Whatever happened to...

[Krill]

When did Ming start moderating On Topic forums? I know that he was Off Topic Moderator starting in 2000, but it was a few years after that before he was responsible for other parts of the site, IIRC. Maybe that's why he's responding that way. By the time he was responsible, it didn't matter?

CIV came out at teh end of october 2005, and I'm pretty sure Ming was a mod of the on topic by then; but it wasn't his primary focus. There should have been mods dedicated to that forum (or the CIV fora as a whole) so they could spend more time moderating them and leaving the OTF to Ming/RAH etc.

[SlowwHand]

Btw, I would disagree with that characterizations of Ming in the Staff Room. While he may have been "bat**** crazy insane" when it came to certain... personalities, he was also the voice of sanity in a room of wanna be authoritarians.

Of course you can pick and choose posts to make any conclusion you'd like.

Bat**** crazy will suffice. Anything else is just gravy.

[Aeson]

How can anyone take what Ming says seriously when I post "on-topic" 8 times in my post, and the only time he doesn't misread it as "off-topic" is the one time I'm referencing his (and rah's) red herring attack on "off topic was killing on topic"... in that case instead of misreading just the "on-topic" part, misreading the entire reason the statement appeared.

[Ming]

He's partially right, Ming, IMO.

The lack of moderation in the OnT was a problem, and it was a problem going back to when OnT was thriving.

No... the problems in the On topic started YEARS ago... before me and rah even became Co owners and were enforcing MarkG's rules. By the time we came on board, traffic in the on topic was already dead. We had lost the modding community because the upload download system and directories simply stunk. And nobody was doing anything to solve those problems.

That seems to be people's mantra, but it simply isn't supported by facts.
Did some of the few remaining on topic posters get chased away because they had thin skins... sure... but the damage was done LONG BEFORE rah and I even came on board. So please, keep your facts straight.

[Krill]

He's old. I thought I'd give him the benefit of the doubt with his dementia

[Krill]

No... the problems in the On topic started YEARS ago... before me and rah even became Co owners and were enforcing MarkG's rules. By the time we came on board, traffic in the on topic was already dead. We had lost the modding community because the upload download system and directories simply stunk. And nobody was doing anything to solve those problems.

That seems to be people's mantra, but it simply isn't supported by facts.
Did some of the few remaining on topic posters get chased away because they had thin skins... sure... but the damage was done LONG BEFORE rah and I even came on board. So please, keep your facts straight.

MarkG allowed flaming in the on topic sections of the forum? I'd call bull****...

[Ming]

The on topic forums were being modded by people like Solver
If there was a problem there, ask him.

[Harovan]

When did Ming start moderating On Topic forums? I know that he was Off Topic Moderator starting in 2000, but it was a few years after that before he was responsible for other parts of the site, IIRC. Maybe that's why he's responding that way. By the time he was responsible, it didn't matter?

I'm sure Aeson is largely talking about Civ3 times. Back then, I remember, MarkG and Ming were listed as Civ3 mods. MarkG mostly did squat and Ming probably had enough to do in the Off Topic forum. Additionally, he repeatedly stated that he doesn't like the game (no blame here) and probably for that reason the Civ3 forums were bit off his radar. Which resulted in them being mostly unmoderated.

[Krill]

That would explain it...TSTMNBN is screwed then.

[Aeson]

When did Ming start moderating On Topic forums? I know that he was Off Topic Moderator starting in 2000, but it was a few years after that before he was responsible for other parts of the site, IIRC. Maybe that's why he's responding that way. By the time he was responsible, it didn't matter?

Ming and rah had moderator powers in the CIV forum when CIV was released. I remember clearly Ming locking Vel's CIV strat thread at 500 posts. Both of them (or maybe just Ming... rah may have only been witness to the Civ II forum parts of the discussion... it's been a while) followed EyesOfNight around, laughing at his antics and telling the rest of the posters that Eyes was a special case who could say anything he wanted.

The ladder invasion of Vel's strat thread was also ignored by Ming, except to say "chill" a couple times IIRC, and close the thread when the epeen waving had hit 500 posts. While that case somewhat more understandable, given a great deal of the infractions may or may not have been seen, it shows why loose moderation (in this case, not staying on top of the discussions) was detrimental to the on-topic community. Vel's Civ III strat thread was what drew me, and many of the most active Civ III on-topicers to the forum. Drawing similar CIV posters, and retention of Civ III posters... vs driving some Civ III posters away and making it difficult for CIV posters to get a sense of the community.

After that... I really couldn't say. Why waste the time going to such a forum? It failed it's subject matter. And it's subject matter is the only draw.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Could it be that the people who decided that the mod for the Off Topic should also mod all sorts of On Topic forums was the one to blame? Off Topic is basically a full time job in and of itself.

[chequita guevara]

Sites live or die because of content. Poly has no content, so Poly is dying. Period. Paradox had a much, much looser moderation, and as long as there was new content being generated, the forums thrived. Their Off Topic was completely toxic, and most of us just stayed the hell out of the place.

[notyoueither]

No... the problems in the On topic started YEARS ago... before me and rah even became Co owners and were enforcing MarkG's rules. By the time we came on board, traffic in the on topic was already dead. We had lost the modding community because the upload download system and directories simply stunk. And nobody was doing anything to solve those problems.

That seems to be people's mantra, but it simply isn't supported by facts.
Did some of the few remaining on topic posters get chased away because they had thin skins... sure... but the damage was done LONG BEFORE rah and I even came on board. So please, keep your facts straight.

Perhaps you could get yours straight to begin with?

I'm describing a long process that began before you and Rah became partners. Yes, it was years ago. I'm certainly not saying that you and rah killed Poly, and I agree with what Imran said above.

That being said, I can see where you might be equally put off by the lack of a fix for broken bits of the server that contributed to further decline, and the pattern that I am becoming aware of where the technical, OnT people stopped doing anything of much use for the site ages ago (if that is indeed true).

[Nikolai]

apologies, nikolai, i've never met someone devout who wasn't in some way hypocritical, and had compromised their values. sure, we all make mistakes, but i'd rather take the noble savage any day of the week.

All humans are flawed, all are hypocrites to some extent, Christian, Mormon, Hindu, Atheist, all of us. We're, well, human. There is no such thing as a noble savage. Just as it is no such thing as a perfect Christian, or Atheist for that sake. I for example, I have my faith, I try, but I always in some way fail. I do things, say things, think things, I shouldn't. All I can do is to acknowledge that, and act accordingly. If a person claim to be good, he most probably isn't.

[notyoueither]

Could it be that the people who decided that the mod for the Off Topic should also mod all sorts of On Topic forums was the one to blame? Off Topic is basically a full time job in and of itself.

Yes. I believe the problem has to be laid at Mark's and Dan's feet.

The break in the Civ3 community happened long before Ming and rah became admins.