppose aliens explored our solar system, discovered signals emanating from Earth, and read these tranmissions as these Satellite TV uplinks showing the 500 channels. The same idea applies to the movie CONTACT, or was it ARRIVAL where aliens recieved Hitler's speech and sent it back to Earth with instructions to build the ring structure to teleport the ship to the alien landscape.

Never assume in BAC actually, don't make assumptions and act upon it without being sure. unless you absolutly have no choice to assume................. "Assumption is the mother of all f**k ups" -from a Steven Seagal movie. the hitler thing is from CONTACT...never saw ARRIVAL. Don't expect all societies to be like the Western Civilizations now...... Chiron would be like that before, but not as bad as Earth concerning radio signals and so on, especially when technology advances to the point where don't have to pollute space with "radio" waves, as future communications will be more focus i would think. And radio signals take a long time to get to places too....... the Protectorate is a Facist government (not to be confused with nazism) after all, and secretive........

I'm not saying I dechipered your military stuff or top secret stuff Lonestar, just your populace's chatter and enterainment, phone calls, radio chatter, intercontiental tachyon signals (remember UCS has tachyon tech), and various on-planet tranmissions, NOT interstellar (if thats what you're referring to).

like above, future societies i would think will use something better then radio signals. Tachyon Signals would be more direct and focus, not echo and spread all over the place like Radio signals. Only way to intercept Tachyon signals if your in its way

How shall we proceed to fix up this fiasco? I'm willing to edit some content. Remember, this is my very first time doing this kind of story stuff, and you can be assured I'll know exactly what to do next time. Sorry about the fiasco

It is okay

-LMP

[Sovereign]

guys...

I'd like to know what kind of tranmissions planetary populaces use in BAC's era. I'm sure scout ships or explorers in that era are able to detect general populace chatter whether it be radio, tachyon, PSI, etc. This is how first contact is usually made, to my knowledge, detect sufficient advancement and communications, and invesgiate the source... Thats what UCSS Magellan did, before it was chased away by the Procterate ship. Besides, Magellan was already surveying the system, scanning for all particle waves, emissions, planetary surfaces, and your general mapping stuff.

I could make it so that Magellan picked up a Procterate signal purely by luck, being in the right place at the right time, if signals are so difficult that scouts or explorers of BAC era cannot detect BAC era communications, which is a little silly. Every era had its own methods of communications AND ALSO methods for discovering communications.

Besides, information on Procterate's ships and nature has already been transmitted to Randius, as well as the position of Roving, so if Magellan IS destroyed, Randius will send a group of ships to invesigate. Either way, Procterate will be discovered by UCS.

My Brussard Ramscoops are much more advanced than they appear. They can decieve the enemy into thinking UCS ships are inferior then they get a nasty surprise coming for them. UCS Brussards can be used as weapons, and in addition, they are able to gather all known material from space, call it space dust or small micro meteorites, and stores them in the Resource Tanks for UCS field repair or extra energy. @ Lonestar

[Lonestar]

Originally posted by Sovereign
guys...

I'd like to know what kind of tranmissions planetary populaces use in BAC's era. I'm sure scout ships or explorers in that era are able to detect general populace chatter whether it be radio, tachyon, PSI, etc. This is how first contact is usually made, to my knowledge, detect sufficient advancement and communications, and invesgiate the source... Thats what UCSS Magellan did, before it was chased away by the Procterate ship. Besides, Magellan was already surveying the system, scanning for all particle waves, emissions, planetary surfaces, and your general mapping stuff.

Well, ya see, nowadays we have these things called Satellites which eliminate the need for broadcast.

Again, As we want to remain unkown, even our commercial/entertainment shows would be sent on narrow band frequencies. (This is why SETI is a waste of money. The only damn way to hear them is if they point a radio telescope at us and fire.)

I could make it so that Magellan picked up a Procterate signal purely by luck, being in the right place at the right time, if signals are so difficult that scouts or explorers of BAC era cannot detect BAC era communications, which is a little silly. Every era had its own methods of communications AND ALSO methods for discovering communications.

Well, here's the deal with Procterate "Ranging Ships"; They use High-powered Optical Telescopes to search for Habitable planets within 100 lys of where they are. (which is the absolute maximum of optical resolution). Obviously, if we see large amounts of green on a planet, we can assume it's chloropyhll and check it out.

Besides, information on Procterate's ships and nature has already been transmitted to Randius, as well as the position of Roving, so if Magellan IS destroyed, Randius will send a group of ships to invesigate. Either way, Procterate will be discovered by UCS.

Oh-ho? Did you read the early Roving post? Most of the ships there have older Ceramic/metal alloy "smart Materials" hulls, so when/if you run up to a Protectorate mainline Battleship, it will be a big surprise on your part.

My Brussard Ramscoops are much more advanced than they appear. They can decieve the enemy into thinking UCS ships are inferior then they get a nasty surprise coming for them. UCS Brussards can be used as weapons, and in addition, they are able to gather all known material from space, call it space dust or small micro meteorites, and stores them in the Resource Tanks for UCS field repair or extra energy. @ Lonestar

Bah. Primative and cumbersome. No sir, Matter/Antimatter reactors for us!

[Mellian]

guys...

Oh my goodness Sovereign, i just finish reading your military post in the Datalinks and now this one..... your all over the place man Need to focus and not to depend so much on other sci-fi ships.... will reply the stuff in this post and then state my comments concerning your post in the datalinks....

I'd like to know what kind of tranmissions planetary populaces use in BAC's era. I'm sure scout ships or explorers in that era are able to detect general populace chatter whether it be radio, tachyon, PSI, etc. This is how first contact is usually made, to my knowledge, detect sufficient advancement and communications, and invesgiate the source... Thats what UCSS Magellan did, before it was chased away by the Procterate ship. Besides, Magellan was already surveying the system, scanning for all particle waves, emissions, planetary surfaces, and your general mapping stuff.

I haven't read your story post yet, but should First, don't base your first contacts like an alien maybe would when discovering humanity due to the modern days radio waves and so on on all over the place. Not all factions are Communication maniacs....... only place with the most back and forth communications is in Sol, a heavily populated system with multiple factions living in. As for Chiron factions, they weren't as bad do to some discipline and the advancements of Planetary Datalink Networks and so on.... and finding alternatives after defeating the Proginators, to avoid attract more of them to Chiron, just incase. depends on a Society really..... FTL Communication was invented by the Cyborgs, which is generally Tachyon Communications, which they gave to all factions and later on to the Terrans. Will state the effects of Tachyon Communications later in the Datalinks... tachyon isn't as wide band and polluting as radio waves all over the place. BAC Chironians would generally use focus Datalink communications for Planetary and local communications, and depending on the faction (like the Hive, Protectorate and so on), they will be strict on the use of Tachyon Communications and wide band base planetary communications. So an alien or whoever as an higher chance discoving the Drones, Morganites and Peacekeepers then the Hive, Protectorate, Spartans and so on by trying to tract down tachyon signals, which is focus unlike radio signals. Tachyon Communications isn't good enough for inter-system wide constant Datalink networks and system wide ones needs Tachyon Comm arrays.....and Tachyon Comm arrays are need for inter-system communications. ONLY the cyborgs is rumoured to have an better alternative to Tachyon Communications (Subpace or Hyperspace or maybe Quantum base Communications....using the MOO2 tech tree here), as their Consciousness Network seem to be constant..... Cyborgs also rumoured to be spying on Tachyon Communications......as they ARE the Communications experts in Human Space it seems... they also act like Comstar in battletech, where they have Tachyon Arrays and tachyon Comm Centers all over friendly human space. another thing, University may be advance, but doesn't mean they are advance in all fields of technologies. There is no set tech tree in BAC, but we do generally refer....atleast I... to SMAC and MOO2 tech trees...and the MOO3 tech tree concepts of Fields and Applications of technologies. Another thing, there is such thing as pulsars and so on making Tachyon singals all over the place, as well with radio waves, which as no sense to it..........

I could make it so that Magellan picked up a Procterate signal purely by luck, being in the right place at the right time, if signals are so difficult that scouts or explorers of BAC era cannot detect BAC era communications, which is a little silly. Every era had its own methods of communications AND ALSO methods for discovering communications.

they can, if they have good sensors........ but we are also talking about the Protectorate who is secretive and would be strick about outbound tachyon comms....reserving it strickly to their military/government. If on the other hand you were looking for the Morganites, if you weren't already in contact with, you would have easier time discovering them base on their tachyon comm signals which are use by the public, military, government, workers, etc..... but they are still no wide band as radio, where can detect anywhere and tachyon signals is FTL base.... so tachyon signals would be hard to catch

Besides, information on Procterate's ships and nature has already been transmitted to Randius, as well as the position of Roving, so if Magellan IS destroyed, Randius will send a group of ships to invesigate. Either way, Procterate will be discovered by UCS.

May know what one Protectorate ship looks like, with basic scans of a Protectorate ship, but have trouble scanning their ships internals.

My Brussard Ramscoops are much more advanced than they appear. They can decieve the enemy into thinking UCS ships are inferior then they get a nasty surprise coming for them. UCS Brussards can be used as weapons, and in addition, they are able to gather all known material from space, call it space dust or small micro meteorites, and stores them in the Resource Tanks for UCS field repair or extra energy. @ Lonestar

I suggest you avoid getting to much into Startrek....as BAC is pretty much, anti-trek. Can get ideas, but to base any technologies on Startrek techs is a no no. Just call them Ramscoops as Bussard is the guy who created it in Startrek, and Univerisity is the only one currently using them......the Pirates is too mainly for extra antimatter fuel to power thier FTLs, so Pirate ships can have incredible range and stay in space forever..... but can get into a situation where they FTL more often then they can produce a bit of extra energy power. Can also gather some resources, but not much unless you have big ramscoops and go into nebulas or gas giants to gather gases and so on.... som energy ramscoop produces can be put to weapons, but cannot be use like weapons or whatever liek Startrek

As for your ships listed in the Datalinks thread....... avoid Federation starship designs..... don't need "warp nacelles" for BAC FTL travel and federation ships are designed with so many weak points because the assume their all powerful shields will protect the ship, where in basic simple BAC shields are crappy against most BAC weapons....have good armor and point defence systems/grids as more chances of protecting the ship then shields. don't go overboard with the Neutronium Armor and don't make so powerful....stronger then the average chironian armor yes, but not almost invincible to the point they can survive multiple Yamato shots and Ion Beam Cannons shots (Ion Beams are not meant for instant kills, just causes a lot of damage like carving ships up, punching through big holes, etc and big crater marks on Neutronium Armor ships. Try to be constant with ship design styles, then having all sort of different styles from Federation to Adromoda to Protoss and etc... can have good looking ships, but dont make it federation like....it is oversilly and easy to destroy due to weak points in BAC. Don't have to describe the looks of all the ships too or have pictures for all of them. As for styles, avoid getting to high tech looking like Adromoda and the Protoss ships.....even if University is concidered more advance then the average Chironian Faction.... don't forget the Cyborgs now, they higher research stats then university in SMAX

-LMP

[Mellian]

Like Lonestar says, there is such thing as Satellites, Comm Relays, Comm Arrays and so on, eliminating the need for wide band broadcast........ and then there is Tachyon Communications, replacing radio which is way to slow.

[Sovereign]

man, thanks for all the feedback.

Should you suggest I drop Star Trek ships except for Promethus, and use Einstein, Omega, Galileo, Enterprise, and Darwin classes instead?

My understanding is that aircraft carriers can take quite some damage, if I remember right, USS Enterprise or another carrier in WW2 took several kamikaze hits and wasn't sunk. They were able to patch it up. I'm trying to apply this concept to carriers in space. Should I keep the Protoss carriers, since it has better hull design than Star Trek ships?

In addition, two federation ship stands out for BAC style of war. The Defiant has a sturdy structure, without saucers and swept nacelles. It's a ship with two decks, a ship built for both shielded and shield-less combat. Another ship is the Promethus. It has an arrow shape, has a solid build without obvious weak points, and is able to do multiple vectors (which can be attained with Pre-Sentient Algortihms. However, to keep it fair, only one will be in service at the time of the story, the prototype itself. Regular Promethus vessels would be in service in maybe 50 years after the story, so it's one-of-a-kind during the story period.

To be honest, I suck at creativity for ship specifications and thats why I had to borrow a lot of other sci-fi ships. Its ironic though, I'm pretty creative with stories and events, but not specifications or what ships should be

For communications, I don't want to flame or upset anyone, but surely there would be communications between colonists, and Magellan picks these communications up. Magellan does not pick up the other communications such as military or off-planet communications.

If that communication thing does not work, then what would you suggest for the Magellan to detect Procterate civilization? I'd like to have that as a good spring-off board so that UCS would have a violent contact with Procterate, setting off a cold war between the two equal technological factions.

I had no idea my story was that whacked out of phase

LMP, I'll go revise my shipfleet, and eliminate almost 3/4 of my ships

[Kassiopeia]

Stop talking about seeing something else then the original B5, not to mention cable or sat channels.
*sulks in the corner*

Originally posted by Sovereign
man, thanks for all the feedback.

Should you suggest I drop Star Trek ships except for Promethus, and use Einstein, Omega, Galileo, Enterprise, and Darwin classes instead?

I saw this coming. I wonder what I should name the Terran science ships... Excerpt from my to-be modified future update on mah BAC-site - feel free to take them, think of this as a gift, albeit the names aren't too imaginitive :

Ships and fields of research:

CRS Fernando Magalhaes - Deep space exploration
CRS Nicholas Copernicus - Astronomy and Cometology
CRS Vasco da Gama - Stellar cartography

Discovery class
CRS Albert Einstein - Astrophysics
CRS Marie Curie - General Physics
CRS Niels Bohr - Sub-Atomic Mechanics
CRS Stephen Hawking - Cosmology

Enterprise class
CRS Florence Nightingale - Medical Science
CRS Louis Pasteur - Chemistry
CRS Sir Charles Darwin - Biology and physiology
CRS Sir Isaac Newton - Gravitational Physics

But I would like to have dibs on the two Xperimental ships;

Strider class
CXS Legacy - Superluminal Drive Mechanics
CXS Nautilus - Sublight Propulsion Mechanics

[Silence]

Sorry I been busy, I probley won't be able to post untill the weekend.