My god, this new design is ugly.

[MxM]

I have just managed to find the option to hide the background image and widen the screen. The background images were great on their own, live the Statue of Liberty, but didn't work with the posts floating on top of them. Now it is all one black screen I have to say that I quite like the white on black, though I can see why it might send some peoples vision haywire. Obviously a colour scheme option would be the best way to keep every happy.

That was not there initially, but they quickly reacted by making this option and also by removing the side panel in forums. Kudos the them!

@ Rempedaalops - see, criticism worked! If only now they made black text on white....

[Robert]

@MxM: if you read my announcement on the first moment we went live, it contains that new styles will follow.

Hey, it is not just for my enjoyment. They A) collect donations, B) display ads on website. They do not do it for me they do it for themselves, though the big part is simply they do it for the love of the game. And yes, effort is A+, but the result is C.

For us it's not about the money (fortunately, b/c we lost a lot). We do it because we like it to run a big site with a huge community like this. We're all professionals, in IT, Marketing, Project Management, Infra Structure. We do this kinda stuff for our customers. Now we wanted to do it for our own site and learn a lot. For me and Jeroen it's also about Civilization because we are huge fans. And because we didn't want Apolyton to end. A 12 year old game fansite with such a legacy and such a history, it should not die.

I disagree that this is a bad design. It's a very good design, it's unique, it's a clear brand. It seperates us from other forums. On first visit it gives an epic feeling, especially with the background image. You can tell it's been made by a professional.

But that it's a good design doesn't mean that everybody has to like it. There are professional musicians, and still many dislike their music. Same with artists, game makers, movies directors, etc. etc. That's perfectly ok. It would be crazy if everybody would like a design. Such a design would most probably be very boring.

I can see that people dislike it to read white on black.
Our designer (Rutger) is not a forum guy. He made Apolyton a brand with a solid logo, and placed this design on the entire site.
Me myself had to get used to it as well. But to be honest, I am used to it now and I like it.
I am still on the small style, with background image.
I'm ok with white on black now, and I think that reading on screen works better if the width is not too much. In fact the 'default' column reads a lot better, especially on my 1900px width screen! (the flex width screen doesn't do it for me).
I love the background image because it gives me this epic feel.

I think that everybody has the right to have an opinion. But I can't take people serious who say that this is the design of a 5 years old or that it's a stupid design. People who say that just can't seperate personal taste from the absolute truth. I'm not in classical music at all, but I know that there are genius people behind that.
But everybody may have his own opinion. I'd advise some of you though to learn to express your opinion in a different way. Not for me, you can yell all day at me. I'm perfectly ok with that. (not that people gain much respect, but if you're not looking for that, be my guest) But if you just want to get somewhere in life, it'll work if you manage to get your communication under control. The real world is not as nice as Apolyton is to you. Afer all we care about you and the real world doesn't (who's that yeller? He's not going to get that promotion for sure!)

So keep it coming. Express it in any way you want.
There's much we have to learn, and we can only learn it from you if you express it.

[Asher]

Our designer (Rutger) is not a forum guy. He made Apolyton a brand with a solid logo, and placed this design on the entire site.

Uhhh....

Rule #1: Know your audience

[Maniac]

Plus, a triangle means Delta in Greek. MarkG would roll over in his grave.

[MJW]

The use orange and white because Valve does too!

[MxM]

For us it's not about the money (fortunately, b/c we lost a lot). We do it because we like it to run a big site with a huge community like this. We're all professionals, in IT, Marketing, Project Management, Infra Structure. We do this kinda stuff for our customers. Now we wanted to do it for our own site and learn a lot. For me and Jeroen it's also about Civilization because we are huge fans. And because we didn't want Apolyton to end. A 12 year old game fansite with such a legacy and such a history, it should not die.

That's what I said, is it?

I disagree that this is a bad design. It's a very good design, it's unique, it's a clear brand. It seperates us from other forums. On first visit it gives an epic feeling, especially with the background image. You can tell it's been made by a professional.

The funny thing is that I completely agree with your statement 100%. I actually quite like new logo. I LIKE the image itself, it is distinctive, I like orange color, if you talk about being distinctive, good marketing, etc.
However, notice, that nowhere you are actually mentioned that it is ergonomic, usable and esthetically pleasant. And to that I also agree.

But that it's a good design doesn't mean that everybody has to like it. There are professional musicians, and still many dislike their music. Same with artists, game makers, movies directors, etc. etc. That's perfectly ok. It would be crazy if everybody would like a design. Such a design would most probably be very boring.

I can see that people dislike it to read white on black.

You still do not get it, do you? It is not because people dislike in terms of taste. It is BECAUSE IT IS DIFFICULT TO READ!!!
I personally do not give a $**t how things look, as long they are functional and usable. The design fails on usability, THAT"S where it fails.
When I say that my eyes are aching - it is literal meaning - it is difficult to read white on black in this strong contrast, with occasional bright white or other fields.

So keep it coming. Express it in any way you want.
There's much we have to learn, and we can only learn it from you if you express it.

I knew you understand that

[Harry Tuttle]

I for one like that you guys have taken the site into the 21st century. Heck of a thing, really.

As for the forum color, I am having a hard time telling where posts end and begin, due to the fact that they are all completely black. Even a black/dark grey switch up would help. Also, the white on black is hurting my eyes. Most forums offer many additional styles to choose from. You can always stick with the default black, but please, for the love of everything that is holy, get us some nice white background styles. Maybe even a linen, that might be best.

I'm not going to toot my own horn, but I created this forum. It offers a simple design that is pleasing to the eyes and clearly delineates posts and threads. Very simple stuff that I'm sure you guys could offer something similar through Vbulletin style sets.

So please. I'm an accountant who is slowly going blind from staring at dual monitors all day. My eyes hate the black.

[MxM]

I'm not going to toot my own horn, but I created this forum. It offers a simple design that is pleasing to the eyes and clearly delineates posts and threads. Very simple stuff that I'm sure you guys could offer something similar through Vbulletin style sets.

I clicked your link, just to rest my eyes, thank you. Good design by the way. I wish they asked for your help in creation of the themes.

[Case]

Please provide an alternative to the white text on a black background - it's really unpleasant to look at and will probably create difficulties for people with visual problems.

[LDiCesare]

I disagree that this is a bad design. It's a very good design, it's unique, it's a clear brand. It seperates us from other forums. On first visit it gives an epic feeling, especially with the background image. You can tell it's been made by a professional.

It is a bad design. It literally just made me scream. Honestly, I did:
I was looking for the quote icon. And those white things on black background made me shout.
It's separated from the others in that I thought for the first time ever 'now cfc is my civ home'. And I say this wearing an apolyton T-shirt. It is that ugly, mostly because of the white on black background.
I can tell it's been made by someone who decided to do things distinct from others without thinking hard enough why other sites don't do what he did. Namely, it is painful to watch and read for long.

And count me +1 on the ugly triangle for an A. It's a Delta. In a Greek word. That's also very unsettling and if you ever read Greek, it's really ugly to watch and even read, because it's like you've now written 'Dpolyton'.

[jobe]

And count me +1 on the ugly triangle for an A. It's a Delta. In a Greek word. That's also very unsettling and if you ever read Greek, it's really ugly to watch and even read, because it's like you've now written 'Dpolyton'.

The Delta is a historical reference to the original Apolyton, where the same mistake was made - if I understood that correctly during history lesson . Most people don´t use Greek daily, so they might rather see the resemblance to an "A" rather than the Greek Delta and for Apolyton residents that have been there forever it´s kind of an easter egg .

[Maniac]

The Delta is a historical reference to the original Apolyton, where the same mistake was made

What are you talking about when you say "the original Apolyton"? I've been here much longer than you, noob , and don't know of any such reference.

[Robert]

Apolyton is an english word. The first letter is an 'A'. And yes, it looks like a delta, which is a nod.
It's a logo. And why would anybody read a greek letter first and then continue to read the other letters as latin letters?

I'm am able to read Greek, and yes, we knew this was a delta in Greek as well.

I don't understand how you guys have troubles reading white on black. Maybe it's my screen?
On my screen it looks really good and sharp. But if it doesn't on other screens, then that may be the problem.

[Robert]

What are you talking about when you say "the original Apolyton"? I've been here much longer than you, noob , and don't know of any such reference.

Apolyton is a Greek word. It means 'ultimate'.
Apolyton was born out of the fusion of "The First Greek Civilization Site" and "The Ultimate Civilization Site".

[Maniac]

Yeah I know. I'm asking jobe what "mistake" of the "original Apolyton" he is refering to. AFAIK there was no confusion then between A and Delta.