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What base facilities to you never or rarely build?

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  • What base facilities to you never or rarely build?

    I'm finding sometimes there are too many options in SMAC expansion. You never really have time to build everything. There are some base facilities I never build. And some game designs I find to be useless. Although it is great to have more options, because I'm sure there are some of you out there, that probably use these. So that's why I made this thread.

    Psi gates is a big one for me. What good are they? There are more as well, but I'll need to load up my last save game. I never build these facilities so I don't remember their names.

  • #2
    I hardly build psi gates as well since my games hardly ever get to the point where they are available but I don't build all the facilities in all the bases either--For example

    Science productivity bases-- hardly ever get things like command centres, punishment spheres, bioenhancement -- It will build all the science and energy enhancements and then pump out crawlers/trawlers from then on.

    Military bases -- may get ONLY a p sphere and the morale enhancers-- The idea is a base with 0 energy production but high minerals

    Crawler factories-- these may get a psphere but often you can just use specialists if they happen to grow-- The sole purpose of this type of base is to feed crawlers to the science or military bases so it builds no other facilities.

    The thing I probably build least in the early game is a perimeter defense. I figure if I can't kill the enemy units before they attack my bases, I'm already in trouble. So they are just a sometimes thing if I need some added defense at a chokepoint until I can get units there.
    You don't get to 300 losses without being a pretty exceptional goaltender.-- Ben Kenobi speaking of Roberto Luongo

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    • #3
      OH and some of the psi facilities to pacify planet are not needed. The ecodamage formula shows how repeatedly building and scrapping the cheapest one of these types of facilities is the way to go.
      You don't get to 300 losses without being a pretty exceptional goaltender.-- Ben Kenobi speaking of Roberto Luongo

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      • #4
        that's an exploit.

        after building voice of planet, both the presurve and temple weren't enough to get my eco damage down. including the tree farm etc.

        but at the point I never care about eco damage.

        and I never run specialized bases like you do. Many of my "core" bases end up building the same things.

        and by that reasoning, Punishment spheres are a big no-no for me. I have never ever built one in the entire time I've played SMAC.

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        • #5
          I never build Punishment Spheres. Of course, I'm not a particularly good or efficient player who plays for the fun instead of the win and Punishment Spheres just don't sit well with me.

          That's also why I don't build a lot of Genejack Factories.
          "I'm too young and too male to be the mother of a seventeen year old female me!"

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          • #6
            I have built genejack factories before, but those drones really start to pile up. So I never build them anymore.

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            • #7
              Covert Ops Center -- Never built, since Probes are usually Elite by this point anyway.

              Paradise Garden -- Gives a base two extra talents. Again, of no use by the time it's available.

              Psi Gate -- I'll build these on super-huge maps late in the game when I'm mopping up. Rush build one in a captured enemy base. Then transport choppers through the gate (only one per turn, though) to wipe out the AI. Not the only way to accomplish this, but adds variety.
              "The avalanche has already started. It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
              -- Kosh

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              • #8
                I am shocked nobody has mentioned the single most god-awful p.o.s. facility......

                The Skunkworks!

                Build a crawler instead. Have it harvesting resources until the point you need to use it. Much more efficient.
                Last edited by livid imp; January 14, 2005, 16:26.
                "They’re lazy troublemakers, and they all carry weapons." - SMAC Manual, Page 59 Regarding Drones
                "Without music, life would be a mistake." -- Friedrich Nietzsche
                "If fascism came to America it would be on a program of Americanism." -- Huey Long
                "Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to greater danger. It works the same in any country." -- Hermann Goering

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                • #9
                  I have built skunkworks when I first started playing, but never anymore.

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                  • #10
                    It could posibly be worth building if it had a 0 maintaince cost.
                    "They’re lazy troublemakers, and they all carry weapons." - SMAC Manual, Page 59 Regarding Drones
                    "Without music, life would be a mistake." -- Friedrich Nietzsche
                    "If fascism came to America it would be on a program of Americanism." -- Huey Long
                    "Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to greater danger. It works the same in any country." -- Hermann Goering

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                    • #11
                      Never builds: Skunk Works; Brood Pits; Punishment Spheres

                      I'm suprised to find someone who says they never build Genejacks. What a great facility!

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                      • #12
                        I don't like Genejacks but I build them, pending arrival of Robotic Assembly plant.
                        On the ISDG 2012 team at the heart of CiviLIZation

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                        • #13
                          Re Skunkworks, I would build one or two in the context of a large number of bases.

                          As Morgan I have built a punishment sphere. Not sure if it was worth it because of the chore of re homing the air unit and then having to crawl the min support. But it did work.
                          On the ISDG 2012 team at the heart of CiviLIZation

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                          • #14
                            Don't diss the Skunkworks. Its never a Tree Farm, but it has its uses. I sometimes find it useful to build one. Not only does it aid prototyping (especially for planet busters) but it removes the retooling penalty. In my best minerals base I'm happy to build one skunkworks for that flexibility. If an emergency comes up I know that when I change production the new production will still be in the range where it hurries cheaply.

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                            • #15
                              I suspect Skunkworks might be usable for a few interesting exploits - but theres already enough of those.

                              The Evil Facilities are GREAT.
                              Punishment Sphere. No. Drones. Ever. Vital for large scale conquest under FM or other play styles that don't make extensive use of police and/or the LLV & planned. Heres the reasons to rush them in conquered bases:
                              1) It's cheap, probably cheaper than rec + holo and a single rush buy! (exeption being Zak with VW). Ofcourse you can still leave some bases "unpunished" if enough drone control from the old regime survives.
                              2) All workers can go to work bringing in minerals, making the base immediately useful for - building cheap shell units, rush buys, supporting units (until the base produces exactly 10 minerals), you can rush a genejack to further enhance this aspect. A base being starved by specialists is not nearly as productive.
                              3) It can grow like crazy. Theres no need to starve the base initially and if you have nut orbitals it can grow really fast. This means council votes!!! (Using captured, opressed bases for votes really is pure evil if you think about it, perfect for those hypocritical Peacekeepers).
                              4) It wont bother you with drone issues ever again. Less Micro is a Good Thing.
                              5) They help protect against mind control by raising the cost, you don't want your armies getting yoinked in a package deal with some crummy captured base.
                              6) They are evil in an Evil Mastermind kind of way. And you can hunch over you're keyboard and cackle "Punishment! Punishment for everybody! Mwahahah!" (strictly optional)

                              Genejack: Unless you're actually relying on GA's then you really won't notice the extra drone. If you're expanding like you "should" then you definitely wont notice it. The build cost and upkeep is so low that the genejack is nearly a must build in every base. Even in a base with a piddly 10 minerals it gives 5 extra minerals, that could be used to support 5 non-clean units and thus bring the base back down to the magic 10. It brings bases working only a borehole up to the magic 10 (actually 11 or 12 IIRC - support a unit or 2 for "free").


                              Borderline Useful:
                              Bio lab: The benefits are marginal but it will turn a profit in maybe 30 turns. The labs produced are specialist labs - immune to effic and multiplied by netnodes etc. Low priority but wont be a liability.
                              Brood Pits: Hmmm yet another way to control drones? Still not bad if you have the AV and want to ditch PS while still keeping the maxed out police effect. Or to negate FM drones. The native effects are quite significant, especially the cost reduction. The combat morale effect is bugged and doesn't work AFAIK.
                              Paradise Gardens: Just too late in the game. They might be useful if you still want GA's for some reason, or just as a bit of extra drone control in bases with little energy for pysch - if you have more credits than sense (like, are running FM) then it can't hurt to get some.
                              Any other late game facility is also rather pointless to build if you are wrapping up the game. Quantum labs everywhere will help you transcend faster, but will usually slow down conquest compared to building a couple of units instead. Psi gate may give a little benefit to conquest... but are mostly used for dumb tricks like teleporting ships into land bases.

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