Alien Artifacts and their uses

[Snowflake]

Well but your subsequent tech also increases your tech cost. In blind research I think you just can't think about tech cost too much and all you can do is hope for good luck.

You can at least set a reseach direction though. And AAs might give you a tech that is not your intended direction. So it may still have a small difference I suppose.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by HongHu
Well but your subsequent tech also increases your tech cost. In blind research I think you just can't think about tech cost too much and all you can do is hope for good luck.

Perhaps true but I think of it this way . . .


many techs an AA will give you will be somewhat unwanted or would have been available for trade or theft. I can't stand discovering anything anyone else on the planet has. It feels like a waste.

I have tried cashing early in the hopes of getting a desired tech but it never seems to work.

I have considered your point that tech rates increase no matter how you acquire a tech. But in the early game , the growth in tech cost is huge. I would much rather

a) research 3 or 4 techs over 20 years and THEN cash for a net of say 5-6 techs . . . THAN

b) cash immediately for 2 techs and then only be able to research 1-2 more i the next 20 years-- The difference in tech tate can be that much


But like anything , IT DEPENDS !! If I have a lousy lousy tech rate, I will cash . If there is a key key tech I want above all else, I will also cash.

generally though, I love that feeling of that AA being a potential tech-- Its a "tech" no one can steal yet and which doesn't figure in my tech cost

[Blake]

The biggest factor for me is that you only get one chance to get those important early SPs like WP and HGP - early techs can be easily traded for or probed, it'll likely be much harder to capture a SP

[Hydro]

I don’t know how much most of you have played blind or semi-blind research, but I can assure you that you are desperate for any advance, and keeping an unused AA in your pocket to save the tech needed for your next advance is not on your mind. If you are the Gaians with the best research rate on Chiron and you STILL don’t have EE by 2220 I’d bet those artifacts will be linked so fast it would make your head spin.

Or, if you are racing to get Planetary Networks and have been foiled the last few time, and you see Lal has been building VW for the last 20 years, you will happily link you AA for the chance of getting PN.

Likewise, without crawlers you will resort to all sorts of creative ways to boost your construction of vital Projects. For instance, I’ve built probes or even scouts, moved them to a target base, re-homed, then disbanded in a desperate attempt to get minerals and reduce the rush rate (I lose half by disbanding, but rushing with energy costs 4x; you do the math). In this instance I am thrilled to cash an AA for a Project (saving me 200 energy for rushing). Disbanding units is not very efficient, but it beats the heck out of losing a vital Project to the AI or another player in PBEM.

This is what I like about blind and semi-blind research. Yes, it is frustrating, but it makes you work harder. And you appreciate what you’ve got instead of pining away that IA is four turns away: for all you know it is 40 turns away!!

Hydro

[Commy]

On average, how many AAs to you tend to recieve, on your own, from Unity Pods? Standard map, let's say...

[Zeiter]

I've gone numerous games where I haven't found any AA's. Then there are a few where I find 5+ (one game as Deidre on a huge 70% water map I found over 20 AA's with my IOD&worm scouting parties. Just scout the seas until you find an island, disembark your mind worm, and pick up any supply pods.)

[Enigma_Nova]

I sometimes get AAs.
In singleplayer I tend to get more worms than AAs, which makes it a bit tricky to send ol' greenscout off to pick up pods.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Hydro
I don’t know how much most of you have played blind or semi-blind research, but I can assure you that you are desperate for any advance, and keeping an unused AA in your pocket to save the tech needed for your next advance is not on your mind. If you are the Gaians with the best research rate on Chiron and you STILL don’t have EE by 2220 I’d bet those artifacts will be linked so fast it would make your head spin.

Or, if you are racing to get Planetary Networks and have been foiled the last few time, and you see Lal has been building VW for the last 20 years, you will happily link you AA for the chance of getting PN.

Likewise, without crawlers you will resort to all sorts of creative ways to boost your construction of vital Projects. For instance, I’ve built probes or even scouts, moved them to a target base, re-homed, then disbanded in a desperate attempt to get minerals and reduce the rush rate (I lose half by disbanding, but rushing with energy costs 4x; you do the math). In this instance I am thrilled to cash an AA for a Project (saving me 200 energy for rushing). Disbanding units is not very efficient, but it beats the heck out of losing a vital Project to the AI or another player in PBEM.

This is what I like about blind and semi-blind research. Yes, it is frustrating, but it makes you work harder. And you appreciate what you’ve got instead of pining away that IA is four turns away: for all you know it is 40 turns away!!

Hydro

Why do you re-home the sacrificial units?

[Enigma_Nova]

It's my newb response - I don't know where the minerals go if I disband a unit at a base other than its home.

[Hydro]

Sik - you re-home the unit so when you scrap it the minerals go to the target base. Otherwise I'm pretty sure (but not 100% sure) the minerals are lost if the scrapped unit is not at its home base (anyone experiment with this? I’ll have to check). This is inefficient but only feasibly way of transferring mineral resources before you have supply crawlers. Scrapping nets you half the minerals of construction, so you do pay a penalty. My favorite sacrificial units are probes since they don’t take support, are useful for defensive and some offensive purposes, and have a move of two (unless they are cheap-o move 1 defensive probes).

The benefits of re-homing and scrapping are:

* You can do this for ANY unit or improvement, even one that has already been prototyped and is not a Project.
* It can be easily used with rushing. For instance, you could scrap an old scout (adding 5 minerals of its 10 construction cost to the base’s unit/improvement) to get the minerals over the magic 10, and then rush for much less cost. This eliminates the need to over-rush the previous item (with carryover to the next item), which is very energy expensive
* It is useful if you are unit-heavy and energy-limited. Rushing is great if you have lodes of cash, but if you are can’t use FM (Gaians), are pre-FM, can't reasonably run FM (Hive), or it isn't convenient to do so (drone control or war footing issues) then this can be used to good effect.
* If someone is snooping on you can surprise them by getting critical unit or improvement/Project done before they would otherwise suspect (eg - it is another in a bag of tricks to be used judiciously)

For those that B-line via directed research to IA this tactic is probably not of much use since you get crawlers early (as folks have posted, many go for AI before all else save CE). For those using Blind or Semi-Blind research this can be critical.

[Flubber]

I usually get 2-3 AAs in a game. I seem to get slightly more from sea tiles than land tiles but thats just a feeling.

I had one game ( a PBEM) where I found that the 2 factions allied against me, had 11. I had tech parity ubtil they cashed . . . I was suddenly 11 techs in arrears and capitulated soon after.

[Flubber]

Hydro

I have played double-blind and my opinion holds. I just tend to get a LOT more active with my explorers and probes as soon as I can.

I just know that at times when I have experimented with cashing the AAs I have seen huge changes in research times. I might be researching at a tech per 8 turns and a discovery makes it 10-12 turns. Cash 3 AAs and its a discovery in 25 turns or heck 30 turns or even more.

I don't have a hard and fast rule but my if research rate is decent I will protect that. But I will cash for tech

1. if my research rate is crap anyway. Anything 20+ years
2. possibly if there are key techs I am missing I might take the chance. I probably won't do this if my research rate is good
3. If I am stuck on a small landmass and can't get ecology or flex-- then I will cash to try to get off the durn island

I will not cash an AA for tech anytime I am within 3-4 years of my next discovery. Against the AI I find I even have the luxury of timing my trades and thefts until just after a discovery.

By mid-game, tech rate is not as big a concern as a couple of additional techs don't make that big a difference in the rate of discoveries.

[Hydro]

Flubber - I've really noticed a change in tech rate when tech trading or cashing AAs to nodes until after the next tech advance. As you say, I frequently avoid trading or cashing until after a soon-to-come research tech advance. I'll pay closer attention in my next SP game. I've got a few things to check now: where scrapped mins go; when bumps in tech time occur when tech trading or AA linking.

You are very right about being forced to be more aggressive with terraforming and exploration when doing blind and semi-directed research. For me this is the spice of the game anyway, so I don't mind at all.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Hydro
when bumps in tech time occur when tech trading or AA linking.

I know this one. After you have RESEARCHED YOUR FIRST TECH, increases in research cost are only reflected when you START your next tech AFTER A RESEARCH DISCOVERY. So

1. If you acquire techs before your first discovery, the cost of that first discovery will rise dramatically.
2. Post first discovery-- acquiring even ten techs will NOT change the cost of the tech you are currently researching.
3. It will change the cost of the the nwxt tech you START researching. I make this distinction because if you are researching a tech and acquire that tech by other means, you get a cost free switch. The added cost is reflected in the cost when you next begin research.


I became VERY aware of the tech cost issue when playing 2x3 games. To have 3 factions with similar tech rates have proposed research times that vary from 3 to 40 years is quite enlightening .

[Hydro]

Flubber - that is exactly my understanding. It's nice to have it confirmed.