'It's not about French fries, it's about freedom'

[Sava]

The rationalizations you use to justify your inherent bias are of no interest to me.

[kentonio]

Your quite frankly bizarre stance that people should be able to kill their children without being blamed for it, is however of particular interest to me.

[Thoth]

people should be able to kill their children without being blamed for it

Think of it as Darwinism in action.

[Sava]

Your quite frankly bizarre stance that people should be able to kill their children without being blamed for it, is however of particular interest to me.

You've quoted me saying otherwise.

Add dishonesty to the argument
You have nothing.

Your attitude on thus subject is that of an asshile. I think you know this and are frantically grasping for straws

[giblets]

Blame is absolutely useless, from a policy perspective, for everything but criminal punishment.

But it does help justify your inherent bias.

Why is it useful for criminal punishment?

[giblets]

The rationalizations you use to justify your inherent bias are of no interest to me.

There's no inherent bias. Obesity is harmful and avoidable.

[Sava]

I have hope for kentonio, but not you

[Elok]

Saying "just eat less and exercise more, and you'll lose weight" is akin to telling soldiers "just shoot more enemies and take fewer casualties, and you'll win the war." While generally accurate, it's technically misleading, ignores a number of complicating factors, and just isn't super-helpful as advice.

Consider: Almost all popular forms of entertainment in America are sedentary. Games, movies, texting, TV, internet, books--most of it involves sitting on your arse. Likewise the most cheap and convenient sources of food are unhealthy. Now, you can save money and eat healthy by buying actual ingredients on sale and cooking them. You can also entertain yourself by playing sports, riding a bike, etc. But when was the last time you saw ads for broccoli, or basketballs? Spalding can't sell sixty-dollar basketballs the way Microsoft can sell sixty dollar FPS games, and Frito-Lay has no hope of selling Nacho Cheese Broccolitos.

Part of the reason people in America are obese is that there are multiple billion-dollar industries spending obscene amounts of money every year to sell them on unhealthy food and activities. They sink a great deal of cash into market research. It would be rather fatuous to expect such a costly endeavor to fail completely, or blame the people it targets for its success. And yes, these products exist because they are what sell best--overwhelming sensation. Salt, fat and sugar enhance flavor; flashy lights attract our attention and indulge our laziness. That's bound to happen in a free market with no incentives built in towards health. Looking down your nose at the fatties is not going to solve the basic problem of perverse incentives.

How to generate actually healthy incentives without an anti-paternalism backlash is an interesting question. And I don't have the answer.

[giblets]

Is it okay to shame any behavior?

x-post

[giblets]

If it's not okay to shame parents who make their kids obese, why is it okay to shame any other form of child abuse?

[giblets]

Why shame Catholic priests for raping kids? Is your position that shaming works and we should do it?

[Sava]

Elok gets it

[giblets]

Stop shaming Ben for raping kids, bigot.

[giblets]

It's inconsistent to attribute obesity to incentives while at the same time insisting that shaming doesn't work. You're intellectually dishonest.

[Elok]

Shaming does not work terribly well in a society as individualistic and libertine as our own. Unless it's an absolute targeted dogpile, like we use on celebrities who say racist things.