anyone up for another Chiron Chronicles?

[Mellian]

for all intent and purposes, Chironians tend to just call their cities as bases, and their entire faction as a colony. like in a lot of the space base sci-fis where a settlement of a world is called a colony, even if there is like multiple towns, cities and etc.

there will be the fourteen factions at the beginning of the story, but suggest just focusing on where your factions will be located before getting into history/timeline and military comparisons. of course, having the Cult of Planet not to far from the Gaians is a good idea, as all canon evidence points to them splitting off from the Gaians.

also nothing wrong to have the Gaians having more a naval nature considering their starting location and having bases on other islands/continents. something different for them.

i will make another draft of the map with the morganites and Gaians in it, as well with the cult...who seem more like pro-planet overrides everything else , where the Gaians seem more like simply being in harmony between themselves and Planet.

-mellian

[Sovereign]

Sounds like this is finally getting off the ground!

I hereby claim the Garland Crater in the name of the University!

I've fired up SMAC-X and I've played a few games to see how I could expand with the University.

I've consitiently got 7 - 10 solid bases up and running with infrastructure by 2200 in my games. The reason for the variety was the Unity Pods. Sometimes I'd come across "Lost Colonists" and sometimes I'd come across "Production Boost (Item X finished next turn in Base X).

Considering the modified rules and lands and techs...

I'd also like to establish two colonies in the Monsoon Jungle, since the University is expanding east from the Garland Crater.

Give me a few days to procure a map of the University's starting position, its colonies, and the 2 colonies in the Monsoon Jungle.

[Sovereign]

Two other things....

First, I must say I both agree and disagree with your reasoning about time progression, Mellian.

I agree and understand the authors here write once in a while. Also, I understand and agree with not having a frantic time pace.

The only problem and thing I disagree with, Mellian, is...

If more active authors post, while inactive authors post rarely...

Say, an Active author posts about 1 or 2 times a week, while Inactive authors post 1 time a month or longer.

If we do what you say, with this, and I quote you Mellian...

"the active authors can go on posting and when a inactive author returns, they can make a previous date before the latest dated posts to add something to the story, as well it doesn't contradict what as already happen story wise.

to prevent any hang ups, like waiting for the inactive author to return to write something in response, i'll encourage authors to communicate with each, their plans and etc on plots they are working on together, or affecting another author's faction or/and character(s)...so if one is missing, the other author(s) could go on."


This presents a couple of problems.

First, the story would look really weird if we're on, say, year 2300, with the active authors. Then suddenly we go back to year 2250 when the inactive author posts. Then the next post takes us to the year 2320 or something.

That's too crazy, going back and forth between dates. It can and will be confusing for both authors and readers to follow.

Second, suppose the University goes to war with the Believers or the Hive down the road. I'd have my military all ready and set for invasion, then the Hive or Believer author doesn't post in a while. The game years roll by, then my military would be still waiting for invasion for 50 years or so.

Then my storylines I've planned on acquiring some enemy bases or having a couple "foreigners" experience their old ways of life being changed by the University's presence and ways of life would be ganked. This could be a big story-killer and ambition-killer, causing authors to become frustrated and lose their ambition to write more story posts in this new story.



Mellian, I propose two solutions to solve this.

The Time Issue:

The more active authors progress the timeline as normally, so their characters, units, cities, etc. can grow as they intend for their story purposes.

When the inactive authors do return to post, they should post at the "current time year / date" and catch up on stuff that has happened since they posted last.

This way, the timeline wouldn't jump around to the past, present, and future when an author posts. Time can progress in a normal linear fashion, saving us a lot of confusion and frustration trying to dechiper the whole time jumping issue.


For the Hang-Up issue...

I propose that we see what happens in the story. If an author intends to declare war, or involve himself / herself with another author or faction...

The other author is... Active: They won't have too much of an hang-up issue.

The other author is... Inactive: The active author can and will get frustrated here. He / she would be eager to proceed the storyline, but is held back by the other author's lack of posts or counter-posts.

To solve this, I'd like to have the general plan aired out in the discussion threads. If the inactive author posts twice a month, then.... If both authors agree, the inactive author can and should allow the active author to write for the inactive author during the conflict or crisis.

If the inactive author doesn't post in either a month or longer in the discussion thread, then we could have a problem.

In this case, the active author should go ahead and do whatever he has planned.


Here's how we should define active and inactive authors.

Active = 2 or more story posts a month. Multiple posts in the discussion thread.

Inactive level 1= 1 story post a month, and a handful of posts in discussion thread.

Inactive level 2= no story post in a month, a few or no posts in discussion thread in a month.

Inactive level 3= no posts at all in story or discussion threads in two months or longer.


When an author reaches Inactive Level 2, we should try to talk to him / her, and see whats up.

If an author reaches Inactive Level 3, we should seriously consider giving up control of the author's faction / empire. Another author can take control, or make the empire neutral, waiting for new authors to step in and take control.


What do you think? I'm trying to be reasonable, but at the same time, make sure our story doesn't die out because of inactivity.

[Mellian]

Originally posted by Sovereign I've consitiently got 7 - 10 solid bases up and running with infrastructure by 2200 in my games. The reason for the variety was the Unity Pods. Sometimes I'd come across "Lost Colonists" and sometimes I'd come across "Production Boost (Item X finished next turn in Base X).

lost colonists? there is such pods in the game? i don't remember ever getting one like that :/

anyway, have you considered wether expansion may be detered due to other particular factions being neighbours?

I think we should just figure out where the factions will start out before figuring out how many bases and etc...

as for the map, i will not bother with infrastructure on the map...especially when we'll be realistic about the terrain, considering Chiron's surface area is about 718 000 000 km2, making each square about 1000 km2 or more...probably more... have to go recount the squares in the planetx large map so may not need many squares around a base to have farms and etc to be able to feed the populace.

-mellian

[Mellian]

while i would like this co-op story to have a faster progression of time than Chiron Chronicles, i am not exactly interested in seeing this one to go to fast, so i hope we don't go thought decades of story years in just a few real months.

as for your solution, i am getting the impression where we should have a rule to where no author can make a post earlier the latest posted date... i can understand the fear that someone will post something years or decades before the latest story date, but chances are, posts will go back and forth a bit in time, as authors will try to keep up, or some author makes a post before someone else while they were writing up a post.

so maybe have a limit to how far back before the latest date a story post can be. also, inactive authors can summerize what happened to their character and faction since their last post.

yes, we can also have discussions of authors plans in the discussion thread for the story, but shouldn't be a requirement, as some authors doesn't want to reveal some surprises (which i hope, would be reasonable).

oh and another thing, what are we calling this co-op story, which we still have agreed on? Thought to simply just call it Alpha Centauri, but not really all that original... and not interested in making Chiron Chronicles part two...

-mellian

[Illuminatus]

Originally posted by Sovereign
I hereby claim the Garland Crater in the name of the University!


.

Greetings to my southern neighbours!

What the hech is Lost Colonists event? Never found it, even as multiple meteor strikes happened to me and I popped OgreMk2s? I am not even sure I have seen script for it?

[GeneralTacticus]

AFAIK, it doesn't exist. Maybe he's getting confused with a different game.

And, Sovereign, how exactly do you plan to expand into the Monsoon Jungle from the Garland Crater? It's on the other side of an ocean.

[Sovereign]

Oops! I went back and looked over the game saves I had. I must have confused the "Lost Colonists" with something like free settlers from goody huts in the Civ games, or the free units I get from the Unity pods. My bad, sorry.


Obstructor.... Greetings, Naked Gaian!


GeneralTactius, IIRC, Mellian said we have ships and cruisers techs already. I build a cruiser or foil or whatever at a coastal city near the Crater, then put in 1 or 2 colony pods, sail it to the Monsoon Jungle.

I'm planning on expanding eastwards with the University, to occupy the Manifold Nexus, Garland Crater, and a few cities in the Monsoon Jungle across the straits between the 2 contients.

Then later, when your explorers explore the Monsoon Jungle, you can gain contact with the University, and we could have some interesting stuff around the Monsoon Jungle.

[Illuminatus]

What will be between Uranium Flats (Gaian) and Crater (University) - empty space or some faction?

[Mellian]

again, have you considered the realistic size of Chiron, that game mechanics is not really compatible with story mechanics hence depending on the game to make story base scenarios is not really gouing to work, you may have neighbours who may prevent University from achieving certaint things and have you considered the kind of environment Chiron has in the manual?

oh and i redone the calculations for how big each square in the map, which is 44 516 km2 and forgot how to convert it # x #, but i think it is like 1000km across...

here are suggested maps...one in this post is base on the locations you've selected...while the second is base on story potential between some natural rivals and between mother and sibling factions...which two may have some interesting background to get where they are.

-mellian

[Mellian]

and the second suggested map.

-mellian

[Sovereign]

Sorry Mellian...

I keep getting confused about the new rules for this thing.

I guess I'm still in BAC and SMAC-X rule-sets and limitations. Also, all SMAC-X and Civ games, I modify ALL my jets and combustion ships to have far more movement to reflect real world ships and jets.

In addition, I was under the assumption that ships and jets could sail and fly around Chiron in 1 year or two. Jets only take maybe 1 day flying at Earth's Equator, and modern ships could take a 1 - 2 months, give or take a couple of weeks to circumnavigate the globe.

And as you stated, Chiron is slightly bigger than Earth. Therefore, it will take maybe 3 - 4 months for a ship to sail around Chiron, and jets maybe need 2 days to fly around Chiron's equator.

This is why I thought I could set up colonies on the Monsoon Jungle.

But if thats too crazy or nutty, I'll withdraw my Monsoon Jungle colonies and then when the story starts, I'll expand in that direction.

I could place 2 extra colonies near the Manifold Nexus instead of the Monsoon Jungle. (Mainfold Nexus is near Garland Crater, IIRC)

I'm just trying to figure out what to do here.

[Mellian]

any ideas and suggestions for the rest of the faction placements?

for the SMAX human factions, would be nice to have close to the factions they seem to originate from according to what is said in the SMAX canon background.

like the Cult of Planet is a split from the Gaians, which started out when there was an attack on a Gaian base, and a pregnant person ran to a neaby xenofungus field for safety from the attack, only to give birth there with mindworms watching. then the child end up being regarded as some holy child of planet, and more and more Gaians started believing that, while the rest didn't think of anything all that special from it, so the Cultists ended leaving the faction to form one of their own elsewhere. once established and etc, and when the child became a bit older, he became leader, as some god.

free drones split off from the Hive, which could hacve started as some rebellion, but ended up leaving as they can't really survive within the hive...so took some colony pods and establish their own faction elsewhere, to create their workers paradise, while still have propaganda and etc within Hive and other factions they consider their Drones being oppressed and etc. So they are generally a pain to Hive and Morganites if they are not all that far.

Data Angels, not sure what their original faction was, but having them split off from the Morganites makes sense in a way....they generally have anarchistic type views that, in real life, tend to be against corporations and controlling governments....so ya. Sinder Roze could have been a Probe for the Morganites, but becoming unhappy serving Morgan and etc... so a community of soem discontents, a lot of them hackers, computer savvy folks some probes and others...who mainly communicate in the datalinks/morganite networks, as being open with their discontent can lead to being stomped by Morgan Security, especially if they are in the habit causing trouble in the faction, hacking into stuff and etc... at some point, they became big enough and things got harder for them as well in the faction, so Sinder Roze and others, mainly Probes themselves, worked out a plan for their great escape...and went it was pulled off, Morgan Industries ended being a bit a dissarray, Morgan surprised that a good portion of its covert and intelligence probes were involved and poofed. by the time they could start organizing some military units to do something about, they were already gone...with some people still left behind, but they could try migrating to the new Data Angel faction later.

Cybernetic Consciousness obviously came from University, considering it was Zhakarov himself who ran this experiment, with a volunteer from Unity, during the early years on Chiron...she ended up having a MMI with an AI, which ended up sharing consciousness with the host. anyway, more and more people ended up having such MMI implants with AIs, some forced/volunteered as the experiments went on a bit, and later a movement of cyborgs was being formed, where some people volunteered...and also rumoured to have forced some to have implanted AIs. could have became a bit of a problem for Zhakarov, and may have tried to do something about it, which resulted in the cyborgs to leave the faction, either by forced or voluntarally for whatever reason, to establish their own efficient faction.

Nautilus Pirates is the vaguest as to where they are from originally...i thought maybe to have the original Pirates coming from U.N. Peacekeepers, where the were being invaded and etc by the Spartans. Captain Svensgaard, who earlier found a survived Unity Sea Colony Pod, used it to help evacuate a coastal peacekeeper base, a long with using a Unity transport foil or two, with a unity gun foil... anyway, he got as many people he can and lead the exiles to re-establishing the peacekeeper faction elsewhere....so was the original plan. eventually, they found the Geothermal Field and Captain Svensgaard considered ideal place to establish a Sea Base, which took some convince of the people, saying it would be safer, as who knows how many other unity colony lander pods survived and created hostile factions... they later became known as Nautilus Pirates as time went on, as they started preying on merchant foils and etc for supplies and resources as other factions started having a presense among the oceans. They only later found out that the UN Peacekeeper faction was still around, which somehow succeeded in repelling the Spartan invaders (thinking maybe to use a similar plot from SMAC novel...like the Sandiego lead Spartan invasion being ordered to retreat after her son died, and killing Lal's son as revenge...this could be something that isn't widely known, and Sandiego could have created some discontents who don't know why they the were retreating...while taking stuff they pillage from the peacekeepers as some reward for invading them...hence leave the reasoning as a myth, unknown, among history...)

as for the Proginators....they both landed at opposite ends of Chiron, and after a decade or so of establishing themselves, they could have start being aggressive and expand (at least the Usurpers at first), until they found out they both survived, so started organizing crusades to get at each other throats....which isn't good thing for Human factions who are in the way....which is the situation that starts out this story on mission year 2200.

anyway, if i not going to get much feedback still, will simpyl start creating the Alpha Centauri Datalinks thread tommorrow...

-mellian

[Illuminatus]

Melian, Gaians have to switch places with usurpers on your first map. It seems you misunderstood me. On such a small teritory they would never build up to sea techs, lest the start of oveseas expansion. They are currently pursuing overseas expansion since a part of Isle of Deinaira is covered with fungus and not suitable for colonizing without disturbing native life. But this island is one target of expansion for Gains and they already have a base there. I putting Gaians on place of Usurpers and putting Usurpers in Pholus Ridge and moving Cartakers near Mt Planet or somewhere in that area. For example Usurpers could ally with Spartans to overrun an faction or we can have an epic battle between them. Or Usurpers ally with planet Cult and start invasion of Gaians.

[Mellian]

umm, again, don't base growth and etc and where to have bases on the game, which is not compatible with story mechanics and etc. The island where i originally placed the Gaians is bigger than england and ireland combined, considering the size of Chiron base of the fluff of the world provided in the SMAC manual, and i don't think bases are as big as 44k+ square kilometers. also, by 2200, chironians would still not have succeeded in completly colonizing Chiron realisticly, especially with Gaians going on a rapid expansion.

anyway, if the Gaians would be where i put the usurpers, then why would the Gaians go as far as the Ruins to have bases? also, it is big enough for Gaians to survive on, and with fungus no less as they are better to do so than the rest of the factions except for the cult who almost literally prefer to live among fungus.

so how about have Gaia start at the large island i created north-between the right and left continents...which is split in half by the map at the moment? will have closer access to the ruins to have bases, which in turn becomes part of the Cult, or just Cultists taking Gaian Colony Pods to move there? Also have potential interaction with the natural rivals the Morganites, and interactions with the Data Angels...

anyway, here is the new suggested map...

-mellian