Bill Maher: Islam is inherently worse than other religions.

[Imran Siddiqui]

To be fair, most American's don't know what the Levant is.

Most American's couldn't identify Syria or Iraq on a map either, but that isn't the point.

I'm pretty sure you are right, but it'd be nice if the media ever thought its job was to educate Americans on the rest of the world... oh, for dreams.

[Felch]

Those numbers are very low for Turkey and Lebanon though, which indicates to me that poorer countries are much more likely to support it because you have ton of poor illiterate folks who are fine with killing. Indonesia, as you can see, has 30% of Muslims in favor of that, which is much lower than Egypt, Lebanon, Pakistan, and Nigeria - Indonesia isn't as rich as Turkey and Lebanon, but its ~$10k GDP per capita (PPP) is far higher than the four countries listed above.

You're right, there are countries where the fundamentalist streak of Islam isn't as strong. There are a la carte Muslims just as there are a la carte Christians.

[Colon™]

Mahar was citing Pew polls which do show that majorities of Muslims in many countries hold deeply illiberal views, specifically the death penalty for apostasy. He was very clear in the video that ISIS and extreme militant Muslims don't reflect the majority of Muslims. He used the term "connective tissue," meaning that the extreme examples are a consequence of the inherently evil and violent norms that Islam establishes.

Thank you for intentionally distorting Bill Maher's arguments and showing us all just how dishonest you are.

The PEW survey isn't the evidence you think it is. Firstly, it shows a wide disparity between different Muslim countries, suggesting other factors than religion are in play. It also shows large variations over time, even though Muslim scriptures stay the same, again suggesting other factors. And finally, there are no control groups. It would have been interesting to see what the view of Christian Nigerians are for instance, to see if they differ a lot.

[Felch]

The PEW survey is evidence that "majorities of Muslims in many countries hold deeply illiberal views." You might say the reverse, in reference to Lebanon and Turkey as Imran has, but Maher and I are still right.

[Colon™]

It isn't evidence that the religion is the main cause though, which is the assumption you are making.

[Felch]

Show me a poll the shows a majority of Christians supporting the death penalty for apostasy.

[DinoDoc]

I don't think anyone has answered this. ISIL is probably a better translation from Arabic - it stands for Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant. Media has decided to call it Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, because it doesn't think most Americans know what the Levant is.

Then why not just use the same name the group is using and refer to them as the Islamic State rather than making me think Sterling Archer has turned traitor?

[ricketyclik]

I don't believe you. Unless you had a bad connection and failed to download the entire page (in which case you should have recognized that and refreshed) computers don't make mistakes like that.

hat is not the bottom line, and that is not what Maher was talking about. Go back, watch the video (probably for the first time) and you'll see that he's not saying anything of the sort.

I did watch the video, but not from an anti-Muslim point of view. I do, however acknowledge that what you're getting at is that what you're saying is in line with what Maher was saying, ie that Islamism is inherently evil. That is, in fact, the bottom line of this thread, and I diverged. I don't agree that it's inherently evil. None of my Muslim friends have it in for the West (being of the West, as they now are). Sure, some Muslims hate the West, but the vast majority don't. Remember, we're talking over 2 billion people here.

[Dinner]

Despite the cherry-picking nature of these statistics I would like to see sources please. Oh, and if you insist on referring to Mohammed as a cult leader please don't be insulted if JC is referred to as such. Or Abe Lincoln, or whoever it is your heroes are.

Watch the same video, would you? Because the y mention the pew poll as the source. Seriously, half the stuff you've posted in this thread was already asked and answered in the video.

[Colon™]

Show me a poll the shows a majority of Christians supporting the death penalty for apostasy.

I already said the survey didn't include a control group.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Then why not just use the same name the group is using and refer to them as the Islamic State rather than making me think Sterling Archer has turned traitor?

I don't control the media... What do you think I am, Jewish?

[Felch]

I did watch the video, but not from an anti-Muslim point of view. I do, however acknowledge that what you're getting at is that what you're saying is in line with what Maher was saying, ie that Islamism is inherently evil. That is, in fact, the bottom line of this thread, and I diverged. I don't agree that it's inherently evil. None of my Muslim friends have it in for the West (being of the West, as they now are). Sure, some Muslims hate the West, but the vast majority don't. Remember, we're talking over 2 billion people here.

I've got Muslim friends too, and they're decent people. Some of them also drink beer and eat pepperoni pizza. So while they're good people, they're often bad Muslims.

[Felch]

I already said the survey didn't include a control group.

Surveys don't need control groups. They're surveys, not experiments. Find any survey of Christians supporting the death penalty for apostasy.

I'll make it even easier. No need to find survey data. Show me one majority Christian country that punishes apostasy like these 23 majority Muslim countries do.

[Colon™]

Surveys don't need control groups. They're surveys, not experiments. Find any survey of Christians supporting the death penalty for apostasy.

You are the one claiming religion is the determinant. It is up to you to get the evidence for your theory. So you go find me statistics that show that for instance Nigerian Muslim are less liberal than Nigerian Christians.

[Felch]

I've got evidence. 23 Muslim countries punish apostasy. No Christian countries do. Apostasy is forbidden by Islamic scriptures. Christianity makes no such prohibition.