Embargo

[Bereta_Eder]

I was also flaberghasted at the question of the alternative to tesla?

Like the alternative to something extremely rare?

there doesn't need to be

[Dauphin]

Yes. Tesla's market share for all cars in Europe was about 2% before the boycott hit, so talk of massive loss is big for Tesla, but meaningless for the European car market as a whole.

[Geronimo]

I was also flaberghasted at the question of the alternative to tesla?

Like the alternative to something extremely rare?

there doesn't need to be

rarity shouldn't matter when making a boycott. I might note that Papoutsanis products are quite rare but if they were boycotted I would still expect interesting and probably meaningful (and dependent on why they were boycotted, possibly ironic) trends with respect to what boycotters replace those products with.

[Bereta_Eder]

haha amazing that you know papoutsanis considering I just today bought an almont scented penthanol infused liquid soap that during covid was proven to be he only liquid soap that didn't make my hands dry from continuiously washing them.

in any case as an extreme rarity as teslas or stalinks are here, I suppose elon represents nazism and that's bad for his products.


I'm sure there are other electric cars out there that don't have the word "nazi" scribled on them

[Bereta_Eder]

I will give credit though. teslas used to be instantly recognized.

but now they are instantly recognized, as nazi cars

I just today cut one off,

back off nazi, the partizans are advancing

(little joke)

[Aeson]

I'd love to know what Musk company sales boycotts are pivotting to. surely some meaningfully more defensible alternative?

You don't seem to understand the point of the boycotts. The point isn't to find a better purchasing option. That's great if it happens. In many cases it will happen as people examine their spending habits. But not the point.

The point is to protest SPECIFIC ACTIONS of SPECIFIC ACTORS/GROUPS. To say, stop this behavior, it's unacceptable. By doing so we can hopefully change that specific behavior. Or force others who can stop that behavior (such as Rs in house and senate) to do so.

Whether or not the alternatives are good/bad really doesn't matter to the intent. It's not ironic or hypocrisy if the only other options are also bad. That would be sad if so, all the more reason to target those who can improve. People having no good options is certainly not something to hypothetically jack off to like you're doing.

[Jon Miller]

If you are still OK with Amazon (and I am frustrated, but not to the point of boycotting), then you have Project Kuiper​.

JM

[Jon Miller]

If you are still OK with Amazon (and I am frustrated, but not to the point of boycotting), then you have Project Kuiper.

JM

[Geronimo]

You don't seem to understand the point of the boycotts. The point isn't to find a better purchasing option. That's great if it happens. In many cases it will happen as people examine their spending habits. But not the point.

The point is to protest SPECIFIC ACTIONS of SPECIFIC ACTORS/GROUPS. To say, stop this behavior, it's unacceptable. By doing so we can hopefully change that specific behavior. Or force others who can stop that behavior (such as Rs in house and senate) to do so.

Whether or not the alternatives are good/bad really doesn't matter to the intent. It's not ironic or hypocrisy if the only other options are also bad. That would be sad if so, all the more reason to target those who can improve. People having no good options is certainly not something to hypothetically jack off to like you're doing.

And I'm not properly communicating my opposition to the boycotts. The worst thing about them won't be the hypocrisy of the substitutions No. the worst thing about a successful widescale anti US boycott will be that it would be expected to directly and greatly increase US trade deficits which will hugely incentivize Trump to increase, perhaps massively, his tariffs rather than backing off on them. It's the wrong button to push.

If an outlet is needed for ordinary people to directly participate in the harm used to convey the message, then I suggest that a far more effective target might be US stocks than the US product sales themselves. Huge continent scale pump and dump schemes could have the intended effect of the boycotts without the incentivization for Trump to double-down on his tariff policies. If the legality is a problem parliaments may have to speedily pass some sort of legal cover for the activity but I suspect there'd be plenty of appetite for speedy passage just now at least.

[N35t0r]

And I'm not properly communicating my opposition to the boycotts. The worst thing about them won't be the hypocrisy of the substitutions No. the worst thing about a successful widescale anti US boycott will be that it would be expected to directly and greatly increase US trade deficits which will hugely incentivize Trump to increase, perhaps massively, his tariffs rather than backing off on them. It's the wrong button to push.

Yeah, but trying to play nice and emphasize the benefits of trade has gotten Canada what? An extra week of no tariffs? It's clear that backing off is not on the menu, so **** him. It's not up to the rest of the world to make up for the US' stupidity for them, if Trump wants a trade war, he can have a trade war.
Maybe the people in the US will think better next time? Or at least the people with power.

If an outlet is needed for ordinary people to directly participate in the harm used to convey the message, then I suggest that a far more effective target might be US stocks than the US product sales themselves. Huge continent scale pump and dump schemes could have the intended effect of the boycotts without the incentivization for Trump to double-down on his tariff policies. If the legality is a problem parliaments may have to speedily pass some sort of legal cover for the activity but I suspect there'd be plenty of appetite for speedy passage just now at least.

The average European citizen does not [s]gamble[/s] invest directly in the stock exchange. If anything, they've bought into some index funds or retirement insurance that does. They do, however, purchase things on the daily, so that's where they can have an effect.

(Personally, I've already made sure that the funds I do have some control over are not being invested in US stocks and bonds, but I'm also taking steps to stop buying US products)

[Aeson]

And I'm not properly communicating my opposition to the boycotts. The worst thing about them won't be the hypocrisy of the substitutions No. the worst thing about a successful widescale anti US boycott will be that it would be expected to directly and greatly increase US trade deficits which will hugely incentivize Trump to increase, perhaps massively, his tariffs rather than backing off on them. It's the wrong button to push.

Appease appease appease...

That's a feature, not a bug. As already mentioned by others, hopefully the pain of economic hardship will wake up enough Rs to get them to reject Trump's insanity and maybe even kick him out.

​​​​​

If an outlet is needed for ordinary people to directly participate in the harm used to convey the message, then I suggest that a far more effective target might be US stocks than the US product sales themselves. Huge continent scale pump and dump schemes could have the intended effect of the boycotts without the incentivization for Trump to double-down on his tariff policies. If the legality is a problem parliaments may have to speedily pass some sort of legal cover for the activity but I suspect there'd be plenty of appetite for speedy passage just now at least.

​​​​​​Maybe if ordinary people are hungry they could just eat cake too?

This is incredibly tone deaf. Ordinary people don't own lots of stock, those most hurt by Trump's policies are the least likely to own stock, and selling for non-economic reasons would not affect the underlying value of companies much if at all. It would simply be taking losses to transfer wealth to those willing to buy the discounted stock.

Attacking the revenue of these companies erodes the underlying value, the stock prices will likely follow.

[Geronimo]

The gamestop pump and dump scheme was achieved by ordinary people with much smaller numbers.

[N35t0r]

The gamestop pump and dump scheme was achieved by ordinary people with much smaller numbers.

A lot of people lost a lot of money with that. Some people lost all of their money. Your proposal is that to avoid US people having to deal with worse consequences of the decisions of the president they elected, Europeans should sacrifice their savings?

Also, the GME short squeeze occurred when it's market cap was around a quarter billion dollars. The 30 companies in the Dow Jones industrial index and up to over 30 trillion dollars. The S&P 500 over 50. Your proposal is not only of doubtful effect, but what would stop Trump from retaliating by confiscating shares held by foreigners once a pump-and-dump is identified?

[BeBMan]

Sad lol at "swasticar".

Tesla sales are down in parts of Europe and elsewhere, but rose in selected countries - but may be multiple reasons behind it

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/uk-new-car-sales-drop-1-february-industry-data-shows-2025-03-05/

Didn't plan to get one with or without Trump/Musk nonsense.

[Geronimo]

A lot of people lost a lot of money with that. Some people lost all of their money. Your proposal is that to avoid US people having to deal with worse consequences of the decisions of the president they elected, Europeans should sacrifice their savings?

Also, the GME short squeeze occurred when it's market cap was around a quarter billion dollars. The 30 companies in the Dow Jones industrial index and up to over 30 trillion dollars. The S&P 500 over 50. Your proposal is not only of doubtful effect, but what would stop Trump from retaliating by confiscating shares held by foreigners once a pump-and-dump is identified?

boycotts are sacrifices too. how large depends on what is sacrificed. I didn't recommend anybody sacrifice their lifesavings any more than boycott advocates are advocating patients reschedule urgently needed surgery to avoid a US medical device.