The Moral Arc

[kentonio]

Harm themselves? Really? Aren't you for the legalisation of drugs? Your damn worldview should scare the living daylights out of any reasonable person.

Conversion therapy achieves nothing other than causing psychological harm to its victims. Do you support conversion therapy (like Trump's vice-President Mike Pence does)?

[Aeson]

The chance that sodomy rights could be taken away being extremely low wins that argument. Also the fact that liberals have a very extensive trace record of claiming that people are Hitler etc...

The fact that Trump has shown support for at least 2 nominees/justices who would reinstate sodomy rights, and the ages of the current justices, seems to suggest the chance is actually not that low. It is uncertain, and the very fact that it's uncertain is scary in and of itself. Even if we used your 1% you previously pulled out of your ass ... it's still way too high for comfort.

Whether or not someone calls you Hitler has nothing to do with it.

[Aeson]

I support adults being able to participate in conversion therapy if they choose to. Anyone who believes in conversion therapy, or would prescribe it to others, is a loon though.

[kentonio]

So basically.. 'All these darn gay liberals whining, when there's probably only a 1 in a 100 chance that they'll have their basic human rights rescinded!". Yeah jeez, I wonder why anyone wouldn't be happy about that..

[Kidlicious]

Conversion therapy achieves nothing other than causing psychological harm to its victims. Do you support conversion therapy (like Trump's vice-President Mike Pence does)?

You could say anything causes psychological harm. I say women's studies causes psychological harm. There's a difference when you start taking people's rights away.

[Kidlicious]

The fact that Trump has shown support for at least 2 nominees/justices who would reinstate sodomy rights, and the ages of the current justices, seems to suggest the chance is actually not that low. It is uncertain, and the very fact that it's uncertain is scary in and of itself. Even if we used your 1% you previously pulled out of your ass ... it's still way too high for comfort.

Whether or not someone calls you Hitler has nothing to do with it.

No it's not. Being afraid of something when there is a less than 1% chance is irrational.

[kentonio]

You could say anything causes psychological harm. I say women's studies causes psychological harm. There's a difference when you start taking people's rights away.

I could indeed do that, and it would be nonsense. You could do that (and frequently do) and it would be nonsense. However when professionals set up and conduct scientific studies with those conclusions, which are then subjected to peer review to ensure their methodologies and practises are sound, then they become useful evidence based information.

[kentonio]

No it's not. Being afraid of something when there is a less than 1% chance is irrational.

Given that your chance of being harmed by Islamic terrorists is considerably less than 1%, you are indeed being irrational about Islam.

[Kidlicious]

I could indeed do that, and it would be nonsense. You could do that (and frequently do) and it would be nonsense. However when professionals set up and conduct scientific studies with those conclusions, which are then subjected to peer review to ensure their methodologies and practises are sound, then they become useful evidence based information.

It doesn't surprise me that you think psychology is a hard science and that most psychologists aren't full of ****.

[Kidlicious]

Given that your chance of being harmed by Islamic terrorists is considerably less than 1%, you are indeed being irrational about Islam.

But the chance that terrorism will harm my country is very high. Indeed it already has.

[Elok]

So basically.. 'All these darn gay liberals whining, when there's probably only a 1 in a 100 chance that they'll have their basic human rights rescinded!". Yeah jeez, I wonder why anyone wouldn't be happy about that..

It's really ****ing hard to undo a SC precedent--we've been trying to kill abortion for almost fifty years--and they've got two. It could happen, but it isn't likely, and people aren't wetting themselves about much more plausible threats. I live in Trump Country, for instance, and the small but significant Muslim population here does not appear to be terrified of registrations or deportations or lynching. I've heard no word of such anxiety elsewhere, either. Have you?

More broadly, he could tank the economy and ruin healthcare, which would cause hardship for everyone.

[kentonio]

It doesn't surprise me that you think psychology is a hard science and that most psychologists aren't full of ****.

Because obviously indicators like a greatly increased risk of suicide are just subjective opinions..

[kentonio]

But the chance that terrorism will harm my country is very high. Indeed it already has.

And LGBTQ people have lived with not having many of the rights they then fought for decades to win. They've also had to experience things like gay people being beaten to death by homophobic police officers or dragged to death behind a truck by homophobic rednecks. Why should they be any less concerned than you?

[kentonio]

It's really ****ing hard to undo a SC precedent--we've been trying to kill abortion for almost fifty years--and they've got two. It could happen, but it isn't likely, and people aren't wetting themselves about much more plausible threats. I live in Trump Country, for instance, and the small but significant Muslim population here does not appear to be terrified of registrations or deportations or lynching. I've heard no word of such anxiety elsewhere, either. Have you?

More broadly, he could tank the economy and ruin healthcare, which would cause hardship for everyone.

They need 6 SC judges and its done. They could get to appoint 3 over the next term not counting the votes they already potentially have. That's more than worrying considering the rise of the extreme right and the lingering death of political compromise.

As for Muslims in your area, why would you hear about it? Do you talk to them regularly about the things that concern them? Because if I was a member of a small, widely loathed and highly vulnerable community I'd be keeping my head down as much as possible right now.

[Elok]

Dude, the Muslims in my area are DOCTORS. Literally two-thirds of the scripts my pharmacy processes are from guys with names like Hassan or Malik. They're prominent, respected members of the community, they continue to do their jobs, and I've not heard any of our customers--even the blatant trailer trash--mumble a word against them. The ones who aren't doctors go around in hijabs or other distinctively Muslim garb.

As for the Court . . . no. We had eight years under Reagan, four under GHWB, eight under GWB, and abortion ain't budged since Casey. Scalia was the heart of the court's conservative wing, and Roberts would be rather reluctant to completely overturn two precedents less than twenty years old, one of them settled on his watch.