Bill Maher: Islam is inherently worse than other religions.

[Heresson]

A moral analysis of Islam (or any religion) is counter-productive to the goal of defeating radical elements. If anything, it's going to swell their ranks by being exactly the Great Satan that radicals say we are.

So feel free to get up on your high horse, feeling superior to all those dirty mooslims. Anyone who does so is actively helping the terrorists win, frankly.

First of all, you imply that the result of moral analysis of islam will lead to a conclusion it's wrong.

Secondly, while I do understand you a bit, you don't want to anger Muslims not to make radicalism even more appealing, I'm not sure if such an appeasement would be working. And I value truth apart from practical reasons.

But even if we accept that mohamed was violent and jesus wasn't (and according to the predominent perseption indeed, he wasn't) one has to come and tell us does mohamed holds the same position as jesus holds for christians?
aka: is he central to the whole plot and is he regarded as a savior, a god-man and the embodiment of everything that's true and pure?

Or is he considered something less? What is he considered as, anyway?

Muhammad was not "violent" as a person I guess, in comparison to the other people of his times. But he was leading an expansionist theocratic state, and employed means that would not be acceptable today. And that's enough.

Muhammad is a Prophet, the Seal of the Prophets, the last one of them, bringing final and perfect revelation. And Al-Qur'an is considered by classical sunni Muslim theology an unchanging, eternal and literal word of God. The actions of Muhammad are considered - Al-Qur'an makes them in fact - something to follow. The stories about life of Muhammad, and his alleged sayings etc were collected in next centuries. Now much of this is obviously not really coming from Muhammad, but it's another topic.
The actions of Muhammad are then analised by Muslim jurists to provide examples to follow for any questions concerning private or political life of Muslims.
So actually I believe Muhammad has much more influence on a life of a Muslim than Jesus on a life of Christian, simply because we have uncomparably more information - true and not so true - about his actions, convictions etc.
Jesus is for most Christians a source of the basic ethical values, and - through the story of salvation - their Saviour.
But he's not the authority on details. The Church and other churches can give precise directions for behaviour, but they have not the same status as shari'a, especially today.
The specific orders of Christ are so few that in fact they are ignored.
Say, Jesus says precisely that divorce is not allowed, unless in a case of betrayal - yet somehow RCC would like to ban it altogether, and protestants, at least in USA, seem not to have problems with that.
Because the Church fills the vaccuum with Nature, Old Testament bits, opinions of some saints, etc...
While Muslims have thousands of alleged sayings or actions of Muhammad, that - directly or by analogy etc - can direct them in every aspect of life.

Again, IMHO this is more of a theological issue, its implications to today's reality may not be so significant if other breeding ground situations were not in place.

It has very practical implications. Majority of Muslim countries reformed their legal systems... and were secularising. This thread was stopped by several issues. First of all, Palestinian conflict. Secondly, the oil. It's a great tragedy I guess that oil happened to be in Arabia, in the - before - most backward and conservative parts of the Muslim world, that - additionally - were under the rule of wahhabis, who were acting in XIX century just like ISIS acts today... The oil - especially after the oil embargo, prompted by the Israeli issue - provided those ultraconservatives in money they needed to promote their obscurantism, while the communism threat made them lesser evil for the West. So I guess it could've been better. I can not say that there would be no conservative resurgence anyway, but I think much less.
But waking the sleeping giant, and his existence itself are two matters. The ideological grounds existed earlier on...
But without the oil funding... without the hatred fueled by Israel-Arab conflict... perhaps radical islam would not be so appealing.

so?

You're basically trying to claim that the entirety of the Soviet experience was atheist. At least, that's how it sounds to me.

quick question: Does Saddam Hussein get included in any criticism of Islam? or the evils committed by Muslim countries?

Of course he doesn't. Saddam Hussein is sort of Putin. The Russian Orthodox Church may support him, he may use ROCh for his purposes, but he has his own agenda.

[Sava]

Seems like the standards for what isn't Christian are a lot lower than what doesn't constitute Islam.

Conveniently

[Sava]

Hey but at the end of the day, you guys can live with yourselves and that's all that matters. Personally, the attitude makes me sick.

This does not apply everyone equally, of course. Heresson, I think we could eventually discuss this to a reasonable agreement.

Felch, you just sound like an angry fool looking disenfranchise an entire group of people based on religion. And to add to the hypocrisy, you tried to claim you are on the side of religious freedom.

Absolute bull**** IMO

[Kidlicious]

Seems like the standards for what isn't Christian are a lot lower than what doesn't constitute Islam.

Conveniently

The standard for Christians is extremely high. Hitler does not even come close to qualifying as a Christian. I suppose he could easily qualify as an atheist though.

[Sava]

Also, I'm in a bad mood because I had serious chafing in my ass crack from not showering after my workout. I felt dry and changed clothes, seemed like enough. It was not. I had to shave around my *******. I was squatting above a mirror. Because of the irritation, the skin got cut easily. I was dripping blood.

There's no ambient pain, but walking sucks. I slathered the area with neosporin

[Sava]

I wouldn't wish this on any of you

[ZEE]

Hey Sava Uranus is Bleeding!

[Sava]

The standard for Christians is extremely high. Hitler does not even come close to qualifying as a Christian. I suppose he could easily qualify as an atheist though.

cool story

[Berzerker]

The standard for Christians is extremely high. Hitler does not even come close to qualifying as a Christian. I suppose he could easily qualify as an atheist though.

was Germany Christian?

[Felch]

Felch, you just sound like an angry fool looking disenfranchise an entire group of people based on religion. And to add to the hypocrisy, you tried to claim you are on the side of religious freedom.

Absolute bull**** IMO

You sound like a chump who's slowly realizing that he's taken a completely retarded position in an argument.

Don't be mad just because I'm smarter than you. I can't help it.

[Felch]

was Germany Christian?

Was Nietzsche Christian?

[Sava]

You sound like a chump who's slowly realizing that he's taken a completely retarded position in an argument.

YEAH TOTTALLY

I REGRET NOT ADVOCATING MASS DISCRIMINTION ON MOOSLIMS

[Lorizael]

Islam rejects a key personal freedom (religious freedom), and it is therefore wrong and deserves condemnation.

This is a pretty weird opinion for a worshiper of a monotheistic deity to have. It suggests you believe morality precedes God rather than proceeds from God. If that's the case, then you don't believe your God is omnipotent. That at least allows you to circumvent theodicy, but it also makes you a heretic.

[Sava]

theodicy

more like

theoidiocy

[Sava]

theoidiocy

for fans of the cosby/rapist show