Trump Beats FOX News

[My Hubby Loves Civ]

I know! What is he bringing to the presidency? All I have heard is a great big wall with a big ornate door? I believe he has said that he would get Mexico to pay for it even! Seriously? He is clueless about America but more clueless about the government in Mexico!

[giblets]

He can get Mexico to send the workers that will build the wall, does that count?

[My Wife Hates CIV]

I might vote trump... why not???

Hillary? my god she lies, she lies all the time... she just likes to lie!

bush. been there, no need to go back. and going back it would be.

sanders... sure but he aint in it yet. and probably never will be in it.

and how can trump be any worse. "yes we can!" well we didn't did we. next.

[kentonio]

and how can trump be any worse.

Let's see, he wants to launch a war against Iran (which would cost tens of thousands of American lives, shut down much of the Middle East causing massive oil shortages, and kill hundreds of thousands of innocent people, and he wants to do it so America can take their oil.

That worse enough for ya?

[My Wife Hates CIV]

I see it different. lasting about a month. at least control wise. maybe I be wrong, but i'll vote to find out.

I'm just tired of the same issues every time... always iran, NK, climate, unemployment. I mean, just tell me what you are going to fix.

nothing changes... and there is always the 'new' issue to add to the pile.

so yeah, trump.

[My Wife Hates CIV]

and I can't be the only one thinking like this... his numbers are up. I mean, dem, rep... either camp sucks. nothing happens. they are limp parties. lets shake things up.

[My Hubby Loves Civ]

i don't even go there with MWHC! I have debated him before, we are total opposites. You just made him want to vote Trump in now!

[giblets]

Let's see, he wants to launch a war against Iran (which would cost tens of thousands of American lives, shut down much of the Middle East causing massive oil shortages, and kill hundreds of thousands of innocent people, and he wants to do it so America can take their oil.

That worse enough for ya?

But... but... but... Hillary Clinton is so evil /sarcasm

[My Wife Hates CIV]

Hillary is just lost in her own world. when the end comes for her (politically) it will come fast. just watch. and I liked bill. he would be cool as first gentleman.

[My Hubby Loves Civ]

I have said before and will say it again! America needs a president that the world can respect. Even if Hillary was a golden goose of honesty and diplomacy, she would not get in the white house because the World will all still look at Bill to see if he agrees!

[giblets]

lol like Bill is going to challenge his wife on anything.

[kentonio]

I see it different. lasting about a month. at least control wise. maybe I be wrong, but i'll vote to find out.

You see it wrong. Iran is not Iraq, they can not just be kicked over by America in a few weeks. They're MUCH bigger (larger and more people than Iraq and Afghanistan combined), and they border an entire side of the Persian Gulf, which they're perfectly capable of mining if they chose, closing the Strait of Hormuz and completely paralyzing oil exports. Not to mention the fact that they are the 3rd largest oil exporter in the world anyway.

Put it this way, an attack just on the nuclear sites, air/missile only would have massive repercussions and quite possibly fail. An invasion scenario would eventually succeed but the costs would be absolutely staggering in lives and money. In 2012 the Federation of American Scientists did a study which estimated that air strikes on Iran's nuclear sites would cost the global economy $700 billion. An invasion would cost in the region of $1.7 trillion. Considering the knock on effects around the gulf, I think that's extremely conservative.

Iran is 1/5 the size of America and has 500,000 active service personnel, and 1,800,000 reservists. Oh and then there's the Basji militia's which could potentially add up to something as insane as 11-12 MILLION fighters. They also have submarines, drones, a decent missile program capable of hitting targets up to 2000 miles away. Oh and in the last 2 days, Russia and Iran just met up to discuss military co-operation including Russia potentially sending Iran the S-300 surface to air missile system

Oh and none of your allies would help you. More to the point, you wouldn't have many allies anymore. Seriously, the idea of a western power carrying out an aggressive war for profit? You'd be lucky if half the world didn't form a coalition to fight a war against you. The EU would drop the US like a hot rock, and Russia and China would have a field day at the UN (after they'd finished laughing at how mind-blowingly stupid you'd just been).

Oh and all those scenarios for how a conflict would go? All scrapped. Because they assume scenarios were you can actually get to Iran, due to your allies and their willingness to let the US fly from their airbases, dock in their ports and launch missions from their countries. You launch an open war for oil, that's all gone. You can no longer even carry out the invasion in the first place..

You want to vote for a candidate who thinks the best use of a presidents time is to commit a war crime (Waging aggressive war is an internationally agreed crime), lose all America's most important allies, risk American lives all around the world, and ultimately fail anyway?

I'm just tired of the same issues every time... always iran, NK, climate, unemployment. I mean, just tell me what you are going to fix.

nothing changes... and there is always the 'new' issue to add to the pile.

so yeah, trump.

America and the world have problems, and some of them don't have easy answers. So? The best you can come up with is 'Hey we have huge problems we probably can't solve quickly, let's vote for a buffoon and create some even bigger ones'?

[NICE MOBIUS]

All of the above is why history will be kind on Obama.

[giblets]

You mean after Trump starts a war with Iran, leading to a wrecked global economy and reinstation of military conscription in the US, people will look back on Obama and think he was a great president?

[rah]

Yeah, because presidents always do what they say they're going to do when campaigning once they're elected.