[C4:AC] Questions and comments

[binTravkin]

Double post for Darsnan!

We should make things clear with rights holder ASAP!

[Kataphraktoi]

:shrug: We cannot dwell on simply what amounts to possible negative outcomes for this project. We should keep marching forward, learning more about how to mod cIV, and enhancing and improving the mod as we see fit!

ok,i ransacked every CGI mag i had(it was CGN not PCg) and i coulnt find it in any of the indexes. however,we should still get rights clearance ASAP

ill STFU now

[Illuminatus]

:shrug: We cannot dwell on simply what amounts to possible negative outcomes for this project. We should keep marching forward, learning more about how to mod cIV, and enhancing and improving the mod as we see fit!

I never discouraged anyone but we should be ready for possibility that this project could be shut down. Until Firaxis finally decides to state their position, we should continue to work as planned, making a mod which will not be playable without possesion of SMAC.

[Senethro]

Originally posted by Illuminatus
...making a mod which will not be playable without possesion of SMAC.

Waa----it a minute, when did we decide that? Surely that is really shooting ourselves in the foot? I'm ok with the idea that people without SMAC won't have voiceovers but everything else about the game is going to be our original material, even if it is based on the previous design. Do we need to open a thread on this and other legality related issues?

[Illuminatus]

I think a special thread is indeed needed now. The concern is that besides voiceovers and images even SMAC characters are copyrighted. Note that Rubin's icons are new, but they are based on SMAC ones. The rest of art with clearly be a depiction of SMAC art. Legaly, it might be hard to draw a line and might be accussed of copyright infringement. If it does require original SMAC, C4AC would boost sales of both cIV and SMAC, and thus we couldn't be accussed of hurting their profits.

[PJayTycy]

These are the kind of things were software patents come in to play.


We are obviously not allowed to copy (maybe in other format) the original smac content.
Recreating it however, should be allowed in the EU.

but, I'm not sure about characters / story. These are probably more like artistic copyright. I know I can't write a "Garry Polter" series of books, with the same story of Harry Potter, but I am not prohibited to write an other series of books about a boy going to a magicians school.

[smacksim]

Almost every time I've tried, I've had luck contacting publishers to ask permission for things like this, usually with positive results. Someone needs to git uff dere duff and email Firaxis, a handful of the lead designers of C4, etc..

Firaxis has responded to me in the past on my first attempt to contact them. How's that for encouragement? You gain nothing by not asking them about it........

[binTravkin]

1.Have we asked yet??

2.There's no need to babble about will SMAC is needed or not, the thing is clear if we ask and are denied permission to simply reproduce (copy) SMACX contents, we will need SMAC as an obligatory prerequisite for the mod to work.

3.If we get denial and go with 'SMAC copy required' thing, there's no problem to
a)make an installer which seeks for some of the SMACX files and transforms them into cIV, say blurb texts and such.
b)make an installer which seeks for SMACX registry key on OS (not sure how that goes on MAC, but sure it can be done).

So everything depends on Firaxis now and our discussions won't help a little bit be they 5 posts or 5k posts.

[Illuminatus]

I believe Blake already wrote such a program.

[Kataphraktoi]

have we asked yet

theres this guy called DanQ working on it suposedly,but i havnt heard anything further

[DanQ]

Originally posted by Kataphraktoi
theres this guy called DanQ working on it suposedly...

"this guy"... it's good that I'm able to keep such a low profile. I can get away with so much more this way...  

Seriously though, I have been in contact with representatives from Firaxis Games on this matter. None of my contacts there are with their legal department, but my inquiry on this effort's behalf has been forwarded onto those particular folks. The individual I have heard from did not raise any concerns that he foresaw, so that is a good sign in my book.

Based on my knowledge and experience in this and related matters first-hand and otherwise, the general rule of thumb in these matters tends to be that as long as there is no money being made, the copyright holders will not object. Better still is if no money is exchanged period, a matter which mostly usually comes into play when considering making such work available on physical media, e.g. CD/DVD. Stemming from this then, I recommend this MOD's distribution be as an electronic download only.

Again, in summary, while no formal acceptance/permission has been received from Firaxis a) they have been informed directly of this effort, b) initial contact has been received and c) no immediate rejection was delivered or concern raised.

My apologies for the delay in delivering this news: it's been a hectic fall and now winter (bleck!) on and off ACS. Will continue to keep apprised.

---------
Dan; Apolyton CS

[Senethro]

Many thanks Dan!

What are the implications of having our mod as an electronic download only? Will we have to restrain Greg's polycount so his models fit on people's hard disks?

[GeoModder]

[Illuminatus]

Netflash!

Hall of Fame editor Darkcloud of the Apolyton Staff has authorized a secret project, codenamed Apolytoners' Hall of Fame: December 2005 .


Please be sure to see this thread for more information before voting.

[Padmewan]

Hi, as a total n00b to this community, I don't want to ruffle any feathers but don't know where to start, so I figured it would make sense to post to what seems like the "social" thread. I have been thinking/dreaming of a Civ4-SMAC mod for a while now and was glad to find that there are dozens (hundreds?) of people already working on it! Awesome!

At the same time, I am seeing that there is a broad problem of copyright/trademark infringement on the one hand, and the specific obstacles of faithfully reproducing SMAC using the Civ4 game engine on the other.

I appreciate that, as a matter of group process, the easiest thing to agree upon is to reproduce SMAC exactly, so that there is no debate over creative control or clashing ideologies.

At the same time, it seems to me that the group could spend a lot of time building code for difficult aspects of SMAC (e.g. the workshop) that may not actually be all that important to the final product. If one of the purposes of the initial SMAC project is to enable future modders to improve SMAC, does it make sense to skip that initial step altogether?

I don't know if I am at odds with most members here when I suggest this, but SMAC was not a perfect game, and in re-implementing it in Civ4, I think there is a great opportunity to eliminate the problems of gameplay it had as well as take advantage of new, cool ideas that Civ3-Civ4 introduced.

If the legal issue becomes insurmountable, I would suggest that it presents a great opportunity: for a community of like-minded individuals, all united by a common love of a previous game (SMAC), to draw on their common experiences from that game to create a new mod inspired by BUT NOT THE SAME AS the original.

I know I am a newcomer here so please tell me to shut up and create my own project if what I'm suggesting is completely at odds with the mission of this group.