Exit Polls Suggest Syriza Has Won Greek Election

[Sava]

When you're talking about the government policies of a democratic state, it's reasonable to assign collective responsibility.

No.

[Felch]

No.

Yes.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Felch is saying Americans basically deserved 9/11 due to collective responsibility over the US's horrible foreign policy in the Mideast

[Felch]

Ron Paul says that, and he's got something of a point, but I think that's pushing it. I think that we have a portion of the responsibility, since we never wiped the house off Saud of the face of the Earth, but we're not entirely responsible.

Americans are responsible for the governments that we elect, and for the policies they enact. We're responsible for having a higher proportion of our people incarcerated than any other country. We're responsible for the War on Drugs, and the countless people who suffer as a result of it. We're responsible for police who murder minorities, and we're responsible for lotteries that target the poor and ignorant. We're responsible for a whole lot of ****.

Pretending otherwise is childish.

[Sava]

Felch is saying Americans basically deserved 9/11 due to collective responsibility over the US's horrible foreign policy in the Mideast

Pretty much.

Idiots love collective responsibility because it makes doing things like hating Islam/Muslims seem more acceptable.

[Imran Siddiqui]

I'll take one thing:

We're responsible for police who murder minorities

So we should all go to jail because we're collectively responsible for those murders? Or we should all pay those minorities who got shot - not the city, no the entire country. A form of reparations, if you will - well since we are collective responsible for slavery, why not, right?

[Felch]

Why not?

[FlameFlash]

I seem to have left my facepalms at home today...

This will have to suffice.

[Felch]

Wait, let me get this straight.

Do you fuckwits seriously not believe that citizens in a democracy are responsible for the people they elect and what those elected leaders do?

[FlameFlash]

Wait, let me get this straight.

Do you fuckwits seriously not believe that citizens in a democracy are responsible for the people they elect and what those elected leaders do?

Last time I checked a president of the US could still not win the popular vote and become president... doesn't sound very democratic to me.

[Sava]

Ron Paul says that, and he's got something of a point, but I think that's pushing it. I think that we have a portion of the responsibility, since we never wiped the house off Saud of the face of the Earth, but we're not entirely responsible.

Americans are responsible for the governments that we elect, and for the policies they enact. We're responsible for having a higher proportion of our people incarcerated than any other country. We're responsible for the War on Drugs, and the countless people who suffer as a result of it. We're responsible for police who murder minorities, and we're responsible for lotteries that target the poor and ignorant. We're responsible for a whole lot of ****.

This is a very, very stupid thing you just wrote. Do you really believe this?

[Sava]

Wait, let me get this straight.

Do you fuckwits seriously not believe that citizens in a democracy are responsible for the people they elect and what those elected leaders do?

Not to the degree you seem to believe. The notion utterly preposterous.

It reminds me of a thread from maybe 6 months to a year ago where I talked about quantifying moral responsibility. Basically, just about everyone concluded that you couldn't assign any responsibility because of a variety of reasons. Politicians lie. Individual voters in America don't have equally weighted votes due to the electoral college... you'd have to bump the thread to get the full story.

I'd say that if you really want to do that, you could start off at assigning everyone a general level of responsibility. I'm going to use the whole population instead of registered voters since you seem to think people of our age group should be held responsible for Nixon's War on Drugs... sins of the father. So each individual US citizen bears approximately 1/300,000,000th of the blame for what politicians do. By the way, does that mean I also get to take credit for the actions of my government?

YAY I LANDED ON THE MOON, DEFEATED THE NAZIS, KILLED COMMUNISM, FREED THE SLAVES, etc, etc...

And what is the fucking point of assigning collective responsibility? What does it accomplish? Not a goddam thing.

It only gives license for idiots to blindly hate other groups of people... like you and Oerdin with Islam. Racist bags of moldy cum that you are.

[Felch]

Last time I checked a president of the US could still not win the popular vote and become president... doesn't sound very democratic to me.

So what? The president is elected according to rules that we all agree to. Whether he wins a majority of the vote is irrelevant as long as we accept his leadership.

This is a very, very stupid thing you just wrote. Do you really believe this?

It's a brilliant thing to write, and I believe every word of it.

[Felch]

It only gives license for idiots to blindly hate other groups of people... like you and Oerdin with Islam. Racist bags of moldy *** that you are.

No, it's not about hate, it's about learning the right lessons. If you hate people then that's your problem.

[Sava]

it's about learning the right lessons

I have zero confidence in your ability to do so.

And what the fuck does that even mean? That's such a shitty non answer.