Political Confessional Threadi

[Aeson]

It's greedy doctors screwing the children. Get it together, Aeson.

I know you're being sarcastic, but will address the point.

All things considered (income, tax, other benefits) Australian medical professionals only make slightly less than their American counterparts. Most of that loss is on the upper end. On the lower end they generally get more total compensation.

Medical professionals being paid well are not the problem.

[Geronimo]

the black hole that so much of that money disappears into is to lawyers and to liability insurance policies intended to make paying their astronomical settlements survivable. certainly the US tort system inflicts a *vastly* higher cost on US healthcare expenses than all healthcare insurance related profits combined. Keep insurance under a magnifying class sure but please don't ignore our vile tort industry.

[Elok]

That's fair. Fear of lawsuits certainly does terrible things to way we treat people, including raising costs (both directly and because they encourage unnecessary tests and treatments as "defensive medicine") and is not easily captured by glib claims about Australia. This disaster dates back to FDR; it's not a one-dimensional problem.

As for Australia, I realize this is my fault for not being laser-specific, but were you, Aeson, under the impression I was saying we're going into debt from rinky-dink visits to the GP to get scripts for antibiotics or birth control? No, we are not. In fact, American GPs and such are declining in numbers, last I heard, because if you're going to go through the nightmare and expense of medical school becoming a specialist is a much better RoI. Billable procedures are where it's at, and may not even be captured in comparisons of salary. Checked it earlier today, and yeah, something like 90% of surgeons in the US receive pay over and above their official salaries. Said official salaries may be quite high--trauma and CT surgeons both average something like $500K/year--but when you add in pay for specific procedures, boy howdy. This would be "at the top," where pay reputedly diverges, even on your figures (for which I will take your word).

Did I mention I've been working in this industry for almost a decade now? Because I have.

[Aeson]

As for Australia, I realize this is my fault for not being laser-specific, but were you, Aeson, under the impression I was saying we're going into debt from rinky-dink visits to the GP to get scripts for antibiotics or birth control?

No. I was under the impression you are trying to give insurance corporations a free pass by pretending their tens of $billions in profit isn't part of the problem.

I was also under the impression you were arguing against learning from other nations who have solved this affordability problem.

Since you were.

[Aeson]

the black hole that so much of that money disappears into is to lawyers and to liability insurance policies intended to make paying their astronomical settlements survivable. certainly the US tort system inflicts a *vastly* higher cost on US healthcare expenses than all healthcare insurance related profits combined. Keep insurance under a magnifying class sure but please don't ignore our vile tort industry.

It's a part of the problem, but not vastly higher. $50 billion a year.

Also, there does need to be some type of recourse against malpractice, so not all of the tort costs are superfluous. The estimates of national tort reform bills (which claimed a vastly higher total of $300 billion a year) are $15 billion a year savings.

We could probably learn from other nations who don't have this problem, and have better health outcomes, about how to handle it.

Profits off insurance are unnecessary for a functional healthcare system. There's a lot of expenses they incur that are also unnecessary. Like campaign donations, lobbying, speakers fees, executive compensation, etc.