Empire of Lies and brainless zombies

[Wezil]

I don't think Trump could have exited NATO without incredible dissent in his own party and government. The impulse may have been there but not the political capital.

[Wezil]

That should have been a huge red flag for Putin. If Trump thinks it is smart is just might be time to reevaluate.

[BeBMan]

As far as NATO members upping their spending goes it's fair to say that Putin was finally successful where numerous US presidents - incl. Trump - failed...

He basically made NATO great again.

[-Jrabbit]

Frankly, I sincerely doubt that Trump even had a fundamental awareness of what NATO is, how it was formed, or why it exists. He really only sees the world as a series of entries on a balance sheet.

[-Jrabbit]

Pretty sure that's an illegal act for any POTUS.

[-Jrabbit]

Agreed re NATO. I don't think Trump wanted to kill NATO, but I'm pretty damned sure he wanted to nerf it so as to remove the threat to his buddy, Putin. He (rightly IMHO) pressured the EU countries to pony up their fair share, and of course alienated most of Europe in the process. Which also pleased Vlad.

[N35t0r]

I think that, in the same way as saying that it was a ploy is hard to believe, it's also unlikely that killing NATO was a goal for him in any way. However, he was very irregular in his moods and was prone to rash decisions. I find it more likely that he wanted other NATO members to contribute more (perhaps so that the US could contribute less), and when nobody did he got angry and threatened to take the ball home, so to speak.

[Geronimo]

DP

[Geronimo]

So Trump was the harshest US president against Russia in the past 20 years, yet somehow he's not in the list of US officials sanctioned by Russia (but his opponent in the 2016 election, Hillary Clinton, is)? Odd.

You'll also have to forgive me if I don't believe that Trump's threats of leaving NATO were a smart ploy in order to force the other members to increase military spending. It's hard to believe coming from the same guy who would sharpie a hurricane warning map in order to avoid admitting he made a mistake.

I think the Russians are only sanctioning Dems to try to stir the pot politically in the US. It makes perfect sense to do so since they know the sanctions are otherwise entirely symbolic. Extreme partisan division is the most harmful outcome they could hope for. And obviously, bipartisan unity with respect to Russia is very undesirable to them. As for choosing to appear to favor republicans over choosing to favor Democrats in such a strategy, republicans were the obvious choice not just because of notorious comments by noted conservatives but also because of a conservative president so recently investigated for Russian collusion, despite no evidence that it ever occurred.

His threats to leave NATO were stupid and I maintain that he weakened NATO. However, if he wished to undermine NATO, using rhetoric aimed at increasing its funding was stupid as the ploy could in fact have plausibly lead to NATO being strengthened. Trump had a huge array of powerful options to kill NATO and he exercised none of them.

[Geronimo]

I do love that he called the invasion "smart" right before it festered into a total fuster cluck for Russia

[Egbert]

I am getting the very distinct impression that this situation has changed from Putin confidently fighting to subjugate the Ukraine to Putin desperately fighting to keep his job.

This situation looks really bad for Putin. It is a bad situation for the Ukraine who whist getting hurt look increasingly likely to fight off the Russians.

A draw would be satisfactory for the Ukraine but may herald the end of Putin as the ruler of Russia.

[Proteus_MST]

We are also talking about the guy who talked to Putin with only an interpreter present and forbade that any transcripts of the talk be made.

Which is, at least, highly unusual

[N35t0r]

So Trump was the harshest US president against Russia in the past 20 years, yet somehow he's not in the list of US officials sanctioned by Russia (but his opponent in the 2016 election, Hillary Clinton, is)? Odd.

You'll also have to forgive me if I don't believe that Trump's threats of leaving NATO were a smart ploy in order to force the other members to increase military spending. It's hard to believe coming from the same guy who would sharpie a hurricane warning map in order to avoid admitting he made a mistake.

[-Jrabbit]

A lot of despicable activity by Trump -- stuff that would have been career-enders for any prior POTUS -- ended up being somehow normalized and accepted. Jimmy Carter had to sell his peanut farm before he could run. Trump kept everything, used his properties for official events, and it was all somehow OK. And that was just the tip of the iceberg. I won't quote chapter and verse; I'll just agree that Trump has many appalling deficiencies. Fortunately, one of the side effects of the current war is to cast Trump's Putin love in sharp relief, right down to massive praise for the alleged brilliance of an invasion plan that we now know was clearly deficient in many ways. Frankly, he looks like an idiot, and it's hard to ignore.

[Geronimo]

Trump endlessly lobbied to increase NATO members military expenditures....an attempt to weaken NATO how?

He certainly held up military aid for 55 days but his predecessor and successor held up aid to Ukraine even longer. Indefinitely for some aid.

Trump shared counter terrorism information but not methods or sources.

Of US presidents more sanctions were placed on Russia under trump than under his predecessors or even his successors until the invasion actually began.

And finally Putin certainly wanted the US to remain a party to arms control treaties that Russia was no longer observing.

Trump has so many appalling deficiencies I'm amazed people feel any need to invent new ones.

Laziness maybe? Mass gas lighting?